[00:00:01]
EVENING.UH, I, MY BRAIN IS TOTALLY BLINKING RIGHT NOW.
I WOULD LIKE TO CALL THIS REGULAR, UH, SCHEDULED MEETING OF THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION TO ORDER THE TIME IS 6:30 PM ON APRIL 14TH.
UH, MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL, PLEASE? COPELAND? HERE.
RICHARD, CAN YOU HEAR US ON ONLINE? I WONDER? UH, WE MIGHT BE MUTED.
THIS IS, ARE WE MUTED ON HILDRETH? I'M READY.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO EXTEND A WELCOME TO OUR NEW COMMISSIONER WHO'S JOINING US VIRTUALLY TODAY.
THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE AND, UH, LOOKING FORWARD TO WORKING WITH YOU.
[II) Approval of Minutes]
OUR AGENDA IS APPROVAL OF MINUTES.SO CONSIDER APPROVAL OF THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION'S FEBRUARY 24TH, 2026.
AND SECOND ON THIS MADAM CHAIR, MOTION TO APPROVE THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION.
WE HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE FROM COMMISSIONER COPELAND AND A SECOND FROM VICE CHAIR STEGEL.
IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE.
NEXT STEP IS OUR CITIZEN COMMENT PERIOD.
THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION WELCOMES COMMENTS FROM CITIZENS EARLY IN THE AGENDA OF REGULAR MEETINGS.
SPEAKERS ARE PROVIDED WITH AN OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK DURING THIS TIME PERIOD ON ANY AGENDA ITEM OR ANY OTHER MATTER CONCERNING CITY BUSINESS, AND THEY MUST OBSERVE THE THREE MINUTE TIME LIMIT.
SO, AT THIS TIME, I WILL OPEN CITIZEN COMMENTS AND SEEING NONE.
SOMEONE'S WALKING INTO THE BUILDING.
I'M JUST GONNA GIVE IT A MINUTE.
SEEING NONE, WE WILL KEEP MOVING.
[2) Consider and make a recommendation to the City Council regarding a request by John Hall for exceptions from Chapter 41 (Subdivisions) of the City’s Code of Ordinances related to detention, drainage, flood mitigation, and sidewalks for the property located at 200 Veteran’s Drive, Kyle, Texas 78640 (VR-26-0015). The requested exceptions include: An exception from Sec. 41-140 (Watershed and Flood Prevention) to waive requirements for a detention pond and trickle channel. An exception from Sec. 41-134 (General Requirements) to allow alternative culvert specifications. An exception from Sec. 41-143(a)(1) (Sidewalks) to: eliminate installation of new sidewalks along Veterans Drive; eliminate sidewalks along Barbee Street (from Woods Street to Veterans Drive); waive sidewalk crossings over drainage ditches; and reduce the minimum sidewalk width from five (5) feet to four (4) feet. ]
UP, WE HAVE OUR CONSIDER IMPOSSIBLE ACTION ITEMS. SO, FIRST IS CONSIDER AND MAKE RECOMMENDATION TO THE CITY COUNCIL REGARDING A REQUEST BY JOHN HALL, FOR EXCEPTIONS FROM CHAPTER 41, SUBDIVISIONS OF THE CITY'S CODE OF ORDINANCES RELATED TO DETENTION, DRAINAGE, FLOOD MITIGATION, AND SIDEWALKS FOR THE PROPERTY LOCATED AT 200 VETERANS DRIVE, KYLE, TEXAS 7, 8 6.THIS 2015, THE REQUESTED EXCEPTIONS INCLUDE ONE, AN EXCEPTION FROM SECTION 41 DASH FOUR, WATERSHED AND FLOOD PREVENTION TO WAVE REQUIREMENTS FOR A DETENTION POND AND TRICKLE CHANNEL TWO, AN EXCEPTION FROM SECTION 41 DASH 1 34.
GENERAL REQUIREMENTS TO ALLOW ALTERNATIVE CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS.
THREE, AN EXCEPTION FROM SECTION 41 DASH 1 43 A ONE SIDEWALKS TO ELIMINATE INSTALLATION OF NEW SIDEWALKS ALONG VETERANS DRIVE, ELIMINATE SIDEWALKS ALONG BARBIE STREET FROM WOOD STREET TO VETERANS DRIVE, WAVE SIDEWALK CROSSINGS OVER DRAINAGE DITCHES, AND REDUCE THE MINIMUM SIDEWALK WIDTH FROM FIVE FEET TO FOUR FEET.
GOOD EVENING, CHAIRMAN, COMMISSIONERS.
UM, SO TONIGHT, UM, HAVE A COUPLE OF VARIANCES FOR YOU.
UM, I'M GONNA LET THE, UH, PRESENTATION GET LOADED UP.
UM, THAT WAY IT'LL GIVE ME A REFERENCE POINT.
UM, THERE'S QUITE A FEW ITEMS TO GO THROUGH.
UM, SO TONIGHT WE WILL DO THIS A LITTLE BIT, UH, DIFFERENTLY.
UM, BECAUSE THERE ARE SO MANY REQUESTS, UH, I WOULD LIKE TO GO THROUGH MY ENTIRE PRESENTATION, UM, KIND OF RECOMMENDATIONS, AND THEN WE WILL CIRCLE BACK AND VISIT EACH ONE OF THOSE REQUESTS INDIVIDUALLY.
UM, IT'LL BE AT THAT POINT ON EACH ONE OF THOSE ITEMS THAT, THAT MR. HALL CAN COME AND PRESENT HIS FINDINGS.
UM, AND THEN ONCE WE KIND OF DO THAT, WE WILL GO THROUGH AND MAKE OUR MOTIONS.
UH, WE WOULD LIKE REQUEST THAT WE DO SEPARATE MOTIONS FOR EACH ITEM, UM, JUST AS A LITTLE CLEANER AND EASIER FOR STAFF TO GET THOSE MINUTES, UH, FORWARDED ON TO COUNSEL.
SO, UH, AGAIN, UM, I'M GONNA TALK FAST.
THERE'S A LOT OF INFORMATION, SO WE JUST HOLD QUESTIONS TILL THE END.
UM, THAT WOULD BE APPRECIATED.
SO, UH, PROPERTY LOCATION, UM, VETERANS DRIVE, BLANCO AND BARBIE STREET.
UM, SO THIS, THIS TRIANGLE, AGAIN, THE APPLICANT IS CONSTRUCTED APPROXIMATELY 1500 SQUARE FOOT PROFESSIONAL OFFICE.
UM, PLANNING ZONING COMMISSION DID REVIEW A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, UH, FOR THIS, UH, UH, AS
[00:05:01]
IT'S IN THE VETERAN'S DRIVE OVERLAY DISTRICT.UM, THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING SEVERAL EXCEPTIONS FROM CITY CODE, UH, FROM THE CITY SUBDIVISION ORDINANCE.
UM, WE DID NOT REQUE, UH, RECEIVE DOCUMENTATION AT THE TIME OF SUB PACKET SUBMITTAL, BUT MR. HALL HAS PROVIDED YOU SOME COMMENTS AND SOME INFORMATION TONIGHT.
UM, AND THEN HE'LL GO THROUGH THOSE AND HE'LL, YOU'LL HAVE A CHANCE TO ANSWER, UH, ASK HIM SOME QUESTIONS.
UM, SO WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS, UM, SEVERAL REQUESTED VARIANCES, UM, AN EXCEPTION FROM SECTION 41 40 WATERSHED AND FLOODPLAIN PREVENTION, UM, TO GRAVE REQUIREMENTS FOR REQUIRED DETENTION, POND AND TRICKLE CHANNEL.
UM, WE'RE LOOKING AT EXCEPTION FROM SECTION 41 DASH 1 34 GENERAL REQUIREMENTS, UH, TO ALLOW ALTERNATIVE CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS.
UH, WE'RE ALSO LOOKING AT EXCEPTION FROM SECTION 41 DASH 1 43.
UM, THIS IS REGARDING SIDEWALKS.
UH, THERE'S FOUR SEPARATE DISTINCT, UH, ITEMS THERE.
ELIMINATE NEW SIDEWALKS ALONG VETERANS, UH, ELIMINATE SIDEWALKS ALONG BARBIE STREET FROM WOODS TO VETERANS.
WAVE THE SIDEWALK CROSSING REQUIREMENTS OVER THOSE DRAINAGE DISTRICT DITCHES, AND THEN REDUCE THE MINIMUM SIDEWALK WIDTH FROM FOUR FEET TO FIVE FEET.
UM, SO WHAT I'VE DONE IS KIND OF BROKEN THESE DOWN INTO THREE MAIN REQUESTS, UH, UH, REQUESTS.
AND SO WE'LL TACKLE 'EM THAT WAY BASED ON THE SECTION OF CODE.
UM, SO THE REQUEST NUMBER ONE IS WAIVER OF REQUIREMENTS OF A DETENTION POND AND TRICKLE CHANNEL.
AGAIN, CITY CODE, STATE LAW REQUIRE PROPERTIES TO MITIGATE ANY ADDITIONAL IMPERVIOUS COVER OR RUNOFF ASSOCIATED WITH THEIR DEVELOPMENT.
THERE'S MULTIPLE WAYS THEY CAN DO THAT.
UM, UH, THAT SECTION 41 10 OUTLINE STANDARDS AND SPECIFICATIONS, UM, THAT MAY BE USED TO MEET THESE REQUIREMENTS.
UM, AND THEN IN THIS CASE, UH, THE TRICKLE CHANNELS AND DETENTION PONDS ARE REQUIRED FOR FLOOD MITIGATION BASED ON CURRENT CITY CODE.
SO WHEN WE LOOK AT REQUEST ONE A, UM, DETENTION PONDS, UM, THEY ARE NOT ALWAYS REQUIRED.
AS I MENTIONED, THERE ARE, UH, OTHER OPTIONS TO, TO KIND OF MEET STATE REQUIREMENTS TO HANDLE RUNOFF.
UM, DOS CAN BE DONE THROUGH THINGS SUCH AS LOW IMPACT DEVELOPMENT OR LID.
UM, SOME OF YOU'RE FAMILIAR WITH THAT.
UM, THESE THINGS CAN BE RAIN GARDENS, BIO BIOSWELLS, OR OTHER APPROVED ENGINEERING PRACTICES.
UM, STAFF, UM, PRESENTED AVAILABLE OPTIONS TO THE APPLICANT REGARDING THOSE ALTERNATIVE COMPLIANCE OPTIONS.
UM, THE APPLICANT INDICATED TO STAFF THEY DO NOT WISH TO UTILIZE THOSE LID, UM, OPTIONS FOR THEIR OWN VARIOUS REASONS.
UM, SO HE'S ASKING TO WAIVE THE, THE POND REQUIREMENT.
UM, THERE ARE NO ALTERNATIVE OPTIONS, UM, FOR THE TRICKLE CHANNEL.
UM, UH, WHEN WE LOOK AT THAT, UM, I'M SORRY, AND I'LL GET, I'M JUMPING AHEAD OF MYSELF.
UM, SO REQUEST ONE B OF THIS SAME SECTION IS THE TRICKLE CHANNEL.
UH, TRICKLE CHANNELS ARE REQUIRED WHERE THE SLOPE OF THE PROPERTY IS VERY SHALLOW.
UM, THIS ALLOWS OR, UH, HELPS MOVE THE WATER FROM ONE AREA TO ANOTHER.
AGAIN, I'M NOT THE ENGINEER, SO WE DO HAVE STAFF ENGINEER IF YOU WANT DETAILS ON THAT.
UM, JUST, UM, KEEP YOUR QUESTIONS FROM ME, KIND OF PROCESS AND REQUIREMENTS, AND THEN I'LL TURN IT OVER TO STAFF IF WE NEED TO GET INTO DETAILS.
UM, SO THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING EXCEPTION TO WAIVE THE TRICKLE CHANNEL FOR THE PORTION OF THE PROPERTY EXTENDING FROM THE DETENTION POND AREA TO THEIR PROPOSED DRIVEWAY.
UM, CURRENTLY THERE ARE NO ALTERNATIVE COMPLIANCE OPTIONS AVAILABLE FOR THIS REQUIREMENT, SO STAFF DOES NOT SUPPORT THIS EXCEPTION.
UM, SO HERE ON THIS IMAGE IS KIND OF A BREAKDOWN OF THE FIRST, UM, REQUEST.
SO THE DETENTION POND LOCATION IS IN RED.
UM, THERE IS A PROPOSED TRICKLE CHANNEL IN GREEN.
THIS IS THE ONE THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING TO WAVE.
UM, THERE IS A SECOND TRICKLE CHANNEL TO THE SOUTH ON THIS PLAN SET, UM, HIGHLIGHTED IN BLUE.
UM, THIS WAS, UM, PROVIDED BY THE APPLICANT.
HOWEVER, THE CITY HAS UNDERTAKEN SOME ROAD IMPROVEMENT PROJECTS ON VETERANS.
UM, WE ARE CHANGING THE WAY WATER IS FLOWING ACROSS HIS PROPERTY SLIGHTLY.
UM, SO IN ORDER TO MITIGATE THAT, STAFF SUPPORTED THAT WE WOULD BUILD THAT AS A, AS A FUTURE CIP PROJECT.
WE WOULD WAIVE THAT REQUIREMENT FROM HIM SINCE WE WERE HAVING SOME EFFECT, UM, ON HIS DEVELOPMENT.
UM, GOING INTO EXCEPTION REQUEST NUMBER TWO, THIS IS APPROVAL OF ALTERNATIVE CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS.
SO OUR CODE DOES ALLOW FOR ALTERNATIVE CULVERT, PIPE SIZES, MATERIALS, UH, UM, AS LONG AS THE PROPER, UH, ENGINEERING DOCUMENTATION IS SUBMITTED, REVIEWED, AND APPROVED BY STAFF.
UM, SO STAFF DID INFORM THE APPLICANT THAT THE REQUESTED MODIFICATIONS COULD BE SUPPORTED, UM, PROVIDED THAT WE HAD UPDATED PLANS AND SUPPORTING ENGINEERING DOCUMENT, UH, DOCUMENTATION, UM, UH, THAT THESE PLANS DO NEED TO BE SUPPORTED.
UM, AT THIS TIME, THE APPLICANT, UM, HAD CONCERNS ABOUT HAVING TO REENGAGE AND ENGINEER AND UPDATING THOSE.
UM, SO THEY WOULD LIKE TO, TO WAIVE THE REQUIREMENT FOR, UM, UPDATING THAT DOCUMENTATION WOULD LIKE TO USE WHAT THEY'RE PROPOSING.
[00:10:01]
OF EXCEPTION AREA TWO.THESE ARE THE CULVERTS THAT YOU'LL SEE CONNECT ACROSS OR UNDERNEATH THE DRIVEWAY.
UM, THAT IS THAT LOCATION THERE.
AND THEN THE EXCEPTION REQUEST THREE.
UM, THERE'S ACTUALLY FOUR OF THESE.
WELL, I'LL TOUCH BASE ON ALL OF THEM.
UM, STARTING WITH REQUEST THREE A.
UM, SO HIS, THE REQUEST IS TO ELIMINATE NEW SIDEWALK ALONG VETERANS DRIVE.
I DO WANNA POINT OUT THAT THERE IS AN EXISTING SIDEWALK THERE.
UM, IT JUST DOES NOT MEET OUR MINIMUM, UH, SIDEWALK WIDTH, UH, REQUIREMENTS.
UM, WE REQUIRE FIVE FOOT SIDEWALKS ALONG ALL PROPERTY BOUNDARIES.
UM, STAFF DID WORK WITH THE APPLICANT AS PART OF THEIR SITE DEVELOPMENT REVIEW AND AGREED TO NOT REQUIRE THAT SIDEWALK TO BE RIPPED UP AND REPLACED.
UM, AND THEN, UM, THIS GROUP APPROVED THAT SIDEWALK KIND OF DEVIATION AS PART OF THEIR CUP.
UH, BUT STAFF WANTED TO BRING THIS FORWARD TODAY JUST AS PART OF THESE OTHER VARIANCES.
LET'S JUST GO AHEAD AND, AND RUN THAT THROUGH, THROUGH THE PROCESS.
UM, SO THIS IS SOMETHING WE, WE CAN SUPPORT TO MAINTAIN THE EXISTING SIDEWALK, UM, IN THE AREA.
UH, EXCEPTION THREE B IS TO ELIMINATE SIDEWALKS ALONG BARBIE STREET FROM WOOD STREET TO VETERANS DRIVE.
SO AS PART OF OUR ROADWAY IMPROVEMENTS ALONG VETERANS, THIS SMALL SECTION OF ROAD THAT KIND OF COMES ALONG BARBIE BEHIND MR. HALL'S PROPERTY AND THEN CONNECTS, UM, AT THE INTERSECTION, UM, RIGHT WHERE THE RESTAURANT KIND OF, UH, BACK PARKING LOT IS, THAT ROAD IS ACTUALLY GONNA BE A ABANDONED, UM, WE'RE NOT GONNA CONNECT THAT THROUGH.
SO THAT DRIVEWAY WILL NOW CONNECT STRAIGHT TO VETERANS.
UM, SO STAFF CAN SUPPORT THE, THE WAIVER OF SIDEWALKS ON THAT PORTION OF MR. HALL'S PROPERTY.
UM, AND AGAIN, I'LL HAVE A MAP, WE'LL, WE'LL GO THROUGH THAT, UM, HERE IN A SECOND, UH, EXCEPTION REQUEST THREE C, UM, WAS TO WAIVE SIDEWALK REQUIREMENT CROSSINGS OVER THE DRAINAGE DITCHES.
UM, SO AGAIN, MR. HALL IS A, A TRIANGULAR PROPERTY.
UM, IT'S ALL OPEN DITCH DRAINAGE ON EACH SIDE.
SO TO, TO CROSS THE SIDEWALKS AND CONNECT, YOU HAVE TO, TO DO A SMALL PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE, IN ESSENCE, ACROSS THOSE AREAS.
UM, WHEN WE LOOKED AT THIS, UH, BECAUSE IT'S A CONNECTION FOR SIDEWALKS, UM, STAFF CANNOT, YOU KNOW, SUPPORT THAT.
UM, P PEDESTRIANS CONNECTIVITY IS, IS AN ISSUE FOR US.
UM, CREATING GAPS, UM, COULD BE AN ISSUE AS WELL.
UM, STAFF DID WANT TO HIGHLIGHT THAT KYLE ELEMENTARY SCHOOL HAS DISCONTINUED, UH, BUS SERVICE TO HOMETOWN KYLE AND SURROUNDING AREAS AS PART OF THEIR, AS PART OF THEIR BUDGET MAKEUP.
UM, SO, UM, WE, WE ARE SEEING AN INCREASED AMOUNT OF PEDESTRIANS KIDS COMING FROM KIND OF THE WEST SIDE OF VETERANS IN ALL THOSE RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS.
AND WE ANTICIPATE THAT THAT, UM, TRAFFIC TO, TO INCREASE.
SO AT THIS TIME, STAFF DOES, DOES NOT RECOMMEND OR SUPPORT, UM, THIS WAIVER EXCEPTION.
AND THEN THE FINAL ONE IS TO REDUCE THE MINIMUM SIDEWALK WIDTHS FROM FIVE FEET TO FOUR FEET.
AGAIN, MINIMUM SIDEWALK WIDTH IS FIVE FEET FROM CITY CODE.
UM, AGAIN, WE HAVE A INCREASE OF PEDESTRIAN ACTIVITY.
UM, ADDITIONALLY REDUCING A SIDEWALK WIDTH MAY NECESSITATE THE INSTALLATION OF PASSING AREAS AT REGULAR INTERVALS.
SO, UM, TOSS HAS SOME LANGUAGE IN THERE THAT AT SO MANY INTERVALS OF FEET, YOU HAVE TO CREATE A PASSING LANE WHERE TWO WHEELCHAIRS COULD SAFELY PASS, UM, BASED ON THE MINIMUM KIND OF SIZE FOR PASSING AND CLEARANCE.
UM, STAFF AGAIN, DOES NOT RECOMMEND A WAIVER OF THIS EXCEPTION BECAUSE THIS IS OUR STANDARD AND WE DON'T FIND A, A HARDSHIP, UM, ON THIS ONE.
SO WHEN WE LOOKED AT THE EXCEPTION REQUEST NUMBER THREE, UM, AGAIN, THIS IS KIND OF THE LAYOUT.
THE RED AREAS ON THIS IMAGE HERE WOULD BE SIDEWALKS THAT WOULD HAVE THE REDUCTION FROM FIVE TO FOUR, THE GREEN AREAS, THE EXISTING SIDEWALK, THAT THAT WOULD REMAIN, THAT STAFF SUPPORTS, UM, NOT HAVING TO RIP UP, UH, EXISTING INFRASTRUCTURE.
THE ORANGE SECTION TO THE SOUTH IS THE SECTION ALONG THE ROADWAY THAT, THAT, THAT ROAD IS ACTUALLY GOING TO BE CLOSED.
UM, SO WE WOULD SUPPORT THE WAIVER OF THAT AREA.
AND THEN THE LIGHT BLUE OR THE SIDEWALK, UH, KIND OF PEDESTRIAN CROSSINGS.
UM, SO YOU CAN SEE CONNECTING, UH, THE VETERANS DRIVE OVER TO THE BLANCO, UM, SECTION, AND THEN IT WOULD CROSS BACK OVER.
UM, AND THEN AGAIN, ONCE THE GAPS DOWN THE ROAD WOULD HAVE TO BE FUTURE CIP, UM, PROJECTS, OR IF THOSE PROPERTIES REDEVELOPED, UM, AS AT ANY POINT IN THE FUTURE THAT WOULD TRIGGER.
UM, SO AGAIN, I HAVE MY RECOMMENDATIONS.
I'LL GO THROUGH THOSE, UM, YOU KNOW, SHORTLY AFTER WE KIND OF GET INTO THE, UM, UM, THE REQUESTS.
UH, BUT I'D LIKE TO GIVE MR. HALL AN OPPORTUNITY TO KIND OF COME BACK.
UM, CAN YOU HEAR ME, SIR? ONE SECOND.
[00:15:05]
TEST ONE.UM, SO I WILL KICK BACK TO THE VERY FIRST SET OF REQUESTS.
UH, I'LL LEAVE IT UP ON THE, ON KIND OF ONE OF THESE IMAGES.
IF, IF Y'ALL LIKE, JUST LET ME KNOW.
UM, BUT I'M GONNA TURN IT OVER TO MR. HALL.
UM, YOU CAN ASK HIM QUESTIONS AGAIN, IF IT'S VERY SPECIFIC TECHNICAL.
UM, LEON BARBS INTO ENGINEERS HERE.
UM, IF YOU WANNA, YOU KNOW, GET INTO THOSE DETAILS MORE THAN WELCOME, UM, IF IT'S GENERAL PROCESS OR REASONING, UM, EITHER SUBDIVISION OR SITE PLAN OR DEVELOPMENT, PLEASE ADDRESS THOSE TO ME.
SO, MR. HALL, I'LL GIVE YOU THE FLOOR.
SIR, WOULD YOU MIND LEAVING THE SCREEN ON THE MAP? YES, SIR.
UH, TO THE WIZARDS IN THE BACK, UM, IF YOU COULD HELP ME, UM, MOVE TO, I GUESS, THIS LAST IMAGE THAT SHOWS ALL THE SIDEWALKS, UM, REQUEST D, YET THIS ONE MAY WORK FOR THANK YOU.
AND, UH, BASICALLY WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS DEVELOP A SMALL, IRREGULAR, HIGHLY IRREGULAR LOT THAT FOR YEARS WAS, UH, LANGUISHING HERE IN THE COMMUNITY, AND WE TOOK OVER THAT LOT, UH, CLEARING IT.
UH, ONE OF THE THINGS I FOUND, YOU'LL FIND THIS IN YOUR HANDOUT, WE FOUND THAT THERE WAS LIKE A, A HOLLOWED OUT PLACE WHERE, WHERE YOUNG PEOPLE WERE DRINKING BEER AND, AND HUFFING, UH, PAINT AND GLUE AND, AND OTHER DRUG PARAPHERNALIA.
AND I THINK WE'VE DONE A FAIRLY GOOD JOB ON IT.
UH, PLEASED TO, TO BE ABLE TO, TO WORK IN THIS AREA AND UPON THESE THINGS.
UH, THIS IS THE, UH, BARBIE SIDE OF THE, THE PROPERTY BARBIE STREET SIDE OF THE PROPERTY.
AND, UH, HERE'S THE DITCH THAT HAS BECOME QUITE THE CENTER OF SO MUCH CONTROVERSY.
THIS IS A GENTLE, FRIENDLY, ALMOST NOT A DITCH.
WHEN WE PURCHASED THIS PROPERTY, WE LOOKED AT THAT AND SAID, OH, THAT'S NO BIG DEAL.
THAT'S, UH, THAT'S, UH, GENTLE, FRIENDLY PIECE OF LAND THAT WE CAN EASILY PUT IN, A SIMPLE DRIVE IN AS SO MANY HAVE BEEN DONE ALONG CENTER STREET AND THROUGHOUT THE COMMUNITY.
UH, JUST A, A NICE LITTLE PLACE TO PUT A NICE LITTLE OFFICE.
AND, UH, BY THE TIME THE CITY WORKED WITH OUR ENGINEERS, IT TURNED INTO THIS SITUATION, WHICH BASICALLY INDICATES THE WHOLE DITCH IS TO BE DUG UP AND REPLACED WITH CONCRETE REINFORCED CONCRETE PIPE AND, AND, UH, ALL KINDS OF PARAPHERNALIA THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT PROBABLY THAT NATURAL TO, TO DIG UP A NICE, NICE LITTLE AREA AND, AND PUT, UH, THIS RCP REINFORCED CONCRETE PIPE, WHICH IS PRETTY UNUSUAL BECAUSE OUR PROPERTY IS FED BY TWO STEEL PIPES FROM THE CITY, BOTH COMING FROM, UH, UNDER ONE 50, WHICH IS VETERANS DRIVE.
AND THEY'RE, THEY'RE STEEL PIPES AND THEY'RE SMALLER THAN THE PIPES THAT WE PLAN TO PUT IN.
AND SO THERE SHOULD NEVER BE ANY KIND OF A DRAINAGE PROBLEM.
THE, UH, REINFORCED CONCRETE PIPE, VERY DANGEROUS TO HANDLE, VERY HARD TO MAINTAIN, VERY HARD TO, TO PUT INTO PLACE, AND IT DOESN'T REALLY LOOK THAT GOOD AFTER A LITTLE BIT OF USE.
AND I HAVE SOME PICTURES HERE SOMEHOW.
RCP REINFORCED CONCRETE PIPE HERE IS A SECTION THAT APPARENTLY THE WATER GOT INTO IT AND ERODED IT FROM THE BOTTOM, AIDED IT OUT, DISSOLVED THE ASPHALT ON TOP.
I'M KIND OF NONPLUS OF WHY THE CITY IS TAKING SUCH AN ADVERSE REACTION TO USING A STEEL PIPE, BECAUSE THIS IS PIPE.
I TOOK THESE PICTURES JANUARY 20, PARDON ME, JANUARY 29TH, 2026, AND JANUARY 28TH, 2026 ALONG VETERANS DRIVE WITHIN WALKING DISTANCE OF OUR PROJECT.
IT'S, IT'S VERY COMMON APPLICATION.
SO THERE'S NO REASON WE SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO USE STEEL PIPE THERE.
THE CITY HAS A, A LONG USE OF STEEL PIPE AND IT'S, THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH IT.
AND, UH, AS OPPOSED TO HAVING THE JUNK THAT I JUST SHOWED YOU, I MUCH PREFER TO PUT THAT IN PLACE.
SO WE ARE ASKING THAT, UH, WE BE ABLE TO USE A STEEL PIPE.
[00:20:01]
THE PIPE THAT DRAINS INTO BARBIE, IT'S AN 18 INCH STEEL PIPE COMING UNDER ONE 50, AND WE PROPOSE TO HAVE TWO EIGHT INCH STEEL PIPES TO DRAIN THE DITCH.AND I HAVE GIVEN ALL OF THE, THE MATH WORK TO, UH, TO THE CITY, AND I DO NOT SEE THAT THERE'S ANY NEED IN DEPLOYING AN ENGINEER TO, TO, TO STAMP THAT.
I THINK IT STANDS COMMON SENSE THAT TWO 18 INCH PIPES CAN HANDLE ONE 18 INCH PIPE.
I DON'T THINK THAT NEEDS ANY ENGINEERING WORK.
I BEG THE CITY TO ALLOW ME THAT VARIANCE ON THE RETENTION POND.
THERE IS NOT A RETENTION POND FOR THIS BUILDING.
THERE IS NOT A RETENTION POND FOR THE GIGANTIC IMPERVIOUS PARKING LOT THAT THE CITY BUILT NEXT DOOR.
THERE'S NOT A RETENTION POND FOR THE POST OFFICE.
MUTTS AND PUFFS ON AND ON AND OFF.
PUTTING A RETENTION POND IN IN OUR PROPERTY, I FEEL IS A, IS A PUBLIC NUISANCE BECAUSE IT CAN STAND FOR A PLACE FOR CHILDREN TO GET IN AND DROWN, AS BEEN TALKED ABOUT, ON AND ON.
THERE ARE A STOOL OF KIDS WALKING BY HERE ALL THE TIME.
IF IT DOES STILL OUT OF WATER, IT BECOMES AN ATTRACTIVE NUISANCE FOR SOME CHILD OF DROWNING.
AS IT DRAINS OUT, THE RETENTION OF THE MOISTURE WILL CREATE BUGS AND DISEASE AND OTHER HAZARDS.
SO I THINK IT'S JUST A REALLY BAD IDEA TO PUT ONE IN.
AND I, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU TALK TO THE CITY, THEY'RE ALWAYS GONNA SAY IT'S A LAW.
YEAH, MAYBE SO, MAYBE, NO, I DON'T REALLY THINK IT IS.
I'VE BEEN A MEMBER OF THE BAR FOR 39 YEARS, TEXAS BAR, BEEN A MEMBER OF THE FEDERAL BAR FOR ALMOST AS LONG.
I'VE JUST NOT REALLY RUN ACROSS THAT.
AND I KNOW IF YOU DRIVE AROUND THROUGH MOUNTAIN CITY OAKS, MOUNTAIN CITY, YOU WON'T FIND A SINGLE RETENTION POND IN THERE, THE WHOLE CITY.
SO ACCORDING TO STAFF LEGEND OR STAFF, WHATEVER, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THEY SHOULD ALL BE IMPRISONED FOR BREAKING THIS DRAINAGE LAW.
UH, THE EFFICACY OF THESE BONDS, THAT'S A MATTER OF DEBATE.
IN 1998, THERE WAS SUPERINTENDENT SCHOOLS IN CUERO, TEXAS.
WE HAD A FLOOD THAT COVERED ABOUT A THIRD OF THE CITY RETENTION POTS DIDN'T DO ANY GOOD THIS PAST CHECK, UH, JULY 4TH, I HAVE PROPERTY IN HUNT TEXAS, UH, RIVERFRONT PROPERTY.
AND I CAN TELL YOU RETENTION PONDS DIDN'T DO ANY GOOD DOWN THERE.
2020, UH, 2017 HERE IN KYLE, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU REMEMBER THIS, BUT FROM EAST ONE 50, ALL ALONG TOWARDS WEST ONE 50, ALL OF THESE RETENTION PONDS THAT RUN UP ON ONE 50, THEY ALL BURST LOOSE.
SO IF THERE'S A BIG RAIN, IT DOESN'T DO ANY GOOD.
IF IT'S A SMALL RAIN, IT REALLY DOESN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE.
SO I'M ASKING YOU NOT TO MAKE MY PROJECT BE UL AND MADE A POINT OF DANGER BY HAVING A RETENTION PLATFORM.
I'M ASKING TO LET ME USE, LET US USE PIPES AND STEEL PIPES THAT ARE WIDELY USED IN THIS COMMUNITY, WIDELY USED.
AND NOT JUST A LONG TIME AGO, JUST JANUARY, I SHOWED YOU JANUARY, 2026 PICTURE.
SO COMING TO YOU IN GOOD FAITH, WE'VE BEEN WORKING HARD TO DO A GOOD JOB HERE.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'VE, I HAVEN'T SEEN THOSE IN THE BUILDING.
BUILDING IS COMPLETE AND IT LOOKS NICE.
WE COME TO THIS COMMUNITY NOT TO BE SOME KIND OF, WE COME HERE TO TRY TO, UH, HELP PEOPLE TO STAY PLANNING WITH EVERYDAY LEGAL, LEGAL NEEDS.
I'M NOT TRYING TO PUT SOMETHING OVER CITY.
JUST TRYING TO ASK FOR A LITTLE BRANCH OF HELP.
JUST A LITTLE BIT OF HOW I POWER HERE.
UM, I'LL GO AHEAD AND I CAN GO THROUGH KIND OF MY RECOMMENDATION OR DID Y'ALL HAVE SOME QUESTIONS YOU WANT TO ASK BEFORE I GO THROUGH THAT? I'LL, I'LL KIND OF LEAVE THAT UP TO YOU IF YOU'D MADAM CHAIR, KNOWING THAT MR. HALS IS GONNA PACK IT OVER TO US, COULD WE HAVE FIVE MINUTES JUST TO READ IT OVER TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE KNOWLEDGE TO ASK QUESTIONS ON? I'M COMFORTABLE WITH THAT.
HOW DOES THAT WORK? DO I NEED TO LIKE, PUT A HOLD ON THE MEETING OR CAN WE JUST SIT HERE IN SILENCE FOR FIVE MINUTES? OR E EITHER WAY.
UM, IT MIGHT BE BEHOOVE TO HAVE A RECESS.
RECESS AND GIVE EVERYBODY A LITTLE TIME ON THEIR OWN.
UM, DID WE GET THAT PACKET DIGITALLY? I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT RICHARD ON THE SCREEN GOT IT AS WELL.
[00:25:01]
I DID NOT GET THE, THE, THE UPDATED PACKET.UH, I ALSO, I DO HAVE ONE QUESTION ON THIS.
WHAT IS THE AMOUNT OF IMPERVIOUS SERVICE OF THIS PROPERTY, UH, PRIOR TO PRIOR TO CONSTRUCTION THERE? UH, IT'S 100%.
UM, I DO NOT HAVE THE OVERALL IMPERVIOUS COVER, UH, NUMBERS ON THIS.
UH, BUT I COULD TRY AND LOOK REAL QUICK AND, AND GET YOU AN ANSWER, SIR.
OH, MR. HALL LOOKS LIKE HE'S GOT AN ANSWER.
THE REASON WHAT I, WHAT I'M, WHAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT IS THE, THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACE.
UH, I'M A FIRM BELIEVER THAT ANY DEVELOPMENT NEEDS NEEDS TO COVER ITS OWN, YOU KNOW, ANY, ANY DRAINAGE IT CREATES.
SO THE AMOUNT OF IMPER SERVICE DETENTION POND SHOULD, OR DETENTION SYSTEMS SHOULD BE AT LEAST EQUIVALENT TO THAT.
AND THAT'S, THAT IS WHAT OUR PLANS ARE REVIEWED TO.
UM, BUT IF YOU'D LIKE THE EXACT NUMBER, JUST LET ME KNOW.
AND I, I CAN TRY AND DO SOME, SOME QUICK, I CAN GIVE YOU, I I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THERE'S AN EQUIVALENT THERE.
MEANTIME, IT LOOKS LIKE KAYLA WENT TO GO SCAN THAT PACKET SO WE CAN GET IT OVER TO RICHARD.
SO IF YOU WANNA TAKE A RECESS, WE, THAT MIGHT BE A GOOD IDEA.
I'D RATHER WAIT TO DO THE RECESS UNTIL HE GETS IT.
SO I GUESS IN THE MEANTIME, UM, ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS THAT WE IMMEDIATELY WANT TO ASK, MAYBE A QUESTION ON THE PROCESS JUST TO MAKE SURE WE UNDERSTAND WHAT WE'RE TAKING A VOTE ON.
IF I READ THE ORDINANCE CORRECTLY, 41 DASH 10, WHAT WE WOULD, SHOULD THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION TONIGHT, GRANT, MR. HALL'S EXCEPTION, THAT WOULD JUST BE A RECOMMENDATION TO COUNSEL, AND COUNSEL WOULD TAKE THAT FINAL ACTION.
EVERY REQUEST TONIGHT IS RECOMMENDATION ONLY.
AND THEN SHOULD THIS COMMISSION DENY MR. HALL'S RE REQUEST, HE STILL HAS AN APPEAL OPTION TO COUNSEL AS WELL? UH, IT IS NOT A AN OFFICIAL DENIAL.
IT IS JUST RECOMMENDATION FOR DENIAL.
SO WHETHER YOU RECOMMEND APPROVAL OR DENIAL, COUNSEL ULTIMATELY HAS FINAL, FINAL APPROVAL ON THIS MATTER? YES, SIR.
ONE OTHER QUESTION I HAVE, WHAT ABOUT IS, IS IS THERE ANY PROCESS FOR, UM, A WAIVER OF PROTEST FOR ANY FUTURE DEVELOPMENT OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, IF, IF IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE TO DO SOMETHING AT ONE POINT IN, BUT FUTURE DEVELOPMENT WHEN THEY PUT IN SIDEWALKS, EVERYBODY DOES, DOES WELL SMASH? IS THERE ANYTHING, IS THERE ANY TYPE OF PROCESS FOR A WAIVER OF, UH, PROTESTS THAT COULD BE DONE IN THIS, IN ANY OF THESE? UM, YES.
UM, NOT QUITE IN THE TERMS. UM, YOU'RE UTILIZING, SIR.
WE DO HAVE SOME ALTERNATIVE PROCESSES.
SO, UM, AGAIN, ONE OF 'EM WAS, UM, FOR SIDEWALKS.
UH, THERE HAS BEEN INSTANCES WHERE, SAY A DEVELOPMENT IS COMING IN, UM, BUT THE CITY IS DOING A ROAD PROJECT SIX MONTHS DOWN THE ROAD, WE WILL ALLOW FEES IN LIEU OF, UM, FOR THOSE SIDEWALK CONSTRUCTIONS AND THEN THAT GOES INTO A FUND AND WE CAN CAN DO THOSE AT A LATER DATE.
UM, IDEALLY WE'D LIKE TO DO THAT AS PART OF THE PROJECT.
'CAUSE THOSE ARE FUTURE CIP PROJECTS AND, AND STAFF DOESN'T HAVE CONTROL OVER THOSE WHICH PROJECTS GET ASSIGNED AND FUNDED.
UM, SO IT CAN KICK THE, CAN A LITTLE BIT.
BUT THERE, THERE ARE SOME OPTIONS THERE, UM, AS WELL AS ALTERNATIVE COMPLIANCE FOR, SAY, DETENTION RUNOFF OF AND SOME OF THOSE OTHER ISSUES.
ACTUALLY ONE OTHER IDEA TOO, TO SEE IF IT, IF, I MEAN, IF THIS WOULD BE PEACEFUL, I DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO THE MAPS RIGHT NOW, SO I, I CAN'T PICTURE THIS AS WELL.
UH, WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE TO MAYBE TAKE THE DITCH THAT, UM, UH, ON THE PROPERTY THAT, UM, THE MR. HALL, UH, SAYS IS NOT REALLY A DITCH? I, WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE TO MAYBE CONVERT THAT TO A BIO SWELL? UM, I THINK IN, IN, IN THE, IN REPLACEMENT OF THE, OF THE DRAINAGE OR THE, UH, DETENTION POND, UM, I WOULD HAVE TO DEFER TO A CITY ENGINEER ON THAT ONE.
ON WHAT WOULD BE ALLOWED OR ALTERNATIVE COMPLIANCE.
UH, MR. BARBARA, DID YOU HEAR THE QUESTION? AND CAN YOU, GOOD EVENING.
ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE ONE THAT'S IN ORANGE? UH, I DON'T HAVE THE COPY OF THE MAP.
OH, THE ONE, HE WAS THE ONE HE WAS TALKING ABOUT THAT HE'S, UH, DOESN'T WANNA DO THE, THE, THE SIDEWALK, UH, GOING OVER THE, GOING OVER THE DRAINAGE.
UM, BUT I GUESS THREE C IS WHAT I HAVE WRITTEN DOWN.
WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE, HE'S SAYING THAT DITCH IS NOT REALLY A DITCH.
HE WOULD, WHAT I'M WONDERING IS, UH, IS IS IT POSSIBLE MAYBE TO IN, IN LIEU OF THE, UH, THE, THE DETENTION POND, CONVERT THAT INTO A BIO SWELL TO TO, TO BASICALLY TAKE CARE OF BOTH PROBLEMS? BOTH ISSUES? THERE'S A COUPLE OF ISSUES HERE WITH THE, UH, PARTICULAR DITCH THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT.
AND THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT, UH, WHERE IT LEAVES ONE 50
[00:30:01]
AND WHERE IT, UH, ENTERS, UH, BLANCO STREET, THERE'S A ABOUT A TWO AND A QUARTER INCH, TWO AND A HALF INCH DROP IN A HUNDRED FEET IN THIS THING.OKAY, THAT'S VERY, VERY FLAT IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT.
TWO AND A HALF INCHES IN A HUNDRED FEET, YOU CAN'T EVEN SEE THAT.
SO THAT'S THE REASON THAT WE PROPOSED THE, UH, UH, UH, DITCH THE, UH, CONCRETE VALLEY GUTTER IN THAT AREA.
UH, BIOSWELLS WE SUGGESTED TO MR. HALL THAT YOU, YOU LOOK AT BIOSWELLS, LOOK AT OTHER LID IMPROVEMENTS, BUT HE DID NOT WANT TO GO THAT ROUTE.
HE DOESN'T WANNA HIRE THE ENGINEER TO DO THAT EXTRA WORK.
SO ONE OF THE PROBLEMS WITH THE, UM, WITH THAT IS THAT, UH, IT, WHERE IF HE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE ORANGE LINE, THAT THAT'S NOT DRAINING IN THAT AREA.
HE NEEDS TO PROVIDE THAT PROTECTION WHERE EVERYTHING'S DRAINING TO THAT DITCH OVER THERE AT BARBIE AND DE BLANCO.
SO I DUNNO IF THAT HELPS OR NOT, BUT IT ANSWERS MY QUESTION.
COMMISSIONER HILDRETH, UH, CHECK YOUR EMAIL.
I THINK, UM, THE INFORMATION THAT, UH, MR. HALL PROVIDED SHOULD BE ATTACHED.
WHILE WE'RE WAITING FOR THAT TO COME THROUGH, I JUST WANNA ASK A CLARIFYING QUESTION.
ON THE IMAGE ON THE SCREEN, WE'RE SHOWING TWO DITCH CROSSINGS ON BARBIE.
I'M GONNA CALL IT LIKE CROSSING NORTH AND CROSSING SOUTH.
THE PACKET THAT I'M LOOKING AT FROM, UM, MR. HALL SAYS HE DOESN'T WANT A SECOND PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE ALONG BARBIE STREET.
SO I JUST WANNA CONFIRM, ARE WE TALKING ABOUT AN EXCEPTION FROM BOTH DITCH CROSSINGS OR ONLY FROM ONE DITCH CROSSING? 'CAUSE ON THE MAP, BOTH OF THEM ARE LABELED AS NO DITCH CROSSING.
IN MY, IN MY ORIGINAL CONVERSATIONS WITH MR. HALL, UH, THE REQUEST WE GOT IN WRITING WAS FOR ALL DITCH CROSSINGS.
SO, UM, IF HE HAS SOMETHING ELSE THAT HE'S WILLING TO DO ONE OR OR THE OTHER, THEN I, I'D LET HIM ANSWER THAT AND THEN Y'ALL CAN TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION.
FOR SOME REASON CAME THROUGH ON MY PHONE, BUT IT DID NOT COME THROUGH ON MY COMPUTER.
SO LEMME LOOK IT ON, ON THE PHONE, ON MY PHONE HERE.
JUST BEFORE WE REVIEW THE PACKET, IT WOULD BE HELPFUL, MR. HALL, TO UNDERSTAND WHAT EXACTLY IS THE SCOPE OF YOUR REQUEST HERE, JUST TO MAKE SURE IT'S CONSISTENT WITH WHAT WE'RE GOING TO BE, UH, THINKING ABOUT.
YOU KNOW, THE DITCH BELONGS TO THE CITY.
THE CITY RECEIVES AVALOR TAXES TO MAINTAIN IT.
IT RECEIVES SPECIAL DRAINAGE TAXES TO MAINTAIN IT.
IT HAS GRANTS, IT HAS ALL KINDS OF, UH, FINANCIAL OPPORTUNITIES.
UM, AND IF THE CITY WANTS TO BUILD WHATEVER BRIDGES IT WANTS, I'M ALL FOR THAT.
AND I'D LIKE TO DIRECT YOUR ATTENTION TO THE PACKAGE.
I KNOW YOU HAVEN'T HAD A GOOD CHANCE TO LOOK AT IT, BUT IF YOU LOOK AT FIGURE 15, WHICH IS ABOUT THE THIRD, THE LAST PAGE OF THE PACKET, FOURTH TO THE LAST PAGE OF THE PACKET.
THIS IS A LETTER FROM THIS LETTER FROM THE CITY, FIGURE 15 UNDERLINED.
IF THE DEVELOPER CHOOSES TO CONSTRUCT THE DETENTION OR ALTERNATIVE METHODS TO KEEP POST-DEVELOPMENT RUNOFF RATES THE SAME AS PRE-DEVELOPMENT RATES, THEN THE CITY WILL PERFORM THE IMPROVEMENTS TO THE DRAINAGE DITCH THROUGH THE CITY'S CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN.
THIS WOULD INCLUDE THE PIPE AND DRIVEWAY IMPROVEMENTS.
MY RESPONSE TO THAT WAS, OKAY, YOU DO THAT AND I WILL BUILD THE POND, I'LL BUILD THE SIDEWALKS, ET CETERA.
BUT WHEN I GAVE THEM THAT REPLY, THEY RESCINDED THAT OFFER.
AND THAT REALLY HARD FOR ME TO UNDERSTAND.
MR. HALL TO CONFIRM YOU, THERE IS A WORLD IN WHICH YOU'RE WILLING TO CONSTRUCT THE DRAINAGE POND AND SOME OF THESE CULVERTS, IS THAT CORRECT? WITH SOME HELP FROM THE CITY? YES.
AND THAT HELP, WHAT WOULD YOU WANT TO SEE FROM THE CITY TO I WOULD SIMPLY WANT TO FOLLOW WHAT THE CITY SAYS, UH, AT IN THAT LETTER THAT'S DATED, UH, FEBRUARY 19TH, 2026.
IF THE DEVELOPER CHOOSES TO CONSTRUCT THE DETENTION OR ALTERNATIVE METHODS TO KEEP POST-DEVELOPMENT RUNOFF RATES THE SAME AS PRE-DEVELOPMENT RATES, THEN THE CITY WILL PERFORM THE IMPROVEMENTS TO THE DRAINAGE DITCH TO THE CITY'S CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PLAN.
THIS WOULD INCLUDE THE PIPE AND DRIVEWAY IMPROVEMENTS.
BLACK AND WHITE IN WRITING SEEMS PRETTY PLAIN TO ME, ASSIGNED WRITING SENT BY AN AUTHORIZED OFFICIAL OF THE CITY.
AND AS I TOLD THE CITY AT THE NEXT MEETING AFTER THAT, I RECEIVED THAT LETTER.
I SAID, OKAY, I'LL BUILD THE RETENTION POND.
YOU JUST TAKE CARE OF THE DITCH AND WE'LL ALL BE HAPPY EVER
[00:35:01]
AFTER.AND SO TO CONFIRM IF WE, WE CAN FIND A SOLUTION THAT FITS THE LANGUAGE PRESENTED INSIDE THIS FEBRUARY 19TH LETTER LETTER, YOU'RE WILLING TO CONSTRUCT THE UH, YES.
AND ASSOCIATED CONSTRUCTION WITH THE CAVEAT, I DON'T THINK IT'S AS NECESSARY AS BEING PLED, BUT, AND IN ORDER TO, UH, EXTEND AN OLIVE BRANCH OF GOOD FAITH, YEAH, I'LL DO THAT.
I JUST WANT THE CITY TO DO WHAT THE CITY SAID IT WOULD DO.
MR. LEWIS, COMMISSIONER ALKIN, BEFORE WE MOVE ON, DID YOU GET YOUR QUESTION ANSWERED ABOUT CLARIFICATION ON WHICH ONE OF THESE DITCHES IS REQUEST OR SIDEWALKS IS REQUESTED TO BE WAIVED? BECAUSE I'M STILL NOT CLEAR ON THAT EITHER.
THANK YOU FOR FOLLOWING UP ON THAT.
I, I'M NOT CLEAR ON HOW FIGURE 15 ADDRESSES THE, UM, THE MATTER OF WHICH PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE ON BARBIE STREET OR EITHER.
WELL, IT ADDRESSES IT BECAUSE IF THE DITCH, THE BRIDGES ARE OVER THE DITCH.
SO IF THEY WILL DO WHAT THEY SAID AND, AND DO ALL THE DITCH IMPROVEMENTS, I'LL DO THE OTHER PRETTY PLAIN.
AND AS FAR AS THE SIDEWALK, I THINK WE'RE MAKING, LOOK, EXCUSE ME, I DON'T MEAN TO STEP ON ANY TOES.
I THINK WE'RE MAKING A LITTLE BIT BIGGER DEAL OUTTA SIDEWALKS THAN NECESSARY.
WE'RE WILLING TO BUILD THE SIDEWALKS AS AGREED WITH THE CITY AND MAKE 'EM TO AADA A, UH, STANDARDS FOUR FOOT WIDE, UH, WITH, UH, FIVE FOOT TURNAROUNDS AS NEEDED, BUT WILLING TO DO THAT.
SO, YOU KNOW, THEY WANT TO GO FIVE FOOT WIDE.
I'LL BUILD 'EM FIVE FOOT WIDE.
I'LL BUILD THE, UH, POND IF THEY WILL DO THE IMPROVEMENTS IN THE DITCH WITH THE STEEL PIPE AS THEY SAID THEY WOULD.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT ANSWERS YOUR QUESTION, BUT LET'S, I DON'T THINK THE, THE SIDEWALK DEAL IS THAT BIG A DEAL ACTUALLY.
WELL, I I THINK WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS CLARIFIED THE REQUEST IN FRONT OF US, UM, RATHER THAN TRY TO RENEGOTIATE A DIFFERENT REQUEST, WE'RE JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE REQUEST IN FRONT OF US AS IT SITS RIGHT NOW.
AND I SEE THREE ON THAT MAP UP THERE ON THE SCREEN.
I SEE THREE BLUE SIDEWALKS, BUT, UH, TO CHAIRMAN OR CHAIRMAN WOMAN KINS POINT, I ONLY SEE TWO REFERENCED IN THE LETTER.
WELL, IF I MAY, AND THIS IS MY UNDERSTANDING, LET ME SHARE IT WITH YOU.
THE GREEN SIDEWALK IS A MOOT POINT.
IT'S IN PLACE, AND THE CITY I THINK, ACCEPTS IT AND I ACCEPT IT.
I THINK IT WOULD BE A RIDICULOUS WASTE TO DIG IT UP.
SO LET'S DON'T EVEN TALK ABOUT THAT.
BUT I DO SEE IT BEING USED, UH, THE SIDEWALK ALONG, UH, BLANCO STREET, WE'RE WILLING TO BUILD THAT SIDEWALK ALONG BLANCO STREET.
WE'D LIKE IT TO BE FOUR FOOT INSTEAD OF FIVE FOOT, BUT IF THE CITY WILL DO WHAT THEY SAID THEY WOULD IN THEIR LETTER, THEN WE'LL BUILD IT FIVE FOOT WIDE.
AND, UH, I BELIEVE THE CITY TOLD US THAT WE DIDN'T HAVE TO BUILD THE SOUTH SOUTHERNMOST BARBIE STREET SIDEWALK.
SO I THINK THAT'S KIND OF OFF THE TABLE TOO.
SO LET'S TRY TO GET TOGETHER ON THE, ON THE SIDEWALK DEAL.
I, MADAM CHAIR, MAYBE COULD WE GO TO THE PICTURE ON SLIDE NINE OF THE PACKET? UM, THAT WAY IT SHOWS WHERE THE CHANNELS ARE AT VERSUS THE SIDEWALKS.
I'M NOT THE ONE DRIVING THE SHIP, BUT YES, I THEY'RE WORKING ON IT.
SO JASON, A MOMENT AGO, UH, WHEN MR. HALL WAS SPEAKING ABOUT THE LETTER FROM FEBRUARY 19TH, IT LOOKED LIKE YOU HAD, UM, A COMMENT THAT YOU WANTED TO, TO SHARE WITH US.
UM, SO THIS LETTER, UH, I WILL TELL YOU, THIS WAS A LETTER THAT WAS DRAFTED BY MYSELF, UH, IN COORDINATION WITH, UH, CITY'S ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT AND, UH, TRANSPORTATION DEPARTMENT.
UM, I WILL TELL YOU THAT CONTEXT IS KEY.
SO THERE'S TWO PIECES OF CONTEXT THAT I WANNA SHARE WITH THAT.
UM, SO MR. HALL HAS HIGHLIGHTED, UM, UH, THE STATEMENT THAT STAFF WOULD, UM, DO THESE THINGS IF HE DID THIS DETENTION POND.
UM, SO THE FIRST ISSUE IS, I WANNA CALL THE SECOND SENTENCE, THE SECOND PART OF THAT SENTENCE.
UH, I SAID, THIS ISSUE MAY REQUIRE FURTHER DISCUSSION IS THERE ARE MULTIPLE OPTIONS THAT COULD BE IMPLEMENTED EACH WITH THEIR OWN SET OF CHALLENGES.
SO AT THE TIME OF THIS DISCUSSION, STAFF HAD JUST KIND OF UNDERGONE THE REVIEW OF THE VETERANS DRIVE ROAD PROJECT.
WE HAD JUST FOUND OUT THAT WE WERE MODIFYING SOME OF THE DRAINAGE INTO THE AREA.
SO STAFF'S DISCUSSION AT THE FRONT WAS, IF HE BUILDS THE DETENTION AND WE ARE TRULY AFFECTING THAT DRAINAGE, THEN WE WOULD DO THOSE THINGS.
THE HENCE WHY WE NEED TO HAVE FURTHER DISCUSSION.
AT THE TIME OF THE WRITING OF THIS LETTER, WE DID NOT HAVE A FULL UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT THOSE MODIFICATIONS WERE TO THAT DRAINAGE DITCH.
UM, WASN'T UNTIL PRIOR TO OUR SUBSEQUENT MEETING THAT WE GOT THAT INFORMATION.
UM, WE WERE ON A CALL WITH, UH, UM, THE
[00:40:01]
CITY'S, UH, ROAD BOND ENGINEER.UM, WE FOUND THAT THE CHANGE IN WATER WAS NOT A VOLUME OR CHANNELIZATION ISSUE.
UM, SO ACTUALLY THERE'S NO INCREASE IN THE AMOUNT OF WATER THAT WE WERE PUTTING INTO THAT DITCH.
SO THAT WOULD NEGATE A CITY'S, UH, OR THE CITY'S STANCE THAT WE WOULD THEN PERFORM THOSE.
UH, AGAIN, THAT THAT WAS WRITTEN.
AND, AND, AND I, I WILL SAY THAT I, I PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE WORDED THAT BETTER.
UM, UH, BUT THAT WAS BASICALLY WE NEED TO HAVE THIS CONVERSATION.
IF WE DO THIS, IF THE CITY IS CAUSING THESE ISSUES, THEN WE WOULD DO THOSE THINGS.
SO I'VE APOLOGIZED SEVERAL TIMES FOR NOT MAKING THAT MORE CLEAR, BUT I DO HAVE TO TO STRESS.
UM, THAT WAS A REASON FOR THAT SECTION OF, OF THIS SEC SENTENCE.
UM, BUT REALLY WHAT THE CITY FOUND WHEN WE WERE DOING IS, IS WE'RE REALLY KIND OF CHANGING THE, NOT THE TOTAL WATER THAT'S MOVING ACROSS THIS PROPERTY, BUT THE PERCENTAGES.
SO BEFORE, AND I'M, I'M JUST GIVING NUMBERS, SAY IT WAS, UM, 80% IN THE PIPE AND 20% SURFACE.
NOW IT WENT TO LIKE 75% PIPE AND 25% SURFACE.
LIKE THE CHANGE WASN'T ENOUGH FOR US TO SAY, YES, THIS WOULD, WOULD MAKE US DO THOSE IMPROVEMENTS TO THAT CHANNEL, INCLUDING THE PIPE.
HAD THAT BEEN THE CASE, THEN THAT WOULD'VE BEEN WHAT THE CITY SAID, YES, WE CAUSED THIS, WHICH IS WHY WE ARE SUPPORTING THE TRICKLE CHANNEL BECAUSE OUR CHANGE ON THAT DID AFFECT THAT.
SO JUST TWO PIECES OF CONTEXT I WANTED TO SHARE WITH YOU ON THAT.
MR. LUKES, COULD I REPEAT MY UNDERSTANDING WHAT YOU JUST SAID THERE TO MAKE SURE THE SHARED UNDERSTANDING, THE PROPOSED ATTENTION POND, THE PURPOSE OF THAT IS TO OFFSET THE POTENTIAL SURFACE FLOODING FROM THE BUILDING THAT IS NOW THE IMPERVIOUS COVER COVER THAT OFFSETS THAT POSSIBLE DRAINAGE CONCERN.
THE LINE IN GREEN, THE INTENTION OF THAT IS TO HELP CONVEY THAT WATER OUT BECAUSE THIS IS A BASICALLY FLAT PIECE OF LAND.
THE WATER WOULD OTHERWISE NOT LEAVE THE PROPERTY.
IT WOULD POOL, IT WOULD RISE, IT WOULD STAY THERE.
THE ITEMS IN BLUE ARE PROPOSED BY THE CITY BECAUSE THAT IS THE PORTION THAT THE CITY HAS ASSESSED WOULD NEED TO BE OFFSET BY THE INCREASE IN STORM WATER MOVEMENT BECAUSE OF THE OTHER IMPERVIOUS COVER PLANNED BY THE CITY IN THE FUTURE.
YES, AND I WOULD, I WOULD CAVEAT NOT INCREASE, BUT JUST MODIFICATION ON HOW IT MOVED ACROSS.
WE'RE NOT INCREASING THAT, THAT FLOW.
SO WE ALL HAVE OUR PACKETS NOW.
UM, I AM GOING TO SAY THAT WE'RE GONNA GO INTO A, WHAT DO YOU THINK? FIVE MINUTES GUYS? COMMISSIONER HILDRETH.
WOULD FIVE MINUTES BE SUFFICIENT FOR YOU TO LOOK THROUGH THE DOCUMENT? YEAH, I'VE, I I'M ACTUALLY, I ACTUALLY ALMOST DONE WITH IT, SO, OH, LOOK AT YOU.
UM, SO WE'RE GONNA TAKE A FIVE MINUTE BREAK.
WE'RE GOING TO, UH, RECESS UNTIL SEVEN 18.
DO I HAVE TO BANG THE THING THAT'S MORE FUN IF YOU DO, THAT'S TRUE.
[00:48:17]
UM, IS THAT SUFFICIENT FOR EVERYBODY OR DO YOU NEED A FEW MORE MINUTES? COMFORTABLE.
YOU'RE COMFORTABLE? GOOD, GOOD, GOOD.
WE WILL, UM, KEEP MOVING FORWARD THEN.
SO I BELIEVE YOU WERE GOING TO, I DON'T KNOW, BE THERE FOR QUESTIONS OR DID YOU HAVE MORE YOU WANTED TO PRESENT TO US? UM, I KIND OF WANTED TO SEE IF Y'ALL HAD ANY QUESTIONS.
IF NOT, I CAN GO ON TO MY NEXT, UH, KIND OF, WE CAN GO THROUGH WHAT, WHAT STAFF'S RECOMMENDATIONS ARE.
IF, IF YOU DON'T HAVE ANY SPECIFIC QUESTIONS.
I THINK IT'S WONDERFUL THAT WE HAVE A VERY DIVERSE COMMISSION UP HERE, AND THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT ARE A LOT MORE ENGINEERING ORIENTED THAN I AM.
SO THIS MIGHT SOUND LIKE A DUMB QUESTION, BUT WHAT IS THE PROBLEM WITH STEEL PIPE? LEON
THERE'S, THERE'S MANY TYPES OF PIPES THAT YOU CAN INSTALL FOR AS DRAINAGE STRUCTURES.
THERE'S PLASTIC, THERE'S, UH, STEEL, THERE'S CORRUGATED METAL PIPE GALVANIZED, THERE'S, UH, EVEN PLASTIC PIPES.
AND OF COURSE THERE'S, UH, CONCRETE PIPE, REINFORCED CONCRETE PIPE FOR AT LEAST THE LAST 10 YEARS, THE CITY OF KYLE'S BEEN REQUIRING CONCRETE PIPE IN THE RIGHT OF WAY FOR DRIVEWAYS.
UH, WE HAD A NEW, UH, DIVISION MANAGER OVER AT THE PUBLIC WORKS DEPARTMENT AND SINCE, AND CAME FROM ANOTHER CITY, AND THAT'S WHAT THEY REQUIRED.
THAT'S ACTUALLY IN OUR DRENCH CRITERIA MANUAL THAT WE'VE ADOPTED WHERE WE REQUIRE CONCRETE PIPES IN THE RIGHT OF WAY.
ONE OF THE THINGS ABOUT CONCRETE PIPE IS THAT, UH, WE HAVE A LOT OF CONSTRUCTION GOING ON AROUND THE CITIES.
AND, AND ON OCCASION, UH, WHEN YOU HAVE CONTRACTORS OUT THERE AND THEY'RE DIGGING WITH THEIR BACKHOE AND WHATEVER, EV EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE THEY'LL FIND ONE OF OUR PIPES WITH THE CONCRETE PIPE.
[00:50:01]
LESS LIKELY FOR THEM TO BREAK THAT.THEY CAN BREAK IT, BUT THEY'LL, ONCE THEY FIND IT, THEY KIND OF REALIZE THAT, HEY, WE HAVE A PIPE HERE AND WE DON'T, WE DON'T, WE NEED TO STOP WITH METAL PIPE.
YOU DON'T HAVE THAT FLEXIBILITY ONCE YOU CUT THROUGH IT.
IT'S HARD TO PATCH THAT KIND OF PIPE.
BUT THE BIGGEST DEAL THAT WE HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT THE METAL PIPE IS THAT IT'S ONLY GOT ABOUT A 20 TO 40 YEAR LIFESPAN.
AND, UH, WITH THE CONCRETE PIPE, YOU'RE LOOKING AT 50 TO MAYBE EVEN A HUNDRED YEARS.
NOW THE, THE, THE KEY POINT HERE IS IT HAS TO BE INSTALLED PROPERLY, PROPERLY.
IF YOU DON'T INSTALL IT PROPERLY, NONE OF THE PIPES ARE GONNA BE THAT GOOD OR SERVE THEIR FUNCTION FOR THAT PARTICULAR DRAINAGE ISSUE.
BUT THAT'S THE REASON WE DON'T LIKE THE METAL PIPE IS BECAUSE, AND IF YOU NOTICE IN SOME OF THE PICTURES THAT MIGHT HAVE BEEN SHOWN, UH, THERE, AND WHEN IT'S PARTICULAR AT BLANCO AT UH, BARBIE, THERE'S A PIPE, METAL PIPE THAT WAS USED THERE WAY BEFORE MY TIME, OUR TIME.
THAT'S ONE OF THE DISADVANTAGES OF USING METAL PIPE.
IT DOES GET CRUSHED IN ON THE ENDS.
NOW IF YOU PUT A NICE HEAD BALL ON IT, LESS CHANCE OF THAT HAPPENING.
BUT BACK, BACK, BACK THEN, THEY DID NOT DO THAT.
SO WE'VE HAD, THAT'S SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO GO IN THERE AND ACTUALLY JACK IT UP TO OPEN UP THE PIPE.
SO THAT'S THE DOWNSIDE OF THE METAL PIPE.
PLUS IT DOES CORRODE DOESN'T LAST AS LONG AS, AS A CONCRETE PIPE DOES.
SO THOSE ARE THE BIG DIFFERENCES.
AND YOU SAID, SIR, THAT IT IS STANDARD FOR UNDER CURRENT CODE IN THE CITY TO USE THE CONCRETE VERSUS STEEL.
IS THAT WHAT YOU SAID? YES, SIR.
ACTUALLY, UH, ON A, LIKE, ON A DEVELOPMENT, UH, WE DO ALLOW THEM TO USE WHATEVER PIPE THEY NEED BECAUSE IF THEY'RE GONNA MAINTAIN IT, THEN WE DON'T HAVE AN ISSUE WITH THAT.
WE'RE SEEING A LOT OF THESE DEVELOPMENTS NOW USING THIS PLASTIC PIPE.
BUT, UH, AND ACTUALLY I, AS A PUBLIC SERVANT, AT ONE POINT I DID USE A PLASTIC PIPE, BUT I WAS BETWEEN TWO HOUSES.
I DIDN'T HAVE ROOM TO WORK, SO I USED A PLASTIC PIPE, BUT THAT WAS BETWEEN TWO HOUSES.
WE DID NOT ALLOW IT IN THE STREETS BECAUSE OF THE CONCERN, UH, FOR CONTRACTORS TURNED UP OR, UH, AND, AND THE LONG LIFE THAT IT HAS, AND THAT, EXCUSE ME, THAT REQUIREMENT IS, IS CODIFIED IN CODE, CORRECT? IT'S, IT'S IN THE DRAINAGE CRITERIA MANUAL THAT WE'VE ADOPTED, UH, CITY OF AUSTIN'S IN, IN AT LEAST TWO PLACES.
IT SAYS, WE SHALL USE CONCRETE, REINFORCE CONCRETE PIPE OR REINFORCE CONCRETE BOX CULVERTS.
I'D LIKE A CHANCE TO RESPOND TO THAT.
UH, METAL PIPES ARE BEING PUT IN TODAY, RIGHT ON ONE 50 WITH WALKING DISTANCE.
UH, HERE'S SOME, SOME INDICATIONS OF CONCRETE PIPE VERSUS METAL PIPE.
HERE'S A, HERE'S A HOMEOWNER OR PROPERTY OWNER THAT HAD THIS CONCRETE PIPE AND REPLACED IT WITH THIS NEW DESIGN METAL PIPE.
SO, UH, THE CONCRETE PIPE IS NOT THE BE ALL WALL, ALL IT'S, IT'S TO UP TO BE.
AND AS FAR AS LASTING 20 YEARS THERE PIPE, AND THIS CITY
AND MR. BARBARA POINTED OUT AT CO AT THE CONFLUENCE OF BARBIE AND LANCO STREET, THERE IS A, A METAL PIPE CULVERT UNDER THAT ROAD THAT IS CRUSHED DOWN.
AND I HAVE ASKED THE CITY, WHY DON'T YOU COME OUT THERE AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT THAT? BECAUSE THIS CRUSHED DOWN.
IT IS GOING TO IMPEDE THE FLOW FROM MY PROPERTY AND DOWN TO THE REGULAR DRAINAGE DITCHES, AND IT IS VIRTUALLY GONNA TURN MY PROPERTY POSSIBLY INTO A, UH, A, A TENSION POND ITSELF BECAUSE OF THAT, THAT POORLY MAINTAINED PIPE UNDER THE CITY STREET.
UM, MR. HALL IS CORRECT ON THE PIPE ON ONE 50.
UNFORTUNATELY, UH, THE CITY DID NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY.
UM, THEY'RE, THEY'RE INSTALLING THAT.
UM, SO THEY ARE, ARE NOT BEHOLDEN TO SOME OF OUR REGS, UM, AS IT, IT'S THEIR HIGHWAY.
MY RESPONSE TO THAT IS, LET ME ASK YOU A QUESTION.
IS THAT PIPE IN THE CITY OF CO? IT IS, YES, SIR.
SO SAYING YOU CAN'T USE, YOU CANNOT USE METAL PIPE.
THE CITY OF KYLE IS NOT REALLY TRUE.
YOU'RE SAYING, WELL, IT'S TEXDOT.
SO I'M A PERSON AGAINST WHOM YOU WOULD ENFORCE YOUR LOCAL RULES, BUT YOU WON'T STAND UP TO T DOT.
IS THAT CORRECT? I, I THINK WE'VE GOTTEN A LITTLE FAR OFF THE SCOPE OF THE QUESTION.
IN ANY CASE, I THINK IT WOULD BE KNOWN THAT THE STATE LAW, EMS, LOCAL.
ARE THERE ANY OTHER IMMEDIATE QUESTIONS? NO.
I WILL SAY I DON'T THINK IT WAS A DUMB QUESTION AT ALL.
'CAUSE I HAD THE SAME ONE WRITTEN DOWN THAT I WAS GOING TO ASK.
SO THANK YOU FOR BEATING ME TO THE PUNCH THERE.
UH, MR. ROOTS, YOU CAN CONTINUE.
SO, UM, STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS, AGAIN, I'M GONNA GO THROUGH ALL THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS AND THEN WE WILL GO BACK AND YOU CAN MAKE YOUR MOTION ON, ON EACH ITEM INDIVIDUALLY.
UM, JUST TO HELP US, UH, CLARIFY MINUTES, UH, FOR COUNCIL'S, UH, NEXT MEETING, WHICH WOULD BE MAY 5TH.
UM, SO REQUESTING, UH, EXEMPT EXEMPTION REQUESTS ONE A AND ONE B.
UM, SO STAFF LOOKED AT THESE REQUIREMENTS.
[00:55:01]
RECOMMENDS DENIAL AS THESE ARE SPECIFICATIONS WITHIN THE CODE TO MITIGATE FLOOD DAMAGE DUE TO DEVELOPMENT ACTIVITIES.UM, NO HARDSHIP EXISTS THAT WOULD PREVENT THE APPLICATION FROM ADHERING TO THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE CODE.
WHEN WE LOOKED AT EXCEPTION REQUESTS NUMBER TWO, UH, TO ALLOW ALTERNATIVE CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS, AGAIN, UH, STAFF CAN RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF ALTERNATIVE CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS AS ALLOWED BY CITY CODE AND APPROVED BY THE CITY ENGINEER.
ONCE WE RECEIVE THE UPDATED PLANS AND ENGINEERING DOCUMENTS IS ARE SUBMITTED.
UM, IF THE, IF THE REQUEST IS TO NOT INSTALL IT WITHOUT ANY OF THAT, UM, VERIFICATION, UM, AGAIN, WE'RE RECOMMENDING DENIAL ON ON THAT.
UM, REQUEST RECOMMENDATION, EXCEPTION REQUEST THREE A AND THREE B.
UM, NEW SIDEWALKS ALONG VETERANS DRIVE.
UM, SO STAFF DOES RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE EXCEPTION REQUEST, UM, AS THE EXISTING SIDEWALKS ARE ALONG VETERANS, UM, IT'S, IT'S EXISTING INFRASTRUCTURE.
UH, PNZ HAS APPROVED THAT AS PART OF THEIR CUP AND STAFF HAD PREVIOUSLY AGREED TO ALLOW THAT AS PART OF THEIR SITE DEVELOPMENT, ELIMINATE SIDEWALKS ALONG BARBIE STREET FROM WOOD STREET TO VETERANS DRIVE.
STAFF DOES RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THAT VARIANCE REQUEST AGAIN, AS THIS PORTION OF, OF THAT ROAD IS GOING TO BE CLOSED.
WHEN WE GET INTO THE RECOMMENDATION, UM, EXCEPT REQUEST THREE C AND 3D WAVE SIDEWALK CROSSINGS OVER DRAINAGE DITCHES, UH, STAFF RECOMMENDS DENIAL OF THAT.
UM, AGAIN, PEDESTRIAN CONNECTIVITY AND SAFETY ISSUES ARE OUR CONCERN.
UM, AGAIN, NO HARDSHIP THAT WE FOUND AND THEN REDUCE THEM.
MINIMUM SIDEWALK WI WIDTH FROM FIVE FEET TO FOUR FEET.
AGAIN, STAFF DOES RECOMMEND DENIAL, UM, AS THIS IS THE MINIMUM STANDARD, UH, FOUND IN CITY CODE AND WOULD NOT IDENTIFIED A HARDSHIP, UM, THAT WOULD KEEP THE APPLICANT FROM MEETING THIS CODE REQUIREMENT.
SO HERE'S A QUICK AND DIRTY OF THE BREAKDOWN, UM, BUT I CAN GO BACK TO THE, THE FIRST OPTIONS IF YOU'LL WANT TO ENTERTAIN MOTIONS.
THANKS FOR LEADING US THROUGH ALL OF THESE.
SEND ME, I HEARD LIKE, DID Y'ALL HEAR THAT? YES.
UM, THANK YOU FOR LEADING US THROUGH ALL OF THESE.
UM, AT THIS TIME, YOU KNOW, ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF
UM, SO WE DO HAVE A FEW ITEMS HERE OF DIFFERENT NATURES.
SO I'M GONNA PROPOSE THAT WE, UM, BREAK THIS INTO THREE DIFFERENT VOTES, I GUESS.
UM, A VOTE FOR THE WATERSHED AND FLOOD PREVENTION ITEMS, A VOTE FOR THE GENERAL REQUIREMENT ITEMS, AND A VOTE FOR THE SIDEWALK ITEMS. IS THAT OKAY WITH EVERYBODY? OKAY.
SO, UM, LET'S GO AHEAD AND SOMEBODY THROW OUT A MOTION.
WE DON'T HAVE TO GO IN THE ORDER OF, UM, ITEM ONE, TWO, OR THREE.
WE CAN START WITH SIDEWALKS OR WE CAN START WITH GENERAL REQUIREMENTS OR WATERSHED.
UH, BUT WHO HAS A MOTION THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO THROW OUT THERE SO WE CAN BEGIN DISCUSSION? MADAM CHAIR, I'M SORRY.
I HAVE ONE MORE QUESTION FOR MR. HALL, IF YOU DON'T MIND.
I WANTED TO CONFIRM ONE THING.
UM, MR. HALL, ON ITEM, LET ME GET THE RIGHT NUMBER, EXCEPTION TWO IN WHICH IT TALKS ABOUT WHERE THE CITY WOULD SUPPORT AN ALTERNATIVE PROCEDURE OR ALTERNATIVE CULVERT IF THERE WAS ENGINEERING DOCUMENTATION TO SUPPORT IT.
EARLIER, YOUR, SUCH, YOUR PRESENTATION, I HEARD YOU SAY, UH, THAT YOU PROVIDED THE MATH WORK TO THE CITY.
THAT DOCUMENTATION WAS THAT PREPARED BY AN ENGINEER.
WAS THAT PREPARED BY, BY YOURSELF, BY A CONSULTANT WHO PREPARED THOSE VALUES THAT WERE PRESENTED TO THE CITY? I PREPARED THOSE.
I, I WOULD IMAGINE AN ENGINEER WOULD FIND THE SAME RESULTS.
BUT BASICALLY THE QUESTION SIMPLY PUT IS, CAN TWO 18 INCH PIPES ADEQUATELY DRAIN THE FEEDING OF ONE 18 INCH PIPE? NOW, CONCRETE PIPES ARE A LITTLE BIT SLICKER INSIDE, SO WATER FLOWS A LITTLE BIT FASTER AS OPPOSED TO CORRUGATED.
BUT THE RESEARCH AND LITERATURE I FOUND SAYS THAT IF THEY'RE LAYING FLAT, AS, AS MR. BARBARA POINTED OUT TO YOU, THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT LAYING FLAT, BUT THEY'RE HAVE A VERY, VERY TINY INCLINE THAT NEGATES ANY FRICTION BECAUSE THE WATER IS GONNA GO IN, UH, THE SAME IN EITHER ONE BECAUSE IT IS A FLAT TUBE, IT'S FLAT, NOT IF IT'S, UH, IF THERE, IF THERE'S MORE ELEVATION TO IT, IF CORRUGATIONS MIGHT SLOW IT DOWN A LITTLE BIT, BUT IF IT'S FLAT, NO DIFFERENCE.
[01:00:01]
I, I SENT THAT TO THESE GUYS WITH PLENTY OF TIME TO LOOK.I, I DON'T KNOW IF THEY LOOKED AT IT OR NOT, BUT I, I WAS PRETTY IMPRESSED WITH WHAT I FOUND AND HOW UNDERSTANDABLE IT REALLY WAS.
I'VE GONE THROUGH THE CITY WITH THIS CYCLE OF GO TO THE ENGINEER, WE'LL HAVE A MEETING, GO BACK TO THE ENGINEER, WE'LL HAVE A MEETING.
I, YOU KNOW, THIS IS COMMON SENSE STUFF.
THIS IS NOT ENGINEERING STUFF.
THERE'S NO NASA INVOLVED HERE.
THIS IS A SIMPLE THIRD GRADE WORD PROBLEM AND TWO 18 INCH PIPES, AND THE SAME LEVEL DRAIN AS MUCH AS ONE 18 INCH PIPE.
AND ALSO THE 18 INCH PIPE THAT'S FEEDING IT FROM THE CITY IS A CORRUGATED PIPE.
SO I'VE HAD, I ADEQUATELY ANSWERED THE QUESTION, NOW THE CITY INDICATES THAT I SHOULD GO HIRE AN, UH, HIRE A, UH, AN ENGINEER, AND THAT'LL BE 2, 5, 6, $8,000.
I DON'T KNOW, I DON'T HAVE HIRED AN ENGINEER LATELY, BUT, UH, THEY COME WITH BIG NUMBERS, BIG, BIG NUMBERS AND MR AND IT'S JUST WASTEFUL.
AND I FEEL LIKE I'M BEING SINGLED OUT FOR, FOR, FOR WASTEFUL ACTIVITY.
WASTED MY, MY TIME, WASTED MY MONEY.
AND, UH, YOU KNOW, I STARTED THIS PROJECT ABOUT THREE YEARS AGO AND I GET IN THIS CYCLE, HIRE AN ENGINEER.
LET'S HAVE A MEETING, LET'S TALK ABOUT THIS.
HIRE AN ENGINEER, HAVE A MEETING.
LET'S TALK ABOUT HIRE AN ENGINEER.
I'VE HIRED ENGINEERS TO TELL US WHERE TO PUT THE PLANTS, ENGINEERS THAT, THIS, THAT AND THE OTHER.
IT'S OFF THE HOOK AND THEY'RE JUST GOT, YOU KNOW, SOMEBODY GOTTA HAVE PUT SOME FOOT DOWN.
I SAY, NO, I'M NOT HIRING MORE ENGINEERS FOR SIMPLE LITTLE COMMON SENSE THINGS.
SO THAT MAY NOT BE THE ANSWER THAT STAFF OR YOU WANT TO HEAR, BUT THAT'S A REAL ANSWER.
I'VE GOTTA, I'VE GOT TO GET TO THE REALITY OF GETTING THIS DONE AND I CAN'T BE DELAYED, DELAYED, DELAYED.
UH, I HOPE THAT ANSWERS YOUR QUESTION.
AND MR. HALL, UNDER ORDINANCE, WE ARE REQUIRED TO IDENTIFY IF THERE'S A SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCE OR CONDITION AFFECTING THE LAND INVOLVED, SUCH THAT THE STRICT APPLICATION OF THE PROVISIONS OF THIS CHAPTER WOULD'VE HAD A SUBSTANTIAL ADVERSE IMPACT ON THE APPLICANT'S REASONABLE USE OF HIS LAND.
WHAT, WHAT SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCES HAVE WE NOT ASKED YOU THAT WE SHOULD HAVE, THAT WE SHOULD BE AWARE OF FOR WHY WE NEED TO GRANT THIS EXCEPTION? SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCES, YOU KNOW, THERE'S, THERE'S THREE VIEWS.
THERE'S A VIEW OF THE FOREST, THERE'S A VIEW OF THE TREE, AND THERE'S A VIEW OF THE BARK.
I KEEP GETTING THE VIEW OF THE BARK FROM THESE GUYS.
LET'S LOOK AT THE TREES OUT THERE.
THERE'S NOT A TRICKLE CHANNEL ANYWHERE.
IF I, IF I SAID I GAVE THE FIRST ONE OF YOU WHO CAN GO WALK AND FIND ME A TRICKLE CHANNEL, I'LL GIVE YOU 25,000 CASH.
YOU WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO COME BACK WITHIN HOURS.
AND THE EXCEPTIONS THAT, UH, UH, TO THE, TO THE, TO THE PONDING SITUATION, WHY, IF IT'S, IF IT'S THE LAW, WHY ISN'T THERE ONE HERE? IF IT'S SO IMPORTANT, THE CITY SHOULD START TOMORROW AND BUILD A BIG RETENTION POND OUT THERE.
YOU KNOW, LET'S LOOK AT THE FOREST, LET'S LOOK AT THE COMPARISONS.
LET'S LOOK AT WHAT GOES ON IN THE LARGER COMMUNITY AND NOT SAY, WELL, WE FOUND ON PAGE AN EXCEPTION HERE ON PAGE 37, 14 14 B, COME ON, LET'S LOOK AT WHAT DOES IT TAKE TO MAKE A COMMUNITY PROSPER? AND THAT MEANS HELPING THE PEOPLE WHO WERE TRYING TO HELP THE COMMUNITY PROSPER AND NOT RELYING ON, OH, I GOT YOU, I GOT YOU ON THIS, I GOT YOU ON THAT.
GO HIRE 42 ENGINEERS TO PROVE ME WRONG.
I'M DONE WITH THE ENGINEERING ROUTE.
I'M HERE TONIGHT BECAUSE OF ENGINEERS.
ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? OKAY, WE NEED, UM, A MOTION TO START DISCUSSION ON ANYTHING.
I THINK FOR STAFF, WE WOULD LIKE TO KIND OF TAKE IT ITEM BY ITEM, UM, JUST SO WE CAN HAVE THOSE MOTIONS INSTEAD OF KIND OF BACK AND FORTH.
UM, JUST BECAUSE IT'S LAID OUT THAT WAY, I THINK IT'LL BE EASIER FOR COUNCIL TO, TO KIND OF FOLLOW AND UNDERSTAND.
SO START WITH WATERSHED AND FLOOD PREVENTION AND THEN WORK OUR WAY DOWN.
UM, SO THIS IS WOULD BE EXCEPTION ONE A OR ONE B, UM, TO WAIVE REQUIREMENTS FOR DETENTION POND AND OR TRICKLE CHANNEL.
UM, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO RECOMMEND, UH, DENIAL OF REQUEST NUMBER ONE RELATED TO WATERSHED AND FLOOD PREVENTION.
[01:05:01]
WE HAVE A, UM, MOTION TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF THE EXCEPTION REQUEST FOR ITEMS ONE, A AND B.A AND B, A AND B, UH, FROM COMMISSIONER WEBB AND SECONDED BY VICE CHAIR SIEGEL, IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT ONE? ONE SEEING THAT AS I WOULD READ ORDINANCE, WE HAVE TO RELAY OUT IN A VERY EXPLICIT WAY IN THE MINUTES AND EVERYTHING ELSE AS TO WHY THAT IS BEING RECOMMENDED FOR DENIAL.
UM, I'LL START BY OUTLINING THAT UNDER ITEM C ONE ABOUT A SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCE.
I HAVE NOT HEARD TONIGHT, A SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCE THAT WOULD RISE TO THAT LEVEL TO WARRANT A WAIVER IN THIS CASE FOR ITEM TWO, THAT THE GRANTING OF THIS EXCEPTION WOULD NOT BE DETRIMENTAL TO PUBLIC HEALTH OR SAFETY OR WELFARE OR INJURIOUS TO OTHER PROPERTY IN THE AREA.
I THINK WE'VE HEARD TONIGHT THAT THAT'S A RISK, BOTH IN TERMS OF KNOWN HAZARDS AND EXPECTED HAZARDS WITH CHANGING IN THE FLOOD LANDSCAPE FOR ITEM THREE, THAT THE GRANTING OF THIS EXCEPTION WOULD NOT HAVE THE EFFECT OF PREVENTING THE ORDERLY SUBDIVISION OR OTHER LAND IN THE AREA IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE PROVISIONS OF THE CHAPTER.
I, I DON'T SEE WHY THIS WOULD BE A REASON FOR DENIAL, BUT FOR TWO OF THE THREE NOT BEING MET, I DON'T THINK, I COULD NOT READ THE ORDINANCE SAY THAT WE COULD GRANT AN EXCEPTION HERE.
IS THERE OTHER DISCUSSION ON THAT MOTION? I WANNA MAKE SURE, UM, COMMISSIONER HILDRETH, CAN YOU HEAR US OKAY? DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING YOU WANNA CHIME IN? YES, I CAN.
YEAH, I MEAN, THE, THE POINTS LAID OUT IN THE, UM, CODE ABOUT WHAT WE NEED, THE REQUIREMENTS WE NEED TO MEET HERE.
UM, I DON'T, I DON'T SEE THAT EITHER FOR ALL THREE OF 'EM.
UM, I, I, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, A LONG TIME AGO WHEN WE FIRST HAD THE CUP, UM, A DETENTION POND WAS INCLUDED IN THE PLAN AT THAT TIME.
SO THIS IS KIND OF SOMETHING THAT THEY KNEW ABOUT GOING IN AND NOW THEY'RE DECIDING, NO, WE, WE DON'T WANNA DO IT.
I THINK THAT THERE'S PLENTY OF ALTERNATE OPTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN MADE AVAILABLE.
UM, RAIN GARDENS, BIOSWALES, LID, UM, TO, TO GIVE OPTIONS IF YOU DON'T WANNA BUILD A DETENTION POND, I THINK THERE'S OPTIONS THERE FOR THE, FOR THE APPLICANT THAT CAN GET THEM OUT OF BUILDING A DETENTION POND IF THEY DON'T WANNA BUILD A DETENTION POND.
UM, BUT TO DO NOTHING, UM, YEAH, THAT ONE, I DON'T THINK WE'VE MADE A STRONG CASE FOR THAT YET, IN MY OPINION.
ATTRACTIVE OPTIONS, IF YOU'RE TALKING BIOS, SWALES AND SUCH, YEAH.
MUCH MORE ATTRACTIVE THAN A DETENTION POND, THAT'S FOR SURE.
I DON'T BELIEVE THIS WAS 2, 3, 4, 5 FEET DEEP.
I MEAN, IT'S TAKING A SMALL AMOUNT OF WATER.
UM, NOW DRESSING IT UP, THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S THE LANDOWNER.
SOME PEOPLE JUST LEAVE THEM AS ARE, AND SOME PEOPLE PLANT SHRUBS AND FLOWERS AND DRESS IT UP.
SO, UM, I DON'T BELIEVE ON THIS RENDERING, THERE WAS, UH, NOT MUCH LANDSCAPING THAT WAS, THAT WAS PROPOSED AROUND THERE.
SO IT'D BE YOUR TYPICAL SMALL, SHALLOW DETENTION POND LIKE A FOOT.
IF, IF YOU'RE ASKING DEEP HOW DEEP IT IS, I'D, I'D HAVE TO GET THAT ANSWER TO YOU, BUT I, I'M NOT SURE THAT IT'S KIND OF PERTINENT FOR THE DISCUSSION.
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? I ON THAT ONE? OKAY.
UH, LET'S GO AHEAD AND TAKE A VOTE.
THE MOTION IS TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF THE EXCEPTION REQUEST FOR ITEMS NUMBER ONE ABOUT THE DETENTION POND AND TRICKLE CHANNEL.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF RECOMMENDING DENIAL, PLEASE SAY AYE.
UH, NEXT UP ON OUR LIST IS ABOUT THE GENERAL REQUIREMENTS.
THIS ONE'S ABOUT THE CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS.
SO, MAY I SAY ONE THING ABOUT THE, UH, METAL PIPE VERSUS THE CONCRETE PIPE? YES, SIR.
I'M NOT OPPOSED TO USING THE METAL PIPE.
WHAT, UH, MR. HALL DOESN'T REALIZE, UH, WE HAVE A SET OF ENGINEERED DRAWINGS SIGNED AND SEALED BY A REGISTERED PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER.
WE CAN'T JUST CHANGE HIS PLANS
[01:10:01]
WITHOUT HIM KNOWING OR WITHOUT HIM MAKING THOSE CHANGES.THE PIPE THAT, UH, HE MENTIONED IT'S, IT'S ROUGHER THAN, THAN OUR CONCRETE PIPE, AS HE WILL.
AND GOOD JOB IN YOUR RESEARCH, JOHN, BY THE WAY, UH, HE DID, UH, SAY IT IS ROUGHER.
SO THAT'S THE FRICTION FACTOR.
IT SAYS TO REPLACE AN 18 INCH PIPE, IT NEEDS TO BE A 27 INCH CORRUGATED GALVANISM METAL GALVANIZED METAL PIPE.
THAT'S A PRETTY LARGE SIZE PIPE, BUT I NEED THE ENGINEER TO TELL ME THE TWO EIGHTEENS THAT ARE THERE THAT ARE CONCRETE CAN BE REPLACED BY TWO 18 INCH GALVANIZED METAL PIPES.
AND I NEED THAT FROM THE ENGINEER BECAUSE THAT'S, IT'S AN ETHICAL ISSUE.
NOW, I CANNOT CHANGE THAT WITHOUT HIM KNOWING OR HIM TELLING ME WHAT THE RIGHT PIPE SIZE SHOULD BE.
SO I'M GONNA LET YOU KNOW THAT.
SO, MR. BARBER, THAT WAS A PART OF THE PLAN SUBMITTED TO YOU, SIGNED AND SEALED BY ANOTHER PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER? THAT IS CORRECT.
WE NEED A MOTION AND A SECOND TO TAKE ACTION ON THIS ONE, OR TO EVEN HOLD DISCUSSION, OF COURSE.
A QUESTION ON THE PROCESS, IF WE TAKE ACTION TO RECOMMEND DENIAL, AND MR. HALL COMES BACK AT A FUTURE DATE WITH A LICENSED STAMPED ENGINEERING REPORT THAT OUTLINES HIS, HIS PLAN, THAT COULD BE RECONSIDERED.
UM, IF HE CAME BACK WITH A LICENSED PROFESSIONAL THAT UPDATED HIS PLANS, THIS WOULD NOT COME BACK TO Y'ALL.
AND LEON HAS EVERY, EVERY APPROVAL AUTHORITY TO, TO DO THAT.
SO AGAIN, WE'VE, WE'VE SAID WE ARE WILLING TO, TO GO WITH THE ALTERNATIVE MATERIAL SIZES, BUT WE, WE, AND SPEC SPECIFICALLY, LEON CANNOT SIGN OFF ON THAT.
HE HAS TO, YOU KNOW, HIS HAS HIS OWN SET OF, OF LAWS THAT THEY, THEY HAVE ON THAT.
SO, UH, AGAIN, WE, WE CAN SUPPORT ALTERNATIVE SPECIFICATIONS, UM, BUT WE CANNOT SUPPORT A REQUEST TO APPROVE THOSE WITHOUT ANY KIND OF DOCUMENTATION.
AND SO, RIGHT HERE ON THE SCREEN WHERE IT SAYS, STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF ALTERNATIVE CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS AS ALLOWED BY CITY CODE AND APPROVED BY CITY ENGINEER ONCE UPDATED, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH, AS OF TONIGHT, YOU DON'T HAVE THOSE PLANS IN HAND TO WHERE A MOTION TOWARDS THAT COULD EVEN BE EFFECTIVE.
SO I GUESS THIS ONE'S A LITTLE, THIS ONE'S A LITTLE INTERESTING.
UM, YOUR MOTION COULD BE A COUPLE OF OPTIONS.
YOU COULD, YOU COULD APPROVE, UM, THE REQUESTED WAIVER TO ALLOW THE SPECIFICATIONS WITHOUT ANY DOCUMENTATION.
UM, YOU COULD, UH, RECOMMEND DENIAL OF THE, OF THE REQUEST WITHOUT DOCUMENTATION.
UM, BUT THAT IF DOCUMENTATION WAS PROVIDED, YOU WOULD ALLOW CITY STAFF TO SIGN OFF AS NORMAL.
SO THIS ONE'S A A LITTLE INTERESTING, BUT, UM, STAFF CANNOT SIGN OFF ON ANY CHANGES WITHOUT, WITHOUT NEW PLANS.
I, I THINK, UM, MR. LUTZ, I THINK IF THE CODE ALLOWS STAFF TO APPROVE WITH THE UPDATED PLANS, I THINK YOU'RE GONNA GET THE SAME EFFECT FROM DENYING AS YOU ARE FROM APPROVING THE RECOMMENDATION TO ALLOW STAFF TO APPROVE WITH UPDATED PLANS.
SO I THINK WE, WE STICK WITH OUR GENERAL MOTION OF, UH, RECOMMEND ACCEPTANCE OR RECOMMEND DENIAL.
AND TO CLARIFY, WHEN YOU SAY TWO RECOMMENDED, WE'RE VOTING, WE'RE VOTING ON WHAT IS BEING PRESENTED, WE'RE NOT, UH, VOTING ON WHAT COULD BE PRESENTED IN THE FUTURE.
THAT WAS, UH, THAT'S WHERE I WAS GOING.
WOULD ANYONE LIKE TO BRING MICROPHONE? WOULD ANYONE LIKE TO BRING A MOTION FOR THIS? ONE MORE QUESTION, IF YOU DON'T MIND, MA'AM, I DON'T MIND.
ARE WE ALLOWED TO TAKE ACTION TO RECOMMEND THAT THE PLANS ALREADY ON FILE REMAIN? LIKE, IS THAT AN OPTION WHERE WE KEEP THE STATUS QUO? IF THEY, IF YOU HAVE PLANS ON FILE THAT WE STICK TO THOSE PLANS? THAT WOULD, I WOULD SAY WOULD BE A RECOMMENDATION OF DENIAL, YES.
THAT'S, THAT'S A DENIAL RECOMMENDATION.
I HAVE APPROVED PLANS AND I, I PLAN TO USE THOSE.
COULD YOU CLARIFY? YOU HAVE APPROVED PLANS AS IN WHAT HAS ALREADY BEEN APPROVED PLANS, AND I PLAN TO USE THOSE, WHICH WOULD BE PLANS THAT HAVE BEEN STAMPED, SIGNED BY LICENSED ENGINEER THAT'S ALREADY ON FILE WITH THE CITY, THE ENGINEER.
THEY'RE SIGNED BY Y'ALL'S ENGINEER APPROVED BY, UH, WHATEVER THE PROCESS IS HERE.
AND, UH, I'VE GOTTA GET THIS THING FINISHED.
IF Y'ALL WANT HELP ME, I'LL JUST GO UP ALONE.
I'LL PUT IT IN THE CONCRETE PIPES.
I'LL DO WHAT I HAVE TO DO, BUT I'VE GOTTA GET THIS PROJECT FINISHED.
I'M AN ELDERLY PERSON AND I'VE GOTTA GET IT DONE.
SO, AND, AND SO YOU WOULD FOLLOW DON'T, I DON'T WANT THIS GROUP DECK TO RENEG ON THE PLANS I HAVE THAT ARE APPROVED, SO PLEASE DON'T.
AND SO THE PLANS THAT ARE CURRENTLY APPROVED, YOU WOULD FOLLOW THEM TO INCLUDE THE
[01:15:01]
CULVERTS, THE PIPING THAT'S ALREADY OUTLINED IN THAT I'VE GOTTA GET IT DONE.AND THEN ANY ACTION BY US TONIGHT TO DENY THE REQUEST WOULD DEFAULT BACK TO THE APPROVED PLANS, IS THAT CORRECT? UM, I THINK THAT'S A GOOD WAY TO PUT, YEAH.
SO ANY ACTION YOU TAKE TONIGHT WILL BE FORWARDED TO COUNSEL.
COUNSEL WILL TAKE THAT ACTION.
IF THEY FOLLOW YOUR SUIT AND DENY IT, THEN YES, IT, IT, IT GOES BACK TO THE APPROVED PLANS.
MADAM CHAIR, MOTION TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF THIS EXCEPTION.
WE HAVE A MOTION TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF EXCEPTION TWO ABOUT THE CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS MADE BY COMMISSIONER COPELAND AND SECONDED BY VICE CHAIR STEGEL.
IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT ONE? UM, I, I THINK I UNDERSTAND THE LOGIC BEHIND WANTING TO DEVIATE FROM THE PLANS, BUT I ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT WHILE WE MAY NOT ALWAYS SEE IT, THERE'S VALUE IN FOLLOWING THE PROCESS AND DOING THINGS ACCORDING TO THE PROCESS.
UM, AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT'S IMPORTANT HERE.
UH, IT SEEMS THE CITY'S OPEN TO OTHER, OTHER ALTERNATIVES AS LONG AS IT FOLLOWS THE CORRECT PROCESS.
UM, SO IN THAT, IN THAT LIGHT, I SUPPORT THE DENIAL, UM, SO THAT WE CAN FOLLOW THE CORRECT PROCESS IF WE WANNA MAKE A CHANGE IN THE PLANS.
AND THEN SIMILAR WITH THAT FIRST MOTION THAT WE DID, I HAVE NOT HEARD ANY SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCE OR CONDITION THAT WOULD ALLOW FOR US TO ISSUE THAT EXCEPTION.
UH, I THINK WE, WE HAVE HEARD ABOUT THE RISK OF FLOODING AND SOCIAL WELFARE BY GRANTING THE EXCEPTION.
UM, BUT FOR THE THIRD ITEM, AGAIN, I, I DON'T SEE HOW GRANTING THIS WOULD PREVENT THE ORDERLY SUBDIVIDING SUBDIVIDING OF OTHER LAND.
AND SO SINCE WE HAVE NOT MET TWO OF THE THREE, THAT IS THE BASIS OF MY MOTION TO DENY
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION? OKAY.
LET'S GO AHEAD AND TAKE A VOTE ON THAT ONE.
AGAIN, THIS IS A MOTION TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF EXCEPTION NUMBER TWO RELATED TO CULVERT SPECIFICATIONS.
UM, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF RECOMMENDING DENIAL, PLEASE SAY AYE.
NEXT WE HAVE THE EXCEPTIONS PERTAINING TO SIDEWALK.
UM, DOES STAFF WANT US TO BREAK THEM INTO FOUR SEPARATE MOTIONS? YES.
I'D LIKE TO, UH, LOOK AT THREE A AND THREE B ITEMS. UM, SO STAFF HAS LOOKED AT THESE, UM, STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF, OF THESE REQUESTS SLASH EXCEPTIONS.
UM, AGAIN, THE FIRST ONE IS BECAUSE, UH, WE HAVE EXISTING INFRASTRUCTURE ON VETERANS.
UM, IT WAS APPROVED AS PART OF THE OVERLAY.
AND IF YOU RECALL THROUGH YOUR TRAINING OVERLAYS, YOU CAN REDUCE SOME OF YOUR, YOUR REQUIREMENTS THROUGH CODE AS PART OF THE OVERLAYS.
AND SO, UM, AGAIN, STAFF WILL SUPPORT THAT ONE BECAUSE IT WAS UNDER SOME PREVIOUS APPROVALS.
BUT WE WANTED TO ADD THIS LAYER IN HERE AS WELL.
UH, WHEN IT COMES TO ELIMINATE THE SIDEWALKS ALONG BARBIE STREET, AGAIN, FROM WOODS TO VETERANS, UM, WE ALSO SUPPORT THIS REQUEST.
AGAIN, WE ARE CLOSING THAT RIGHT OF WAY, UM, OR WE'RE NOT ABANDONING THE RIGHT OF WAY, BUT WE ARE CLOSING THE STREET.
UM, AND BECAUSE YOU HAVE ADJACENT PEDESTRIAN CROSSING LITERALLY 10 FEET AWAY, UM, WE FEEL THAT THAT'S NOT A LIFE SAFETY ISSUE.
SO WE DO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF BOTH OF THESE EXCEPTIONS OR REQUESTS.
MADAM CHAIR, I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION.
DO WE APPROVE, UH, THE EXCEPTIONS THREE A AND THREE B.
WE HAVE A MOTION TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF EXCEPTIONS THREE A AND THREE B FROM COMMISSIONER HILDRETH AND A SECOND FROM COMMISSIONER WEBB.
SO ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT ONE? OKAY.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF RECOMMENDING APPROVAL, PLEASE.
I'M SORRY, CHAIR HAD SOME DISCUSSION THERE JUST TO MAKE SURE WE ROUND IT OUT.
UM, SO GOING DOWN THAT SAME LIST, JUST TO BE CONSISTENT, WE HAVE THE SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCE.
I DON'T LOVE THAT WE'RE REDUCING THE WIDTH OF THE SIDEWALK.
I THINK THE FIVE INCH, THE, SORRY, FIVE FOOT IS APPROPRIATE.
HOWEVER, IF THE CITY'S ALREADY PREVIOUSLY GRANTED AN EXCEPTION THERE, AND AS PART OF THE EXISTING CUP, IT WOULD BE UNFAIR TO AN APPLICANT FOR THE CITY TO BACKTRACK ON PREVIOUSLY APPROVED PLANS.
SO I THINK THAT DOES RISE TO THE LEVEL OF A SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCE HAS BEEN MET.
I HAVE HEARD NOTHING TONIGHT TO INDICATE THAT THE REDUCTION FROM FIVE FOOT TO FOUR FOOT WOULD CAUSE ANY KIND OF DEBT DETRIMENT TO PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY, WELFARE, ET CETERA.
AND REDUCING THAT SIDEWALK WIDTH DOES NOT, IN MY OPINION, ALTER OUR ABILITY TO SUBDIVIDE FURTHER
[01:20:01]
LAND.SO I THINK IN THIS CASE, WE'VE MET ALL THREE REQUIREMENTS.
UM, AND SO I AM ALSO IN SUPPORT OF THAT.
ANY OTHER, UH, DISCUSSION ON THE MOTION? OKAY.
THIS MOTION IS TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF EXCEPTIONS THREE A AND THREE B.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF RECOMMENDING APPROVAL, PLEASE SAY AYE.
AND THEN WE'VE GOT, UM, THREE C.
THIS IS ABOUT SIDEWALK CROSSINGS OVER DRAINAGE DITCHES.
SO, UM, I GUESS I JUST WANNA CLARIFY, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT BOTH THE NORTH AND SOUTH CROSSINGS.
UM, AND SO AGAIN, THIS IS ALL THREE CROSSINGS AND REDUCING THE SIDEWALKS WIDTH FROM FIVE TO FOUR FEET FOR THE NEWLY INSTALLED ONES, THAT WAS MY QUESTION.
THAT WOULD BE ALONG, DON'T EXIST YET, RIGHT? AND BARBIE? YES.
SO THAT, THAT'S UP TO THE COMMISSION.
IF YOU WANNA VOTE ON THEM SEPARATELY, YOU CAN DO SO.
IF YOU WANT TO TAKE THE SAME ACTION ON BOTH, YOU CAN MAKE THAT A SINGLE MOTION.
MR. LUTZ, FOR THE EXISTING PLANS THAT HAVE BEEN APPROVED TO DATE, DOES IT INCLUDE ALL THREE CROSSINGS AS DEPICTED ON OUR PACKET? YES, SIR.
I GUESS I HAVE ONE OTHER QUESTION ABOUT, SORRY, THIS JUST CAME TO MY MIND.
I SHOULD HAVE ASKED EARLIER WHEN IT WAS STAFF TIME.
UM, SO FOR THESE DITCH CROSSINGS ON THE IMAGE THAT WE WERE SHOWN EARLIER TODAY, THOSE, THOSE DITCHES ARE RATHER SHALLOW.
SO FOR THESE DITCH CROSSINGS, IS IT JUST SIMPLY MAKING THE, THE LEVEL EVEN WITH THE PAVEMENT ON EITHER SIDE? SO JUST A, A FEW INCHES HIGHER, OR IS THERE A SPECIAL LIKE ENGINEERING THAT GOES INTO KIND OF MAKING A LITTLE HUMP OR, UM, I DON'T, I'M NOT AWARE OF THE ENGINEERING BEHIND IT, BUT I KNOW THEY'VE, THEY'VE BEEN REVIEWED AND APPROVED.
UM, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THE SHALLOWNESS, UM, SO YES, THE SOUTHERN ONE, VERY SHALLOW.
UM, THAT CROSSING IS, IS NOT GONNA BE VERY MUCH, BUT THE, THE CROSSING'S ON, ON BLANCO, UM, ESPECIALLY THE ONE NORTH CROSSING BARBIE NEXT TO BLANCO, THOSE, THOSE ARE FAIRLY DEEP THERE.
UM, SO I THINK THAT WAS AN 18 INCH CULVERT.
UM, SO IT'S DEFINITELY DEEPER THAN THAT.
SO THAT ONE, MOST LIKELY, THERE'S A COUPLE WAYS YOU CAN DO IT.
UH, CULVERTS, I'VE SEEN SOME THE CONCRETE THICKER WITH REINFORCED STEEL.
UM, BUT WHATEVER'S BEEN APPROVED IN THE PLANS WOULD, WOULD BE APPROVED.
I HATE TO INTERVENE, BUT THERE IS ONLY TWO CROSSINGS HERE.
WHAT CROSSINGS ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? THERE'S ONLY TWO, UH, I'M, I CONSIDER THE ONE BETWEEN, UM, FROM THE GREEN SIDEWALK.
UM, DO YOU SEE THAT CONNECTION FROM, FROM VETERANS THAT GOES TO THE SIDEWALK ON BLANCO, I BELIEVE.
RIGHT THERE, I THINK IS A PORTION OF THE DRAINAGE.
SO I THINK IT, IT KIND OF CONNECTS THERE, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY.
AND, UH, THERE'S NOT A, THERE'S NOT A BRIDGE OVER THE DITCH THAT BLANCO BLANCO, UH, THE CITY, ANOTHER ONE OF YOUR DEPARTMENTS HAS ALREADY WAVED THAT SAYING IT CROSSES IN THE MIDDLE OF THE, THE MIDDLE OF THE BLOCK, WHICH MAKES IT JAYWALKING.
AND, AND THEY, THAT SECTION DOESN'T, WHATEVER DEPARTMENT IS THAT THEY WAVE THAT.
SO WE LOOKS LOOKING AT THE NORTH BARB AND THE SOUTH BARB ACROSS, THERE'S NO, THERE'S NO BRIDGE ACROSS THE DITCH ON BLANCO STREET.
SO TO CONFIRM WITH THE PLANS THAT ARE SIGNED AND STAMPED BY A LICENSED ENGINEER THAT ARE ON FILE WITH THE CITY, THAT IS WHERE THIS IMAGE IS FROM.
WE HAVE CROSSINGS OVER, I'M GONNA CALL IT NORTH AND SOUTH, WHICH ARE BOTH ALONG BARBIE STREET, CORRECT? THE ONE THAT IS, I'M GONNA CALL EAST, CONNECTING VETERANS TO BLANCO.
IT SOUNDS LIKE THERE WAS DEBATE A MINUTE AGO OVER WHETHER THAT EXISTS OR NOT.
I, MY QUESTION IS, UM, I THINK THERE WAS AN ORIGINALLY, IF IT'S HARD TO SEE ON THAT IMAGE AT THE, WHERE THE BLUE LINE AND THE RED LINE MEETS ON BLANCO, THOSE TWO SIDEWALK CONNECTIONS.
I THINK ORIGINALLY THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT PUTTING AN ACTUAL CROSSWALK, LIKE, HEY, WE'RE GONNA PUT A RAMP AND THIS IS WHERE SOMEONE WOULD COME FROM THE OTHER SIDE.
WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT IS FROM THE GREEN TO THE RED, THAT LITTLE RUN RIGHT THERE.
UM, I CAN'T REMEMBER IF THAT IS, I BELIEVE THAT IS FLAT ENOUGH THAT CAN MAKE THAT CONNECTION.
AND I THINK THAT'S INSIDE THE OTHER DRAINAGE DITCH THERE.
[01:25:02]
AND SO A PEDESTRIAN WALKING ALONG BLANCO STREET ON THAT RED SECTION THERE COULD CONTINUE NORTHWEST, AT LEAST NORTHWEST ON THIS PLANE.I'LL ASSUME IT'S NORTH SOUTH DIRECTING RIGHT NOW.
IT MAY NOT BE, BUT COULD CONTINUE NORTHWEST WALKING INTO THE GREEN LINE OFF VETERANS.
IS THAT CORRECT? OR DO THEY HAVE TO CROSS IF THEY UTILIZE THAT BLUE SECTION THERE? AND SO IF THE BLUE SECTION DOES NOT EXIST, THEY COULD NOT WALK FROM THE RED TO THE GREEN, YOU ON THE UNMAPPED AREA, CORRECT.
IT, IT, IT, YOU HAVE TO CROSS OVER THE BLUE.
ALL OF ALL OF THESE ARE SIDEWALK CONNECTIONS.
ARE THERE OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF ON THAT ONE? OKAY, WE NEED A MOTION, UM, TO DISCUSS AND TAKE ACTION.
UM, AGAIN, WE CAN DO THIS AS THREE C AND 3D TOGETHER, OR ONE AT A TIME.
IT DEPENDS ON THE MOTION YOU WISH TO MAKE.
MADAM CHAIR, I'D LIKE TO MAKE THE MOTION THAT WE DENY ITEMS THREE C AND 3D AND FOLLOW STATUS RECOMMENDATIONS.
WE HAVE A MOTION TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF THREE C AND 3D FROM COMMISSIONER HILDRETH AND SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER WEBB.
IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT? GO AHEAD.
LEMME PULL UP THAT SECTION AGAIN.
SO I HAVE NOT HEARD OF A SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCE OR CONDITION AFFECTING THAT LAND TO GRANT THAT WAIVER, ESPECIALLY NOTING THAT WE HAVE ALREADY ON FILE SIGNED STAMPED ENGINEERING REPORTS THAT INCLUDE THAT THE GRANTINGS OF THIS EXCEPTION WOULD NOT BE DETRIMENTAL TO THE PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY OR WELFARE.
I DON'T KNOW THAT WE HAVE MET THAT BURDEN IF WE ARE TALKING ABOUT SCHOOL CHILDREN WALKING ALONG THAT SIDEWALK CROSSING OVER DITCHES, THAT DOES SEEM LIKE A PUBLIC SAFETY OR WELFARE CONCERN.
HOWEVER, THE GRANTING OF THE EXCEPTION WOULD NOT HAVE THE EFFECT OF PREVENTING ORDERLY SUBDIVIDING.
I THINK THE APPLICANT HAS MET THAT REQUIREMENT.
I DON'T SEE A REASON WHY THAT WOULD BE A BASIS OF DENIAL, BUT BECAUSE TWO OF THE THREE HAVE NOT BEEN MET, I'M GONNA VOTE IN FAVOR OF DENYING THIS REQUEST.
UM, I'LL ADD SOME PERSPECTIVE FROM THE COMMUNITY OF PLUM CREEK.
UM, WE HAVE TWO SMALL LAKES PONDS, UM, WITH A TRAIL THAT GOES IN THE FIGURE EIGHT AROUND THEM.
UM, FOR A LONG TIME THAT TRAIL WAS UNFINISHED.
IT WAS DIRT TRAIL, UM, ABOUT TWO, THREE YEARS AGO.
UM, WE MADE IT A BIG PRIORITY TO FINISH THAT TRAIL.
AND THE BIG DEBATE WAS, DO YOU MAKE THE SIDEWALK FOUR FEET WIDE, FIVE FEET WIDE, OR SIX FEET WIDE? UM, AFTER A LOT OF UPSET CONVERSATIONS AND PEOPLE, WE CAME AROUND TO FIVE FEET WIDE WAS THE ANSWER.
THE ARGUMENT FOR FOUR FEET WIDE IS, I DON'T WANT TO ENCOURAGE A WHOLE BUNCH OF PEOPLE TO BE ON THERE WITH STROLLERS AND BIKES AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
IT JUST, IT, IT COULDN'T JUST SIT TOO MUCH.
AND THE ARGUMENT FOR FIVE FEET WIDE WAS, ISN'T THAT THE POINT OF HAVING THAT TRAIL THERE? UM, AND SO LET'S MAKE IT AS WALKABLE AS POSSIBLE.
I I SAY THAT IN THE CONTEXT OF IT'S BEEN A BIG PRIORITY FOR THE CITY AND ON EVERY CITY SURVEY AND FROM EVERY, UH, FROM JUST ABOUT EVERY PERSON THAT SITS ON CITY COUNCIL TO INCREASE WALKABILITY IN OUR CITY.
AND THERE IS A MASSIVE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN FOUR FEET AND FIVE FEET IN ACCOMPLISHING THAT GOAL.
UM, SO WHICH WOULD ADDRESS 3D ON THREE C, CONNECTING THESE SIDEWALKS, I THINK IS ALSO A REALLY BIG PART OF WALKABILITY.
UM, AND SO THAT IS KIND OF MY BASIS FOR, UH, VOTING IN FAVOR OF THE DENIAL AS WELL.
I'D LIKE TO INTERJECT A PIECE OF INFORMATION THAT'S BEEN ADMITTED, UH, BY THE CITY.
IF YOU CROSS THE STREET, THERE ARE NO SIDEWALKS OVER THERE.
THERE'S A DIRT DITCH AND NOTHING OVER THERE.
THERE'S NO, NO SIDEWALKS ACROSS BLANCO AND ACROSS, UH, BARBIE.
SO GOING THERE IS GONNA GET YOU TO NOWHERE AS FAR AS FOOTPATH GOES.
VICE CHAIR, I THOUGHT I SAW YOUR FINGER OVER THE BUTTON.
WERE YOU DOING THAT TO VOTE OR DID YOU HAVE A COMMENT? I WAS ALSO SCRATCHING MY EYE, BUT OH,
UM, SO YEAH, THIS ONE FOR ME, THIS ONE'S, UM, INTERESTING.
I DEFINITELY SEE THE NEED FOR THE DITCH CROSSINGS ON THE NORTH SIDE OF THE PROPERTY ALONG BLANCO, UH,
[01:30:01]
BARBIE AND VETERANS.I THINK THAT'S IMPORTANT FOR CIRCULATION.
UM, THE SOUTHERNMOST DITCH CROSSING THE ONE THAT'S QUITE SHALLOW, UM, AND CONNECTING ONTO A, A SMALL SEGMENT OF, UM, SIDEWALK THERE IN THE RED.
UM, I DON'T FORESEE THAT ONE GETTING A LOT OF USE.
SO I MIGHT'VE BEEN ABLE TO, YOU KNOW, GET BEHIND EXEMPTING FROM THAT SECTION OF SIDEWALK AND THAT DITCH CROSSING, ESPECIALLY 'CAUSE THE ROAD BEYOND THERE IS GOING TO BE CLOSED AND THERE WON'T BE A SIDEWALK BEYOND IT.
SO I DO THINK THAT THAT ONE IS KIND OF WASTEFUL AND, UM, UNNECESSARY.
BUT, UH, THE TWO NORTHERN MOST CROSSINGS I THINK ARE IMPORTANT FOR CIRCULATION, GIVEN THE SCHOOL CHILDREN THAT ARE GONNA BE PASSING THROUGH THERE AND MOVING THEM BACK AND FORTH TWICE A DAY.
UM, BUT SINCE WE'VE, WE'VE DONE THIS ALL AS ONE, I AM AT THIS POINT IN FAVOR OF SUPPORTING THE MOTION TO DENY.
JUST TO CLARIFY MY, MY REASONING ON THIS, I AM A FIRM BELIEVER IN AVOIDING SETTING PRECEDENTS THAT MIGHT BE ADVERSE, UH, TO FUTURE DEVELOPMENT.
UM, ABSENT ANY, YOU KNOW, ANY MITIGATING CIRCUMSTANCES THAT, THAT, UH, THAT JUSTIFY US WAIVING, UH, THOSE REQUIREMENTS, I CANNOT, YOU KNOW, I HAVE TO SUPPORT, I HAVE TO SUPPORT DENYING THAT REQUEST.
WE HAVE TO DO OUR DUE DILIGENCE.
MY THOUGHT IS THAT WE HAVE TO TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION THAT THIS IS AN AREA THAT'S IN FLUX IN TERMS OF DEVELOPMENT, THAT THERE WILL BE A LOT MORE PEDESTRIAN TRAFFIC.
UM, WE ALREADY SEE WHAT'S GOING ON IN TERMS OF SIDEWALK DEVELOPMENT SAFETY ZONES DOWN NEAR THE KYLE ELEMENTARY.
UM, WE HAVE THE, THE, UH, MIDDLE SCHOOL ON THE OTHER SIDE OF VETERANS.
THIS WHOLE AREA, THE CHARACTER OF IT'S BEGINNING TO CHANGE GREAT GARDENS COMING ONLINE IN ENTIRE AREA.
I THINK WE NEED TO DO WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO MAXIMIZE, UH, PEDESTRIAN AND AUTO SAFETY AND, UH, APPROPRIATE DRAINAGE SO THAT THAT DOES NOT BECOME A, UH, UH, A PROBLEM IN THAT AREA.
THIS IS AN AREA THAT'S IN CHANGE FOR SURE, BUT I THINK, UH, THE PLANS THE CITY HAS, UH, SO FAR APPROVED, UH, UM, PUT US IN THE DIRECTION OF ACCOMMODATING THOSE CHANGES FOR THE FUTURE.
AND THAT WAS ONE OF THE REASONS I ASKED ABOUT THE WA PROTEST, UH, PROCESS.
AND THERE, LOOKING AT THE, THE LETTER, THERE IS A PROCEDURE IN PLACE THAT STIMULATES A WAIVER PROTEST.
UM, AND THE, THE APPLICANT HAS, HAS CITED, THEY DON'T, THEY DON'T WISH TO GO THAT ROUTE.
ANY OTHER, UH, COMMENTS ON THE MOTION, GENTLEMEN? NO.
SO, UH, TO RESTATE, THE MOTION ON THE TABLE IS TO RECOMMEND TO COUNSEL DENIAL OF EXCEPTION REQUEST THREE C AND 3D.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF RECOMMENDING DENIAL, PLEASE SAY AYE.
THANK YOU, MADAM CHAIR, JUST TO CONFIRM, WE VOTED ON THREE A.
WE DID THREE A AND B TOGETHER.
TWO, BUT NO, WE MISSED ONE, ONE MONTH AND SO I WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE DIDN'T DO THAT AGAIN.
[3) Consider approval of a Conditional Use Permit for a proposed public restroom facility located at 101 S. Burleson Street (Mary Kyle Hartson Park). (CUP-26-0155). ]
WE'VE GOT, UM, CONSIDER APPROVAL OF A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A PROPOSED PUBLIC RESTROOM FACILITY LOCATED AT 1 0 1 SOUTH BURLESON STREET.MARY KYLE HARTSON PARK, CUP DASH 26 DASH 0 1 5 5.
I'M ANGEL NINE SENIOR PLANNER.
UM, THIS IS FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A NEW BATHROOM FACILITY OVER HERE AT MARY KYLE HARTSON PARK.
THIS IS THROUGH THE PARKS AND RECREATION DEPARTMENT.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT WILL ATKINSON FROM PARKS AND REC IS HERE.
UM, AND HE CAN HELP ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS, UM, AT THE END.
UM, SO THIS WILL BE A SINGLE PHASE PROJECT FOR A BRAND NEW BATHROOM.
I REALLY HATE TO DO THIS, BUT WE DON'T HAVE A QUORUM IN THE ROOM CURRENTLY.
WE'RE GONNA NEED A RECESS UNTIL WE HAVE A QUORUM IN THE ROOM.
WE ARE MEETING EXACT, WE ARE RECESS.
THANK YOU FOR POINTING THAT OUT.
SO, UH, WHILE WE ARE RECESSED, CAN I ASK YOU, SO IF WE HAVE SOMEONE VIRTUALLY, BUT ON THE DAIS, WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH PHYSICAL BODIES? THAT'S RIGHT.
FOR ANYBODY NOT LOCATED WITHIN AT LEAST THREE COUNTIES, WHICH WE ARE NOT, UM, YOU MUST HAVE A QUORUM PRESENT AT THE DIOCESE IN ORDER TO
[01:35:01]
HAVE THE MEETING, OR AT LEAST IN THE ROOM.WELL, I GUESS I, WE'VE BEEN HERE FOR A LITTLE WHILE SO I COULD MAYBE WE WANNA TAKE A RECESS AND LET EVERYBODY GO TO THE BATHROOM AND THEN WE GO BREAK.
YEAH, LET'S MEET BACK AT, UM, WHAT DO Y'ALL THINK? EIGHT 15 IS THAT WAY TOO MUCH TIME? 15.
BACK TO THE, UH, MARY KYLE HARSON PARK C UM, THIS IS GOING TO BE A 600 FOOT PUBLIC REST, OOPS, SORRY,
UM, HERE'S A MORE DETAILED SUMMARY.
UM, THE SITE IS IN BOTH THE I 35 OVERLAY AND CENTER STREET OVERLAY DISTRICTS, UM, FOR NEW PROJECTS, NEW CONSTRUCTION IN THE OVERLAY DISTRICTS.
UM, THEY ARE REQUIRED TO COME THROUGH WITH A CUP FOR AESTHETICS, UM, THE ARCHITECTURAL RENDERINGS AND SO FORTH FOR THE EXTERIOR OF THE BUILDINGS.
UH, THE I 35 OVERLAY DISTRICT DOES HAVE SOME STANDARDS, UM, FOR THE EXTERIOR.
THE PROPOSED PROJECT MEETS THOSE STANDARDS.
UM, THE RESTROOM FACADE IS ALMOST A HUNDRED PERCENT BRICK MASONRY.
UM, BRICK MANER AROUND THE ENTIRE BUILDING, UM, WITH THE SMALL STUCCO DETAIL.
AND IT HAS A STANDING SEAM AND IT'S PROPOSED TO HAVE A STANDING SEAM METAL ROOF.
UM, ADDITIONAL SIDEWALKS DECOMPOSED GRANITE, UM, ADJACENT TO THE OAK TREES ON SITE.
UM, AND ADDITIONAL SEATING ARE GOING TO BE INCORPORATED.
AND ADDITIONALLY, NATIVE LANDSCAPING WILL INCLUDE THE INSTALLATION OF OVER 80 SHRUBS AND ORNAMENTAL GRASSES AS WELL AS A TREE.
UM, THIS PROJECT CAME THROUGH TO CITY COUNCIL, UM, WHICH APPROVED THE CONTRACT FOR DESIGN AND CONSTRUCTION OF THE RESTROOM BACK ON JANUARY 20TH OF THIS YEAR.
AND THE BUILDING FACADE HAS PRELIMINARY APPROVAL, UM, BY THE TEXAS HISTORIC COMMISSION, UH, SINCE THE PROJECT IS LOCATED IN A HISTORIC SITE.
UM, OVER HERE IS THE SITE PLAN.
I KNOW IT'S A LITTLE BIT HARD TO SEE SOME OF THOSE DETAILS.
UM, THAT'S THE OVERALL SITE PLAN.
AND ON THE NEXT SLIDE YOU CAN SEE THAT A LITTLE BIT BETTER IN COLOR AND YOU CAN SEE MORE OF THE LANDSCAPE DETAILS.
THE DECOMPOSED GRANITE AREA WITH THE PICNIC TABLES ARE SHOWN AS WELL AS THE LITTLE, UM, THE PLANTING AREA AS WELL AND THE, UH, NEW SIDEWALKS THAT ARE PROPOSED.
ON THIS SLIDE, WE HAVE THE THREE DIMENSIONAL RENDERING OF WHAT THE RESTROOM FACILITY IS GOING TO LOOK LIKE.
UM, YOU CAN SEE THE WATER FOUNTAIN AT THE FRONT THERE, UM, AND THE BRICK THAT SURROUNDS THE ENTIRE BUILDING.
UM, AND HERE ARE THE ELEVATIONS.
UM, THAT'S THE FRONT FACING VIEW AND SIDE VIEW.
AND THEN ON THE NEXT SLIDE WE'VE GOT THE REAR VIEW AND THEN THE, THE OTHER SIDE OF THE BUILDING AND STAFF HAVE REVIEWED THE REQUEST AND FOUND THE PROPOSAL TO BE COMPLIANT WITH THE I 35 AND CENTER STREET OVERLAY DISTRICT REGULATIONS, AS WELL AS OTHER APPLICABLE CITY CODES.
UH, STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL OF THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, UM, WITH TEXAS HISTORIC COMMISSION PROVIDING THE FINAL APPROVAL.
AND THE COMMISSIONERS HAVE THESE THREE FOLLOWING OPTIONS, UM, TO APPROVE THE COP AS PRESENTED.
UM, APPROVE THE COP WITH CONDITIONS OR TO DENY THE COP.
AND I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.
AND IF I CAN'T ANSWER ANYTHING, UM, WILL, CAN HELP ME OUT TOO.
I WOULD HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THE PLANTING AREA.
YOU'RE NOT, THIS, THE CURRENT SIDEWALK'S GONNA REMAIN THERE AND THE PLANTING AREA WILL BE HARD UP AGAINST IT THEN.
UM, LEMME GO BACK TO THE SLIDE.
YEAH, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO GO BACK.
UM, SO I SEE FROM THE CORNER DOWN THE LOWER RIGHT CORNER, THAT WOULD BE THE SIDEWALK HEADING TOWARDS THE GAZEBO AND INTO THE CENTER OF THE PARK.
THE PLANNING AREA WOULD BE HARD UP AGAINST THAT SIDEWALK OPPOSITE THE GAZEBO.
AND, AND THE GAZEBO ACCESS TO THE GAZEBO AND SO FORTH, NOTHING'S GONNA BE COMPROMISED.
IDEALLY IT WOULDN'T BE IN THE, THAT SQUARE BLOCK.
I UNDERSTAND WHY, BUT I IDEALLY IT WOULDN'T BE, I IT'S REAL CRAMPED IN THAT CORNER OF THE PARK AND, UM, IT'S THE ONLY PLACE TO PUT IT THERE, FRANKLY, AS FAR AS I CAN SEE.
BUT I WOULD HOPE THAT THEY WOULD BE VERY CAREFUL ABOUT IMPINGING ON THAT SIDEWALK.
[01:40:01]
ACT FLOW OF ACTIVITY AROUND THE GAZEBO, THAT IS A PLACE WHERE PEOPLE DO GATHER.IN FACT, UM, THERE ARE OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF.
WE NEED A MOTION AND A SECOND TO TAKE ACTION ON THE, UH, APPROVAL OF A CUP MOTION TO APPROVE AS REPRESENTED.
SECOND, I DIDN'T SEE WHO SAID THAT.
WE HAVE A MOTION TO, UM, APPROVE THE CP FROM VICE CHAIR STEGEL AND A SECOND FROM COMMISSIONER COPELAND.
IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT?
UM, I THINK THIS LOOKS NICE AND IT'S GONNA BE A WELCOME ADDITION.
I KNOW THAT I, I KNOW PEOPLE WHO GO TO THE PARK AND THEN THEY HAVE TO LEAVE BECAUSE THEY'VE GOT LITTLE ONES AND, UH, BLADDERS AND THINGS LIKE THAT,
SO HOPEFULLY THIS WILL ENCOURAGE MORE PEOPLE TO USE OUR PARKS AND STAY THERE FOR A LONGER TIME.
AND WELL DONE TO THE PARKS TEAM ON PUTTING THAT TOGETHER.
IT WILL TAKE AWAY MY EXCUSE TO LEAVE THE PARK EARLY WITH MY 2-YEAR-OLD.
SO YES,
WELL, THEY'LL JUST GET TIRED AND GO TO SLEEP.
THAT PROBABLY WORSE, RIGHT? OKAY.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF, UH, APPROVING THE MOTION, PLEASE SAY AYE.
[4) Consider approval of a Conditional Use Permit for proposed revisions to the building materials for a building located at 23150 IH-35. (Poco Loco Travel Center - CUP-24-0113) ]
WE'VE GOT CONSIDER APPROVAL OF A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR PROPOSED REVISIONS TO THE BUILDING MATERIALS FOR A BUILDING LOCATED AT 2 3 1 5 0 IH 35 POCO LOCO TRAVEL CENTER, CUP DASH 24 DASH 0 1 1 3 MS. SHARP.TONIGHT WE HAVE A REVISION TO A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR THE POCO LOCO THAT IS CURRENTLY UNDER CONSTRUCTION ON THE SOUTHBOUND I 35 FRONTAGE ROAD.
UM, THE APPLICANT IS SEEKING A REVISION TO THE PREVIOUSLY APPROVED PLANS.
UH, THE APPROVED PLANS CONSISTED PRIMARILY OF STONE VENEER AND GRAY BRICK.
UH, THE PROPOSED MATERIALS WILL REMAIN THE SAME, BUT THEY ARE PROPOSING A CHANGE IN COLOR, UH, TO RED BRICK ON THE SIDES AND REAR OF THE BUILDING.
UM, FOR SOME BACKGROUND, THE ORIGINAL CUP WAS APPROVED BACK IN NOVEMBER OF 2024, AND CONSTRUCTION BEGAN SHORTLY AFTER.
UH, WE WERE RECENTLY INFORMED THAT SOME OF THE BUILDING MATERIALS WERE CHANGED DURING CONSTRUCTION AND THE MATERIALS AND COLORS DID NOT MATCH WHAT WAS PREVIOUSLY APPROVED.
UM, SOME OF THE MATERIALS ARE BEING CORRECTED IN THE FIELD, SO YOU'LL SEE SOME IMAGES HERE IN A MINUTE.
UM, THAT PROBABLY DON'T LOOK LIKE WHAT WAS APPROVED.
SOME OF THAT IS BEING CORRECTED AS WE SPEAK.
UM, BUT THEY ARE PROPOSING TO MAKE SOME CHANGES TO THE, THE BRICK COLOR.
SO THE APPLICANT'S RATIONALE FOR THIS IS MATERIAL AVAILABILITY FOR THE, UM, GRAY BRICK AND ALSO SOME LEAD TIME CONSTRAINTS, UM, ON, ON ORDERING THAT MATERIAL.
SO THEY'RE OPTING FOR A MATERIAL THAT THEY'LL, THEY'RE ABLE TO GET, UH, MORE QUICKLY.
SO THEY ARE ALSO, UM, CLARIFYING THAT RED BRICK WILL BE USED ON THE FUEL CANOPY.
THE PREVIOUS ELEVATION SHOWED RED BRICK, BUT INCLUDED A NOTE STATING THAT THE COLOR OF THE BRICK WOULD MATCH THE COLOR OF THE BUILDING.
UM, STAFF INTERPRETED THAT TO MEAN IT WOULD MATCH THE GRAY BRICK THAT WAS PROPOSED FOR THE ENTIRE BUILDING.
UM, THEY WANT TO CLARIFY THAT THEIR INTENT IS TO USE RED BRICK.
SO HERE ARE THE APPROVED RENDERINGS.
THEY HAVE A WHITE KIND OF LIMESTONE, UM, ON EACH SIDE OF THE BUILDING.
THEY'VE GOT SOME GRAY BRICK ON THE FRONT AS WELL.
UM, BUT THEN THE, THE SIDES IN REAR ARE PRIMARILY GRAY BRICK WITH A LITTLE BIT OF STONE.
HERE ARE THE CURRENT CONDITIONS.
UM, AS YOU CAN SEE, THEY HAVE A NOTE ON HERE.
THEY'RE REMOVING SOME OF THIS, UM, WOOD LOOK TILES ON THE FRONT THAT WILL BE REPLACED WITH STONE TO MATCH THE APPROVED, UM, RENDERINGS AND ELEVATIONS ALSO BETTER LOOK AT AT WHAT THE FRONT IS CURRENTLY LOOKING LIKE.
SO THEY DO HAVE THE, UM, GRAY, BROWN, WHICHEVER YOU WANNA CALL IT, BRICK ON THE FRONT.
UM, AND THEN ON THE SIDES THEY'VE STARTED TO PUT RED BRICK AND THAT'S WHEN IT WAS BROUGHT TO OUR ATTENTION.
UM, SO NOW WE ARE HERE AND THEY'RE REQUESTING THAT CHANGE.
SO THE BACK CURRENTLY DOESN'T HAVE ANY BRICK ON IT, BUT THEIR INTENT IS TO INSTALL RED BRICK IF APPROVED TONIGHT.
AND HERE ARE THE PROPOSED ELEVATIONS UPDATED TO SHOW THEY WOULD BE KEEPING THE GRAY BRICK ON THE FRONT.
UM, IT'S JUST EVERYWHERE ELSE THAT THEY WOULD BE OPTING TO SWITCH TO RED BRICK AND THE SIDES, THE FUEL CANOPY.
[01:45:01]
SO YOUR OPTIONS HERE TONIGHT ARE TWO APPROVED AS PRESENTED WITH MODIFICATIONS OR DENY THE REQUEST.STAFF HAVE FOUND THE MATERIALS TO BE COMPLIANT WITH THE I 35, HOWEVER, UM, I 35 OVERLAY.
HOWEVER, SINCE THE CHANGES WERE MADE IN THE FIELD RATHER THAN THROUGH THE ESTABLISHED COP PROCESS, UM, STAFF IS BRINGING THIS REQUEST FORWARD AND ASKING THE COMMISSION TO CONSIDER AND MAKE A FINAL DETERMINATION.
UH, ANY QUESTIONS FROM UP HERE? YES, MR. COPELAND, MS. SHARP.
SO A FEW MONTHS AGO WE HAD A SIMILAR SITUATION WITH THE DEVELOPER WHERE IT WAS DISCOVERED AT THE TIME OF ISSUING A CO THAT THEY HAD NOT ADHERED TO THE CEP PLANS ON THAT HAD BEEN APPROVED AT THE TIME MM-HMM
IN THAT CASE, THAT WAS FOUND AFTER THE FACT.
AND IN THIS INSTANCE, THE APPLICANT IS PROACTIVELY WORKING WITH THE CITY TO IDENTIFY AND, AND WORK THROUGH THE DIFFERENCES.
AND IF THIS APPLICANT HAD BROUGHT TO THE COMMISSION AT THE BEGINNING OF THE PROCESS, THE CURRENT DESIGN AND WHERE IT'S AT TODAY, IT STILL COULD HAVE BEEN APPROVED BECAUSE IT OTHERWISE ADHERED TO THE I 35 OVERLAY.
AND THE ONLY DIFFERENCE TONIGHT IS BECAUSE IT'S NOT THAT PLAN THAT WAS APPROVED, BUT BOTH ARE EQUALLY APPROVABLE IN THEORY.
IS THAT FAIR? PRIMARILY, UM, IF THEY WERE ASKING TO KEEP THE TILES ON THE FRONT, WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MATERIAL IS.
UM, SO THAT COULD HAVE POTENTIALLY BEEN AN ISSUE UPFRONT IF IT DIDN'T MEET THE MASONRY REQUIREMENTS.
BUT AS FAR AS THE REST OF IT GOES, IF THAT'S WHAT THEY HAD PRESENTED TO THE COMMISSION FROM THE BEGINNING, UM, IT COULD HAVE IN THEORY BEEN APPROVED.
IF, IF THAT WAS THE COMMISSION'S DECISION AT THAT TIME IN THE ITEMS MENTIONED THAT ARE UNKNOWN, ARE STILL UNKNOWN AS OF TONIGHT.
THE, IT'S JUST THE, THE WOOD LOOK, UM, TILES ON THE FRONT HERE, UM, THAT ARE BEING REMOVED.
WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MATERIAL IS SPECIFICALLY.
UM, SO I COULDN'T SAY IF THEY WERE TO PROPOSE THIS, THAT IT WOULD BE APPROVED.
UM, BUT AS FAR AS THE, THE RED BRICK THAT WE'RE CONSIDERING HERE TONIGHT, IF THEY WERE TO HAVE PROPOSED THAT FROM THE BEGINNING, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT THE COMMISSION COULD HAVE APPROVED AND THE APPLICANT IS PROACTIVELY WORKING WITH CITY STAFF TO COME INTO ALIGNMENT IN SOME REGARD.
IS THAT FAIR? UM, THEY, THEY DID START INSTALLING THE RED BRICK WITHOUT ANY APPROVALS.
SO THEY WERE KIND OF, YOU KNOW, MADE AWARE OF, HEY, THOSE CHANGES NEED TO BE APPROVED BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION.
THEY HAVEN'T BEEN ISSUED A STOP WORK ORDER OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
WE'RE TRYING TO WORK WITH THEM.
UM, SO IT'S, IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF BOTH.
UM, WE ARE, YOU KNOW, TRYING TO WORK WITH THEM, AS I SAID, BUT THEY DID TECHNICALLY, UM, MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS WITHOUT APPROVALS.
BUT AT LEAST THEY'RE RESPONSIVE TO THE DISCUSSION, CORRECT? YES.
AND WAS THIS A CONTRACTOR SUBSTITUTION WHERE YES.
OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? IT LOOKS LIKE COMMISSIONER HILDE IS TRYING TO TALK TO US, BUT I CAN'T HEAR HIM.
CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW? YES, SIR.
I, AND THIS IS, THIS IS ALSO BASED ON AVAILABILITY OF THE MATERIAL, THE, OR IT, WAS IT THE ORIGINAL MATERIAL'S NOT AVAILABLE, IS THAT CORRECT? I DON'T BELIEVE THAT IT'S NOT AVAILABLE.
I BELIEVE IT WAS A TIMING ISSUE FOR, FOR WHEN IT WAS GOING TO BE AVAILABLE AND I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THE LEAD TIME WAS, BUT I KNOW IT WAS OKAY.
SO NOT RE NOT REASONABLY AVAILABLE ANYWAY.
YEAH, IT WAS GONNA SLOW DOWN THE, THE, THE DEVELOPER'S TIMELINE.
I'M NOT SURE HOW BY HOW MUCH THOUGH.
I'D LIKE TO MAKE THE MOTION THAT WE APPROVE AS PRESENTED.
I'VE GOT ONE LAST QUESTION FOR STAFF AND THEN, UH, WE WILL MOVE FORWARD WITH YOUR MOTION.
I I SEE ON THE PROPOSED ELEVATIONS, I JUST HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THE MATERIAL.
'CAUSE I'M NOT A BUILDER, I'M NOT FAMILIAR WITH THESE THINGS.
SO THE PART OF THE BUILDING THAT'S ALREADY BEEN CONSTRUCTED WITH THE, UM, STONE VENEER LIMESTONE, UH, THERE'S GOING TO BE SOMETHING CALLED ADHERED STONE VENEER ON THE AREA WHERE THOSE WOOD LOOK TILES WERE, WERE TAKEN DOWN.
DO WE KNOW IF THE ADHERED STONE VENEER IS GOING TO AGE DIFFERENTLY THAN THE REGULAR STONE VENEER? WILL IT BE AS DURABLE? WILL IT HAVE ANY ISSUES THAT MIGHT DOWN THE ROAD? CAUSE SOME, YOU KNOW, UNSIGHTLINESS OR WILL THEY BE EXPECTED TO LOOK AND AGE IN A CONSISTENT WAY? UM, TO OUR KNOWLEDGE IT SHOULD BE ESSENTIALLY THE SAME PRODUCT.
UM, I, THERE SHOULDN'T BE ANY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN WHAT'S ALREADY BEEN INSTALLED AND WHAT'S NOW BEING REPLACED.
UM, IT COULD JUST BE THAT ONE OF THEM'S MORE OF LIKE A THIN SET VENEER VERSUS, UM, I BELIEVE THE ORIGINAL WAS ALSO VENEER.
SO IT'S NOT LIKE IT WAS A FULL STONE
[01:50:01]
VERSUS VENEER.NOW, UM, THEY SHOULD BE RELATIVELY THE SAME.
OKAY, SO IT'S GOT GOOD, GOOD STICKUM ON THE, ON THE BACK FOR THE ADHERED STONE VENEER? SHOULD BE, YES.
UM, I DON'T HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF ON THIS ONE, SO DOES ANYONE ELSE HAVE A QUESTION? ALRIGHT, WE HAVE A MOTION THAT GOT THROWN OUT FROM COMMISSIONER HILDRETH TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THIS.
IS THERE A SECOND ON THAT? SECOND? OKAY.
ANY DISCUSSION? OKAY, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF APPROVING THIS UP, PLEASE SAY AYE.
[5) Recognition of Daniel Serrato for his dedicated years of service on the Planning and Zoning Commission. ]
NEXT.WE HAVE A VERY EXCITING HONOR OF RECOGNIZING DANIEL SERATO FOR HIS DEDICATED YEARS OF SERVICE ON THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION, MR. LUTENS.
OKAY, SO, UH, I'M GONNA RECOGNIZE, UH, DANIEL TODAY, SO THE STRANGER YOU SEE IN THE BACK OF THE ROOM, MR. SERRANO, I KNOW IT'S BEEN A WHILE SINCE Y'ALL SEEN HIM.
UM, WE WANT TO THANK HIM FOR, FOR THE TIME HE SERVED, UM, EVEN THOUGH IT WAS A SHORT, UH, TIMEFRAME, SEPTEMBER 23 THROUGH DECEMBER, 2025.
UM, HE WAS VERY COMMITTED TO THIS BOARD, ASKED A LOT OF QUESTIONS, UH, ACTIVELY ENGAGED IN TRAINING, UM, UH, WAS PART OF OUR IMPACT ADVISORY FEE.
YOU KNOW, A LOT OF CONVERSATIONS ON OUR PROJECTS, UH, AND A LOT OF GOOD COMMENTS, UH, DURING OUR, OUR REVIEWS OF, OF CUP.
SO AGAIN, THANK DANIEL, WE APPRECIATE IT AND THANK YOU VERY MUCH, UM, AND LOOK FORWARD TO HOPEFULLY HAVING YOU BACK ONE DAY.
PUT THE COMPUTER IN THERE FOR ME.
IT'S BEEN, IT'S BEEN FUN TO SERVE WITH YOU AND I WISH YOU ALL THE BEST IN YOUR, IN YOUR NEW SPOT.
[6) Hold a public hearing to receive comments on the proposed amendment to the Program Year 2025 Annual Action Plan for the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) Community Development Block Grant (CDBG) Program. Public Hearing ]
UP, WE HAVE HOLD A PUBLIC HEARING TO RECEIVE COMMENTS ON THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT TO THE PROGRAM YEAR 2025 ANNUAL ACTION PLAN FOR THE US DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING AND URBAN DEVELOPMENT HOOD COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT BLOCK GRANT, CDBG PROGRAM.SO THERE IS A PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS ITEM.
I'M GONNA GO AHEAD AND OPEN THAT NOW AT 8 29.
SEEING NONE, I'M GOING TO CLOSE IT AT 8 29.
ALRIGHT, MS. SHARP, GOOD EVENING.
UM, SO THIS IS REALLY INTENDED TO FILL ONE OF OUR REQUIREMENTS, UM, FOR HUD.
THERE'S GONNA BE LOTS OF ACRONYMS THROUGHOUT THIS, SO MY APOLOGIES.
UM, BUT, UM, AS PART OF OUR CREATING OUR ANNUAL ACTION PLAN, WE'RE REQUIRED TO CONSULT THE PUBLIC STAKEHOLDERS, THINGS LIKE THAT, TO, UM, GAIN FEEDBACK ON OUR PROPOSED PLAN.
SO THIS IS, WE'RE KIND OF USING Y'ALL TO, TO FULFILL THAT PUBLIC MEETING REQUIREMENT.
UM, SO JUST TO KIND OF GIVE Y'ALL AN OVERVIEW, WE'RE ENTITLED OR WE'RE IDENTIFIED AS AN ENTITLEMENT CITY, UM, WITH HUD AND RECEIVE BLOCK GRANT FUNDING ANNUALLY.
UM, THE AMOUNT IS DETERMINED BY A STATUTORY FORMULA, SO WE RECEIVE A DIFFERENT AMOUNT EACH YEAR.
WE JUST GOT OUR ALLOCATION FOR NEXT YEAR, AND IT IS MORE THAN WE THOUGHT, SO THAT'S AWESOME.
UM, FOR THE CURRENT YEAR THAT WE'RE IN, WE ARE, I KIND OF ALREADY WENT THROUGH THAT.
UM, WE ARE PROPOSING SOME CHANGES TO OUR PLANS.
UM, AND SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE TONIGHT.
WE HAVE TO BASICALLY RESUBMIT EVERYTHING TO HUD ALL OVER AGAIN.
UM, SO THAT IS WHAT WE'RE HERE FOR TONIGHT.
WE ARE PROPOSING TO REALLOCATE FUNDING FROM A WASTEWATER IMPROVEMENT PROJECT TO A SIDEWALK PROJECT THAT WILL BENEFIT LOW TO MODERATE INCOME AREAS IN THE CITY.
SO THE ORIGINAL PROJECT WAS THE QUAIL RIDGE WASTEWATER IMPROVEMENTS.
[01:55:01]
UM, IT WAS FOR INSTALLATION OF FIRST TIME WASTEWATER SERVICE IN THE QUAIL RIDGE SUBDIVISION, AND WE HAD, UM, A LITTLE OVER $277,000 ALLOCATED IN CDBG FUNDING FOR THAT.OUR PROPOSED PROJECT WILL BE, UM, BRENT BOULEVARD SIDEWALK IMPROVEMENTS.
SO THIS WOULD BE CONSTRUCTION AND REPLACEMENT OF SIDEWALKS, A DA COMPLIANT CURB, RAMPS AND RELATED PEDESTRIAN SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS ALONG BRENT BOULEVARD.
AND IN THE PARK STEEPLECHASE SUBDIVISION.
THE ALLOCATION AMOUNT IS NOT CHANGING.
SO THIS IS TRULY JUST MOVING THOSE FUNDS FROM A WASTEWATER INFRASTRUCTURE PROJECT TO THE SIDEWALK INFRASTRUCTURE PROJECT.
UM, AS I SAID, THE ALLOCATION IS NOT CHANGING.
UM, AND THIS IS COMPLIANT WITH THE NATIONAL OBJECTIVE COMPLIANCE REQUIREMENTS FOR HUD.
AS YOU CAN SEE, EVERYTHING IN THE GREEN HERE ON THIS MAP IS A LOW TO MODERATE INCOME AREA.
UM, AND SO THIS KIND OF OUTLINES THE, THE SERVICE AREA FOR THIS PROJECT.
AGAIN, COMMUNITY BENEFITS IMPROVED PEDESTRIAN SAFETY, A DA ACCESSIBILITY, INCREASED WALKABILITY, UM, BENEFIT TO LMI AREAS AND ALSO SUPPORTS THE GOALS OF OUR FIVE YEAR CONSOLIDATED PLAN THAT IS ALREADY APPROVED BY HUD.
SO THE PUBLIC NOTICE HAS BEEN PROVIDED, PROVIDED IN ACCORDANCE WITH HUD GUIDELINES, AND WE JUST HAD THE OPPORTUNITY FOR PUBLIC COMMENT.
WE'VE ALSO HAD A PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD OPEN FOR THE LAST 30 DAYS.
WE JUST HELD THAT PUBLIC HEARING.
UM, ANY COMMENTS RECEIVED EITHER TONIGHT OR IN THAT 30 DAY PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD WILL BE INCORPORATED INTO THE PRO PRO WORDS ARE NOT COMING OUT TONIGHT, SORRY, UM, INTO THE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS.
AND THEN CITY COUNCIL WILL CONSIDER, CONSIDER THE AMENDMENT AT THE MAY 5TH COUNCIL MEETING, AND THEN WE WILL SUBMIT EVERYTHING TO HUD FOR THEIR APPROVAL.
UM, IT HAD BEEN DISCUSSED FOR SOME TIME, HAD IT NOT, THAT THIS GRANT WOULD PROBABLY BE APPLIED TO SIDEWALKS.
SO THAT WAS ONE OF OUR, OUR TOP PRIORITY, UM, NEEDS AS IDENTIFIED IN OUR FIVE YEAR CONSOLIDATED PLAN.
UM, SO AT LEAST FOR THIS YEAR AND, AND LIKELY THE NEXT FISCAL YEAR, UM, WE'LL PROBABLY BE LOOKING AT, SO NOTHING WAS PROMPTED BY COUNCIL OR OTHER CHANGES? IT'S BEEN PRETTY MUCH, YES.
WE, WHEN LOOKING THE, THE QUAIL RIDGE PROJECT WAS ANOTHER KIND OF TOP PRIORITY.
UM, BUT WHEN ANALYZING THE, THE FEASIBILITY OF THAT PROJECT, THE TIMING JUST WASN'T THERE.
UM, WE HAVE SOME COMPLIANCE, UH, REQUIREMENTS THAT WE HAVE TO MEET IN TERMS OF WHEN WE SPEND THE MONEY, UM, AND WE JUST WEREN'T GONNA BE ABLE TO MEET THAT.
THE PROJECT JUST WASN'T THERE YET.
SO IT DOESN'T LEAVE THEM UP THE CREEK? NO.
IT'S, IT'S STILL, UM, A PROJECT FOR THE CITY TO WORK ON.
IT JUST PROBABLY WON'T USE CDBG FUNDS.
HOW WIDE ARE THE SIDEWALKS?
YEAH, THIS PROJECT WAS REALLY KIND OF WORKING OFF.
I DON'T KNOW THAT THIS YEAR WAS THE FIRST YEAR THAT WE WERE ENTITLEMENT CITY AND WE USED, UM, AMBERWOOD, UM, RAMPS AND SOME SIDEWALK IMPROVEMENTS IN THAT, UM, IN THAT EXISTING SUBDIVISION AND REPLACED 'EM THERE.
AND IT WAS A REALLY SUCCESSFUL PROJECT.
SO WE APPRECIATED KIND OF HOLISTICALLY HOW IT HELPED, UH, THAT NEIGHBORHOOD AND WE'RE HOPING TO DUPLICATE IT HERE IN THIS, THIS BRENTWOOD NEIGHBORHOOD.
YEAH, WE GOT LOTS OF POSITIVE FEEDBACK ON THAT PROJECT IN THAT PARTICULAR NEIGHBORHOOD.
IS IT GONNA BE PHYSICALLY HARD TO ACTUALLY GET FIVE FOOT SIDEWALKS IN ON THAT RIGHT AWAY? UM, I KNOW THERE ARE ALREADY EXISTING SIDEWALKS.
UM, SO IF THERE'S ALREADY AN EXISTING FOUR FOOT SIDEWALK BECAUSE THIS NEIGHBORHOOD HAS BEEN AROUND, IT'S POSSIBLE THAT THEY CONTINUE WITH THAT.
UM, BUT ANY NEW SIDEWALKS WOULD BE COMPLIANT WITH, WITH CURRENT STANDARDS.
UM, AND WHERE THEY'RE ABLE TO, TO WIDEN THEM TO FIVE FEET, I BELIEVE THEY WILL.
BUT THAT LEVEL OF DETAIL HASN'T NECESSARILY BEEN EVALUATED JUST YET.
AND THE PRIMARY DRIVER FOR THAT CHANGE IS THAT THE QUAIL RIDGE PROJECT JUST WOULD NOT LIKELY MEET THE TIMELINES FOR THE EXPENDITURE OF THE FUNDING, BUT THAT THERE'S STILL, UH, OBJECTIVES AND GOALS TO COMPLETE THAT PROJECT AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE.
YES, SO THE, THAT PROJECT, AGAIN, IT, THE TIMING, WE PRETTY MUCH HAVE ONE YEAR TO, TO COMPLETE THIS AND SPEND ALL OF THE MONEY.
UM, AND FROM THE TIME WE ACTUALLY GET APPROVALS ON THAT ANNUAL ACTION PLAN, UM, WHICH WE SUBMIT IN AUGUST, SOMETIMES IT'S NOT APPROVED UNTIL DECEMBER OR JANUARY AND YOU'VE, YOU'RE ALREADY A COUPLE MONTHS INTO THE FISCAL YEAR, YOU'VE GOT ENGINEERING AND ALL OF THAT.
UM, IT JUST TURNED INTO A MUCH MORE COMPLEX PROJECT THAN WE INITIALLY THOUGHT.
[02:00:01]
OKAY, NEXT UP[7) Receive a report, hold a discussion, and provide staff feedback regarding a proposed mixed-use development (Project Philo).]
WE HAVE RECEIVE A REPORT, HOLD A DISCUSSION, AND PROVIDE STAFF FEEDBACK REGARDING A PROPOSED MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT PROJECT.UH, EVERYBODY CAN HEAR ME NOW.
SO, UH, TONIGHT, UH, STAFF REPORT REGARDING YOUR PHILOMENA PRO, UH, PUD, UM, THIS IS PROJECT PHILO HAS BEEN NOTICED ON OTHER AGENDAS.
UH, THE APPLICANTS WILL BE INTRODUCING THIS.
THEY'RE REFERRING TO THIS AS A CROSSROADS DEVELOPMENT.
UM, SO A LITTLE BACK BACKGROUND ON THIS PROPERTY.
UM, THIS PROPERTY WAS ANNEXED AND ZONED AGRICULTURAL IN OH TWO.
UM, INITIAL DISCUSSIONS REGARDING POSSIBLE MIXED USE ZONING.
DISTRICT MXD STARTED WITH STAFF IN JANUARY OF 2023.
UH, MXD ZONING IS A FAIRLY UNIQUE, UH, ZONING, OR NOT UNIQUE, BUT NEW ZONING DISTRICT THAT HASN'T BEEN UTILIZED, UH, UH, MUCH IN THE CITY.
AND SO IT PRESENTED SOME CHALLENGES, UH, WHICH IS WHY THE DEVELOPER LOOKED AT GOING THE PUD ROUTE.
UM, THEIR PUD WAS SUBMITTED IN AUGUST OF THAT 23, AND THEN THEY SUBMITTED A DA TO ACCOMPANY THE PUD, UH, THE FOLLOWING YEAR.
UM, THIS PUD AND DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT IS PRETTY BASIC WHEN IT COMES TO KIND OF LEVEL OF DETAIL THAT MAYBE SOME OF THE THINGS THAT YOU'VE SEEN IN THE PAST.
UM, THEY'RE LOOKING FOR, UH, BASE ZONING LAND USES OF RETAIL SERVICES, ABOUT 177,000 SQUARE FEET OF COMMERCIAL, AND THEN ABOUT 535 FEET, UH, 535 UNITS OF, UH, MULTIFAMILY.
UH, THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN DOES, UH, IDENTIFY THIS AREA AS URBAN MIXED USE.
UM, SO THE PROPOSED PUD WOULD MEET THE, THE FUTURE LAND USE PLAN.
THEY'RE ALSO DONATING, UH, LAND FOR A RIGHT OF WAY, UH, FOR A ROUNDABOUT.
UM, AND THAT IS A 0.2, TWO ACRES IS ROUGHLY, HAS A $150,000 VALUE.
UM, STAFF IS REQUESTING FEEDBACK REGARDING THIS PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT.
AGAIN, FEEDBACK MAY INCLUDE OVERALL DESIGN, LAND USES, DENSITY, LANDSCAPING, UM, KIND OF ANY OTHER, YOUR OTHER CONCERNS OR ISSUES.
UM, WE'RE JUST ASKING THAT YOU PROVIDE DIRECTION REGARDING ITEMS YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSED, UH, DURING THE PUD REVIEW PROCESS.
UM, SO STAFF, UH, UH, HAS BEEN WORKING WITH THE APPLICANT.
WE'VE GONE THROUGH SEVERAL ROUNDS, KIND OF FINE TUNED SOME NEGOTIATING POINTS.
UM, THEY WILL BE LOOKING AT MAKING SOME MODIFICATIONS AND THEN RESUBMITTING THAT TO STAFF FOR KIND OF THE, THE, THE FINAL PHASE OF, OF REVIEW, UH, TO GET THAT BACK TO Y'ALL.
SO NOW'S THE TIME TO, TO SPEAK IF YOU WANT ANYTHING TO INCLUDE IN THAT.
UM, I WILL BE INTRODUCING THE DEVELOPER AND THEN I WILL TURN IT OVER TO THEM, UH, TO HANDLE YOUR QUESTIONS.
UM, THIS IS KAPLAN DEVELOPMENT.
THEY GOT 40 PLUS YEARS OF RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL EXPERIENCE, UM, BACKGROUNDS IN COMMERCIAL CIVIL ENGINEERING, LENDING, CONSTRUCTION, UH, FINANCIAL ANALYSIS.
UH, AND THEY HAVE ONE LOCAL PROJECT, UH, THEY WORKED ON PARKED IN SQUARE SLASH GREG GARDENS.
UM, AND HAVING SAID THAT, I WILL GO AHEAD AND TURN THAT OVER TO SOMEONE FROM THE TEAM.
IP I'M, UH, MICHAEL LINEHAN WITH LSI REPRESENTING KAPLAN DEVELOPMENT.
UM, AND THIS IS OUR PRESENTATION FOR THE CROSSROADS DISTRICT AS WE HAVE BEEN CALLING IT.
UM, SO JUST SO WE'RE, UH, ALL ON THE SAME PAGE OF WHERE THE SITE IS LOCATED IS JUST SOUTH OF THE HOSPITAL ON, UH, UH, WITH FINA DRIVE GOING RIGHT THROUGH THE MIDDLE OF IT.
UM, UH, SO THIS SHOWS OUR CONCEPTUAL, UH, LAND USE PLAN AND SITE PLAN.
UM, WE DO HAVE, UH, MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT WHERE WE'VE PUSHED THE, UM, THE BUILDINGS OUT TOWARDS, UH, THE RIGHT OF WAY, AS IS CALLED FOR AN MXD ZONING, UH, WHICH SCREENS A LOT OF THE SURFACE PARKING AWAY FROM THE KIND OF WALKABLE STREETS.
UM, WE'VE ALSO INCORPORATED A, UH, A PEDESTRIAN GREENWAY THAT GOES THROUGH BOTH THE MULTI-FAMILY SITES SO THAT WE CAN CONNECT, UH, THE RESIDENTS TO GREEN SPACE AS WELL AS THE, UH, COMMERCIAL SPACE, UM, THAT ABUTS THAT ON THE NORTH SIDE.
UM, FURTHER TO THE WEST, UH, IS STILL RS DONATING, BUT WE HAVE CON UH, CONCEPTUALIZED, UH, HOTEL SITES IN THAT LOCATION.
UM, AND THERE'S BEEN A GOOD AMOUNT OF DEMAND, UH, BASED OFF MARKET FEEDBACK FOR, UH, HOTEL SITES IN THIS LOCATION.
UH, SO GOING TO THE MXD ZONE THAT SHOWS IN, UH, YELLOW HERE.
UM, SO JUST A FEW INSPIRATION IMAGES OF THE TYPE OF, UM, UH, MULTIFAMILY DEVELOPMENT THAT THAT WOULD ACCOMMODATE, UH, GIVING THAT MORE, UH, URBAN MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT AESTHETIC, UH, WHILE STILL ALLOWING SURFACE PARKING, UM, WHICH IS SUPPORTED BY THE MARKET.
UH, THEN GOING INTO THE RS ZONED AREAS, UH, SHOWN IN RED IN THE MAP HERE, UH, WITH SOME, UM, RETAIL SERVICES, RESTAURANTS, UH, OFFICE AND THE, UH, AFFIRMATION HOTELS, UH, TO SUPPORT, UM, UH, DIFFERENT COMMERCIAL USES, UH, ESPECIALLY ADJACENT TO THE HOSPITAL.
[02:05:02]
UH, THIS JUST SHOWS, UH, MORE OF THE GREEN SPACE, UH, THAT HAS BEEN INCORPORATED INTO THIS DESIGN.UH, SO THAT WE HAVE COMMERCIAL AND RESIDENTIAL CONNECTING TO OPEN SPACES THAT ALLOWS FOR PRODUCTION CONNECTIVITY THROUGHOUT THE SITE.
UH, AND THIS, THIS SHOWS EVERYTHING PUT TOGETHER WITH OUR, UH, MXD BASE ZONING AND OUR RS ZONING, UH, AND HIGHLIGHTING THE, UH, THE GREEN SPACE THROUGH THE CENTER SPINE OF THIS DEVELOPMENT.
SO, UM, THE ZONING IS CONSISTENT WITH THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP.
UM, AND, UM, WANTED TO ALSO HIGHLIGHT THAT THERE'S NO REAL INCENTIVE BEING REQUESTED BY KAPLAN DEVELOPMENT.
SO NO PIT ORTS OR ANYTHING OF THAT NATURE OR, UH, SIGNIFICANT VARIANCES TO CODE.
THERE'S A COUPLE OF CHALLENGES WITH THE MXD BASED ZONING, UH, THAT JUST MAKE IT CHALLENGING TO DEVELOP, UM, WITH THE, THE CURRENT MARKET STATE OF, UM, OF THE AREA.
UH, SO THERE'S JUST MINOR, UM, VARIANCES THAT WE WE'D BE LOOKING FOR THERE IN TERMS OF, UM, PARKING AND, UM, VERTICAL MIXED USE PERCENTAGES AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE.
UM, AND WHAT THE CITY RECEIVES OUT OF THIS IS THE URBAN WALKABLE MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT CONSISTENT WITH THE, UH, FUTURE LAND USE MAP.
UM, DONATION OF THE RIGHT OF WAY, UH, AS JASON MENTIONED, IS, UH, ROUGHLY $150,000 VALUE THAT THE, UH, LANDOWNER IS, UM, DONATING TO THE CITY FOR THAT ROUNDABOUT.
AND THEN, UH, ENHANCED COHESIVE DESIGN STANDARDS.
UH, THERE'S A PORTION OF THE SITE THAT'S IN THE I 35 OVERLAY, BUT WE'VE TAKEN INFORMATION FROM THAT I 35 OVERLAY AND BAKED IT INTO THE OVERALL, UH, POD AND DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT.
THINGS SUCH AS, UH, CONSISTENT SIGNAGE STANDARDS, UH, 60% MASONRY FACADES, UH, STREET TREES AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE TO MAKE IT A MORE COMPREHENSIVE, UM, PLAN FOR THE AREA.
AND THEN, UH, WE, WE'LL BE DOING A TRAFFIC IMPACT ANALYSIS, UM, AS PART OF THE, THE P AND THEN, UH, THE CITY ALSO BENEFITS FROM THE FULL PROPERTY TAXES AND HOTEL OCCUPANCY TAX AND SALES TAX.
SO THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND, UH, WE APPRECIATE YOUR FEEDBACK, UH, TO HELP US MAKE REVISIONS INTO OUR NEXT PRESENTATION.
I'M ONE, ONE QUESTION OR COMMENT I'D LIKE TO ADD IN.
UM, ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH, ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE THIRD WAY, UH, TYPE TYPE PROJECTS IN THE INCORPORATING THOSE INTO THIS? I LOVE THE GREEN, THE GREEN SPACE AND STUFF, BUT YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A, WE HAVE OUR WORK LOCATION, WE HAVE OUR HOME LOCATION, A A THIRD WAY LOCATION'S, A A A SPOT WHERE PEOPLE MIGHT GATHER, UM, AROUND IN SHOPPING MALLS, THEY'LL OFTEN USE LIKE A FIRE PIT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
HAVE YOU LOOKED AT ANY CONSIDERATION OF SOMETHING LIKE THAT TO INCORPORATE THAT INTO THE GREEN SPACE THAT YOU HAVE? UH, NOT CURRENTLY.
THAT'S SOMETHING WE WAS CERTAINLY, UH, LOOKING INTO THE NEXT ONE.
AND YOU, YOU SAID THIRD WAY LOCATION IS THE TERM.
I, I, THAT THAT'S WHAT I'VE HEARD IT CALLED.
I, I'M TRYING TO REMEMBER THE EXACT TERM.
IT'S BEEN A FEW YEARS SINCE I'VE WORKED WITH MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT, BUT IT, IT'S ACTUALLY SOMETHING THAT, UM, UH, IS A STANDARDIZED CONCEPT WITH THIRD WAY.
UH, AS AN EXAMPLE, YOU HAVE MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT.
YOU MIGHT HAVE, UH, IN, IN SOME CASES IN C CITY OF SEATTLE'S EXAMPLE, THEY HAVE, UM, SOME GREEN SPACE UP ON A ROOF OF AN APARTMENT BUILDING AND THEY HAVE, UH, YOU KNOW, BENCHES AND AREAS FOR PEOPLE TO GATHER THE COMMUNITY TO GATHER.
IT'S LIKE THE, THE THIRD PLACE.
THAT'S WHAT I'M, THAT'S, THAT'S, I'M THINKING OF NOT THIRD WAY, THIRD PLACE.
IN, IN REGARDS TO KIND OF LOOKING AT THE LIVE, WORK, PLAY KIND OF, UM, COMPONENT OF IT.
AND CERTAINLY, AND, AND I WOULD SAY A LOT G AND LOT H UH, WHERE THOSE TWO COME TOGETHER, WE HAVE THE GREEN SPACE BETWEEN THAT AND THE INTENT THERE WAS THAT WE WOULD HAVE KIND OF BACK PATIO SPACE FOR THE COMMERCIAL, UH, AS WELL AS THE AMENITY SPACE FOR THE MULTIFAMILY SPACE.
SO YOU KIND OF HAVE THAT INTERMINGLING THIRD PLACE IN THAT LOCATION.
ARE YOU WILLING TO YEAH, I'LL SAY RIGHT IN FRONT, I'M A STRONG BELIEVER IN, IN MIXED USE DEVELOPMENT.
SO ARE YOU WILLING TO, UH, AS PART OF THE PUD UH, AGREE TO SOME, UH, PERFORMANCE METRICS REGARDING PHASING OF THE PROJECT AND COMPLETION THEREOF? UH, I'D HAVE TO DISCUSS THAT WITH THE DEVELOPMENT TEAM, BUT SOMETHING WE CAN TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION AS WE GO INTO THE NEXT STAGES.
I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE'D BE INTERESTED IN.
UM, ALSO, UH, HOW MUCH IS THERE IN THE MARKET? YOU MEANT TO MENTIONED THE MARKET A COUPLE OF TIMES, I BELIEVE.
HOW MUCH INTEREST IN THE MARKET IS THERE OUT THERE THROWING MONEY INTO MIXED USE WHERE YOU'VE GOT RETAIL ON THE FIRST FLOOR, OR IS THAT STILL A DIFFICULT THING TO FIND FINANCING FOR? IT'S STILL CHALLENGING THIS, UH, THIS POD DOES, UH, ACCOMMODATE FIRST FLOOR RETAIL IN THE MXD ZONED AREAS.
UM, IT, IT IS, I I WILL SAY JUST AN
[02:10:01]
EXPERIENCE IN MULTI-FAMILY DEVELOPMENT THAT GETTING THE FINANCING FOR RETAIL AND THAT THEIR LEVEL IS, IT CAN BE CHALLENGING.UM, AND COMMENTS TOWARDS THE MARKET IS JUST THE, UH, MXD CALLS FOR STRUCTURED PARKING AND JUST THE COST OF THAT AND THE CURRENT RENTAL RATES IN THE AREA ARE JUST REALLY CHALLENGING.
AND SO THAT'S WHY THIS PROPOSES SOME OF THE INTENT OF MXD WHILE STILL ALLOWING THE SURFACE PARKING.
YEAH, BECAUSE I, I, I LIKE INTENT, BUT I ALSO LIKE FULFILLMENT.
SO, UH, I KNOW THE FINANCING FOR THE RETAILS IS HARD, BUT I'D LIKE TO SEE IT.
I'M INTERESTED IN HEARING WHAT THE DEVELOPMENT TEAM HAS IN RESPONSE TO THE IDEA OF DOING THIS IN PHASES WITH COM.
YOU KNOW, VERY CONCRETE, UNDERSTANDABLE, UH, PERFORMANCE STANDARDS.
UH, JUST SO THAT WE ARE VERY CLEAR ABOUT WHAT WE'RE GETTING, THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT PARCEL OF LAND.
I'VE DRIVEN THROUGH HERE ON PHILOMENA MANY TIMES, AND I THINK ANYBODY KNOWS THIS PART OF TOWN KNOWS THAT IT IS REALLY QUITE IMPORTANT TO THE DEVELOPMENT THERE.
IF YOU, IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT, THE ROUNDABOUTS ON THE EAST SIDE OF IT ARE THERE FOR A REASON BECAUSE DAISY LANE IN THAT ENTIRE AREA IS SO BUSY WITH TRAFFIC MM-HMM
AND YOU'VE GOT MAJOR COMMERCIAL AND RETAIL UP BEHIND YOU THERE.
SO I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOMETHING SPECIAL BUILT THERE THAT PROVIDES GOOD RESIDENCES, GOOD, UH, WALKABLE SPACE WITH GOOD RETAIL.
AND SO IF YOU CAN BRING THAT TO THIS PLAN, I'M MORE THAN WILLING TO HEAR MORE.
UM, I HAVE A QUESTION MORE, MORE TO EDUCATE MYSELF THAN I, I, I LIKE WHAT YOU'VE PRESENTED.
WHEN WE TALK ABOUT LIVE WORKPLACE, SOMEHOW WORK ALWAYS EQUALS RETAIL.
UM, CLEARLY YOU'VE MADE SOME DEMAND DRIVEN DECISIONS AS YOU'VE PUT THIS TOGETHER.
WHAT, IS THERE A DEMAND? WHAT IS THE DEMAND FOR LIKE COMMERCIAL OFFICE SPACE, ANYTHING LIKE THAT? OR IS THE DEMAND FOR WORK IN KYLE JUST RETAIL STORES? UH, SO I, I CAN'T ANSWER THAT VERY SPECIFICALLY.
JUST NOT HAVING FULL MARKET DATA TO THROW NUMBERS BACK AT YOU.
BUT I, I'LL SAY AT LEAST WHAT WE'VE ACCOMMODATED IN THE PLAN IS, UH, LOT A ON THAT EAST SIDE IS INTENDED TO BE OFFICE SPACE.
UM, SO THERE IS, UH, UH, EVEN THOUGH, UM, YOU KNOW, CONCEPTUAL LAND PLAN WITH RETAIL HOTEL OFFICE THAT, UM, WE FEEL SOMETHING OF THIS SIZE NEEDS TO HAVE SOME KIND OF OFFICE SPACE IN THERE.
SO MANY OF THESE TALENT, SO THANK YOU.
EARLY YOUR PRESENTATION, SIR, YOU MENTIONED THAT YOU WERE, SORRY, EXCLUDE, UH, EXPLORING THE PUT IDEA IN ORDER TO GET MORE FLEXIBILITY ON THE PARKING REQUIREMENTS.
COULD YOU SPEAK MORE TOWARDS THAT? YOU'RE TRYING TO GAIN MORE PARKING, LESS PARKING CHANGES IN PARKING.
WHAT, WHAT WAS THE, THE CONTEXT? SO, UH, MXD CALLS FOR STRUCTURED PARKING MM-HMM
AND, UH, A SURFACE PARKING SPACE IS ABOUT $3,500.
A STRUCTURED PARKING SPACE CAN RANGE FROM 20 TO 40,000.
AND SO JUST WITH THE RENTAL RATES THERE ARE THERE, WE, IN ORDER TO MAKE THIS A SUCCESSFUL DEVELOPMENT, WE WOULD NEED SOME RELIEF FROM THE PARKING STANDARDS IN MXD.
UM, SO THAT'S WHAT KIND OF LED TO GOING THROUGH A PUD RATHER THAN JUST STRAIGHT UP BAY ZONING.
I KNOW I WOULD BE IN, IN MORE FAVOR TRYING TO FIND A WAY TO REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF SURFACE AREA THAT IS DEDICATED TO THE PARKING, BECAUSE AS YOU LOOK AT IT, IT IS A LARGE PROPORTION OF THAT ENTIRE PLOT OF LAND.
AND AS YOU ARE EXPLORING THIS TOO, IT MIGHT JUST BE THAT THESE MAPS AREN'T DETAILED ENOUGH.
THEY'RE CONCEPTUAL, THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT FINAL OBVIOUSLY.
BUT I, I WANNA THINK ABOUT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE IN LOT G TRYING TO GET TO LOT H MM-HMM
AND THAT WAY THEY DON'T HAVE TO HOP IN THEIR CAR AND DRIVE THROUGH LOT F TO GET THERE.
OR, OR IF YOU'RE TRYING TO GO FROM G TO A TO THAT BUSINESS PARK THAT YOU REALLY COULD LIVE, WORK, PLAY AND WALK OR BIKE OR DO SOMETHING OTHER THAN HOP IN THE CAR, DRIVE THROUGH LOT F CROSS FINA, GO TO LOT E LIKE MM-HMM
THAT, THAT DEFEATS THE PURPOSE OF WHAT I THINK THE INTENT OF THAT MXB TYPE ZONING IS INTENDED FOR.
AND, AND YOU, AND YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT THAT THE, THIS IS NOT DETAILED TO THE LEVEL OF WHERE WE'VE GOT CROSSWALKS AND SIDEWALKS AND EVERYTHING, BUT THAT KIND OF GREEN SPINE THAT RUNS THROUGH HERE THROUGH THE WHOLE PROPERTY, THE IDEA WOULD BE THAT OVER FILMING DRIVE WHERE WOULD BE A CROSSWALK WITH SOME TRAFFIC CALMING DEVICES AND HAVE SIDEWALKS THAT WOULD LEGITIMATELY CONNECT LOT G ALL THE WAY OVER TO LOT A SO THAT YOU COULD HAVE THAT CONNECTIVITY.
AND WE WOULD ANTICIPATE THAT WITHIN THE SITE DEVELOPMENT PERMIT LEVEL DRAWINGS.
I WANNA ENCOURAGE THAT, THAT THOUGHT THROUGH THIS PROCESS OF HOW CAN WE BEST INTEGRATE THE, THE PEOPLE AND THE PLACES THEY NEED TO BE IN EITHER THIRD SPACES OR WORKSPACES OR WHAT, WHATEVER MM-HMM
IN A WAY THAT DOESN'T REQUIRE THEM TO HOP IN THE CAR AND MOVE FROM THIS PARKING SPOT TO THAT PARKING SPOT.
AND THAT ALSO MIGHT REDUCE THE DEMAND ON THE NUMBER OF PARKING SPOTS THAT YOU NEED.
NOW, I KNOW WE'RE NOT INCENTIVIZING THIS, YOU SAID WE DON'T NEED CITY MONEY OR
[02:15:01]
ANYTHING LIKE THAT.SO IT MAY BE A TOUGH SELL FOR ME TO SAY WE WOULD LIKE TO PHASE IN THIS IN AND HAVE SOME, UH, CLEAR STANDARDS FOR YOU DOING THAT.
BUT PART OF THE ISSUE HERE IS THERE'S GOTTA BE SOME GIVE AND TAKE ON THIS BECAUSE, UM, THIS IS A TERRIBLE PARCEL TO BE ABANDONED HALF BUILT OUT.
WE'VE HAVE EXAMPLES OF PROJECTS IN THIS TOWN WITHOUT FINANCING AS ASSURED FAILING AND HAVING TO BE RESOLD TO BE BUILT OUT.
I DON'T WANT TO SEE THAT HAPPEN ON THIS KIND OF PROPERTY.
IT'S TOO IMPORTANT, UH, PARCEL.
AND SO WE'VE GOTTA COME TO SOME UNDERSTANDING ABOUT HOW CLEAR WE ARE ABOUT HOW THIS DANCE IS GONNA GO TILL THE END OF THE TUNE HERE.
UM, 'CAUSE I, YOU'VE GOT A GREAT PLAN, BUT IT'S, IT'S GOTTA BE BUILT AND WE'VE GOTTA BE CLEAR ABOUT HOW THAT'S GONNA PROCEED.
UM, SO THAT WE'RE ALL DOING THIS WITH FROM A PLACE OF INTEGRITY AND ACCOUNTABILITY.
ON THESE PLANS, I SEE MARKINGS FOR DETENTION PONDS.
DO YOU HAVE THOUGHTS CURRENTLY AS TO HOW THAT LOOKS? IS IT GRAY INFRASTRUCTURE? IS IT GREEN INFRASTRUCTURE? WHAT, WHAT DOES THAT, WHAT'S YOUR CONCEPT RIGHT NOW OF THAT? RIGHT.
SO IT HAS NOT BEEN ENGINEERED JUST TO ANSWER THAT.
UM, BUT THE, UH, UH, WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, IS THERE WAYS OF DOING MORE, UM, KIND OF FIGHTER REMEDIATION THROUGH PLANTINGS AND MAKING IT MORE OF AN AESTHETIC VALUE THAN JUST YOUR STANDARD POND.
UM, CURRENTLY THAT'S CONCEPTUAL, BUT WHAT'S BEEN DISCUSSED BETWEEN THE DESIGN TEAM AND THE, THE DEVELOPER IN, IN TERMS OF HOW WE CAN AMENITIZE THOSE SPACES AND TREAT GREEN WATER PERFECT.
I LIKE TO ENCOURAGE AS MUCH OF THAT GREEN AS WE CAN THAT WE HAS MULTIPLE USES AND NOT JUST A BLOCK OF CONCRETE SOMEWHERE.
BUT OBVIOUSLY ENGINEERS, BUT THEIR STAMP ON IT AND WE GOTTA TRUST THAT TOO.
GET A BIG SPLITTER BOX AND AND THAT'S IT.
UM, SO I WANNA START WITH A FEW THINGS THAT I DO LIKE ABOUT WHAT'S BEEN PRESENTED TODAY.
UM, I APPRECIATE THAT THERE'S NO FINANCIAL INCENTIVES REQUESTED.
AND SO THANKS FOR PRIORITIZING THAT.
UM, THE RIGHT OF WAY DONATION, UM, COMPLIANCE OVERALL WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND THE INTENDED USE FOR THIS AREA, IT IS MEANT TO BE, UM, KIND OF A, A DENSER MORE INTENSIVE USE AND I THINK THEY ARE ACHIEVING THAT FOR US.
UM, THE THINGS THAT I AM CONCERNED ABOUT IS THIS, THIS DOESN'T FEEL AS MIXED OF USES AS I, AS I WOULD WANT IT TO BE.
UM, SO WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT THE, THE DETAILS THERE, WE'RE LOOKING AT, UM, IN LOT D AND LOT G 4,000 SQUARE FEET OF GROUND FLOOR RETAIL IN EACH ONE.
AND I UNDERSTAND THE MARKET IS INFLUENCING SOME DECISIONS THERE, BUT, UM, TO SAY THAT WE HAVE 19 ACRES OF MXD, WE REALLY DON'T.
WE HAVE 8,000 SQUARE FEET OF MXD.
AND SO I DON'T THINK THAT WE'VE QUITE ACHIEVED, UM, THE OBJECTIVE YET OF TRUE MIXING OF USES HERE.
UM, AND THEN ANOTHER CONCERN THAT I HAVE IS ABOUT THAT UH, FIVE ACRE GREEN BELT.
UM, IF Y'ALL COULD GO TO SLIDE, SO IT'S KIND OF GOING ACROSS THE MIDDLE OF THE, THE SCREEN HERE.
IF YOU COULD GO ONTO SLIDE SIX, KIND OF THE, THE COVER IMAGE.
SO ON THIS ONE HERE, THAT'S, UM, THAT RENDERING TO ME THAT'S WHAT'S BEING CALLED GREEN BELT.
UM, AND AS SOMEONE WHO'S LIVED IN CENTRAL TEXAS FOR A WHILE IN THE AUSTIN AREA, I HAVE SOME SPECIFIC IDEAS IN MY HEAD ABOUT WHAT GREEN BELTS MEAN AND LOOK LIKE.
AND I DON'T THINK THAT WE ARE QUITE SHOWING A PEDESTRIAN ORIENTED, NATURAL KIND OF RESPITE AREA.
WE'RE SHOWING A PARKING LOT ON THE COVER IMAGE OF THE PROJECT.
THIS IS A PARKING LOT WITH A A A, A MODE GREEN SPACE IN THE MIDDLE.
I'M NOT SEEING THE CONNECTION BETWEEN THE, UH, KIND OF INSPIRATION IMAGES THAT ARE SHOWING PARKS WITH PEOPLE HANGING OUT AND USING THAT SPACE.
SO I, I THINK THERE'S A, A DISCONNECT THERE WITH THAT GREEN BELT USE.
[02:20:01]
YEAH, TO ME THIS ISN'T SAYING MIXED USE.IT'S NOT SAYING GREEN BELT, IT'S NOT SAYING WALKABLE.
I, I THINK THAT THERE'S MORE WE COULD DO WITH THIS.
SO MY FEEDBACK WOULD BE FOR THE COMMERCIAL SPACE.
UM, I UNDERSTAND THAT YOU CAN'T, THE MARKET DOESN'T REALLY SUPPORT YOU DOING MORE OF IT AT THIS TIME.
SO IF WE COULD MAYBE WORK SOMEHOW INTO THE P SOME PROTECTIONS THAT ARE GOING TO MAKE THAT MORE POSSIBLE, LIKE MAKING SURE THAT IT IS STREET FACING, UM, ALL THE, ALL THE COMMERCIAL UNITS BEING STREET FACING OR THAT THEY'RE BUILT OUT, UM, WITH, UM, HIGHER, HIGHER CEILINGS TO ACCOMMODATE COMMERCIAL OR KITCHEN USES.
THINGS THAT MIGHT NEED SPECIAL HVAC REQUIREMENTS OR GREASE TRAPS, THINGS LIKE THAT TO REALLY ENSURE THAT THESE ARE SPACES THAT ARE NOT GOING TO AFTER A FEW YEARS, WELL, YOU KNOW, WE CAN'T REALLY FIND A, A PERMANENT TENANT FOR IT.
LET'S PUT SOME STORAGE IN THERE AND CALL IT A DAY.
UM, SO IF WE CAN INTEGRATE LANGUAGE INTO THE P THAT'S GOING TO REALLY ENSURE AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE THE SUCCESS OF COMMERCIAL IN THESE 4,000 SQUARE FEET IN THE TWO SEPARATE LOTS.
UM, I THINK THAT WOULD BE REALLY HELPFUL, UM, HELPFUL FOR ME BEING ABLE TO GET BEHIND THE VOTE THAT IS TO, TO SUPPORT A PUD FOR THIS SITE.
UM, AN ALTERNATIVE IDEA WOULD BE, UM, INSTEAD OF RETAIL FACING FINA, IF YOU ACTUALLY TURN THE GREEN BELT INTO A GREEN BELT RETAIL FACING THE GREEN BELT, UM, 'CAUSE THEN IF, IF YOU HAVE GOOD QUALITY RETAIL, COFFEE, ICE CREAM, WHATEVER AT THE, AT THE GREEN BELT, I COULD SEE HOW THOSE, YOU KNOW, GREEN BELT USE MIGHT ENCOURAGE SUPPORT OF THOSE BUSINESSES, BUT ALSO USE OF THOSE BUSINESSES MIGHT ENCOURAGE SUP, LIKE USE OF THE GREEN BELT IF THERE'S SOMETHING INTERESTING TO ACTIVATE THAT SPACE RIGHT THERE AND TO REALLY DRAW PEOPLE IN.
UM, SO I GUESS THOSE ARE MY TWO MAIN FEEDBACKS.
I WOULD LOVE TO SEE IMPROVEMENT WITH, UM, ENSURING QUALITY SPACE IS PROVIDED IN THOSE BUILDINGS FOR RETAIL AND COMMERCIAL AND, UM, IMPROVEMENTS MADE TO THE GREEN BELT.
I'LL BE HONEST, I DON'T LOVE THIS PROJECT OVERALL, BUT IT WOULD GO A LONG WAY TOWARDS GETTING ME TO BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THIS ONE IF WE, IF WE COULD SEE THOSE TWO.
AND I, I WENT TO THIS SLIDE JUST 'CAUSE I WANTED TO SHOW THE, UH, SECOND IMAGE ON THE RIGHT, UH, WHERE IT HAS THE RETAIL SPACE NEXT TO THE GREEN SPACE.
AND AGAIN, THAT JUST AT THIS POINT, UH, THE, THAT THE LESS DETAILED LEVEL IS JUST GREEN IS MOWED GRASS AND THE INTENT WOULD BE THAT THAT GREEN BELT BE LANDSCAPED.
AND WE KNOW IN CENTRAL TEXAS, JUST HAVING MOWED LAWN IS NEVER A SUCCESSFUL USE OF THE SPACE JUST WITH SHADE AND UPKEEP.
AND SO THERE'D BE THE INTENT OF HAVING MORE FEATURES AND, AND, AND USABLE AREAS IN THAT, THAT SPACE.
AND JUST, IT'S NOT AT THAT LEVEL OF DESIGN QUITE YET.
UH, BUT CERTAINLY THE INTENT OF THE GREENBELT SPACE TO BE MUCH MORE LANDSCAPE DESIGNED, UH, SPACE FOR USE.
UM, AND THEN, UH, CERTAINLY GET BEHIND THE, UM, RETAIL SPACES OPENING UP TO PUBLIC AREAS OR TO THE GREEN BELT, UM, TO, TO HELP SUPPORT THOSE DESIRES.
AND MS. LONGAN, YOU BROUGHT UP SOME IDEAS THAT I HAVE FOLLOW UP QUESTIONS ON FROM THAT OF KNOWING THAT IN THAT INSTANCE 8,000 SQUARE FEET IS WHAT REALLY IS THAT MIXED USE AREA 'CAUSE OF MARKET DEMANDS.
DO YOU HAVE DATA YOU CAN SHARE WITH US ON WHAT THOSE MARKET DEMANDS ARE AND WHY THAT IS A LIMITING FACTOR? NOT OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD, BRETT, AT THE MOMENT.
UM, JUST MOSTLY IN THE EXPERIENCE OF CAPITAL PARTNERS, UM, LOOKING AT HOW MUCH RETAIL AND FROM A PERCENTAGE BASE SIZES.
BUT, UH, WE COULD LOOK INTO SOME DATA THAT WE COULD SHARE, SHARE WITH CITY STAFF.
THAT WE CAN UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU MEAN BY THE MARKET WON'T SUPPORT THAT TYPE OF DESIGN THAT COULD HELP INFORM FUTURE DECISIONS.
UM, AND THEN THINKING THROUGH THAT OPTION ON, ON THAT CENTRAL AREA OF THE GREEN BELT IN WHICH THE RETAIL'S THEN CONNECTED TO, I KNOW THAT THERE ARE SOME CITIES LIKE SAN ANTONIO'S RIVER WALK OR OTHER LOCATIONS THAT ARE KIND OF DESIGNED LIKE THAT WHERE YOU HAVE THE, THE PUBLIC SPACE THERE, YOU CAN WALK THROUGH TO FIND DIFFERENT RETAIL OR DIFFERENT FOOD, WHATEVER.
UM, SOMETIMES THOSE ARE DESIGNED TO ALLOW BEER, WINE TO BE TRANSPORTED IN THAT CONFINED AREA.
IS THAT SOMETHING THAT THE CITY COULD EXPLORE? I'M NOT SAYING THAT'S AN ENDORSEMENT, BUT LIKE WHAT, WHAT WOULD THAT PROCESS LOOK LIKE TO KIND OF GIVE MORE OPTIONS TO THE DEVELOPER IF THAT WAS AN INCENTIVE THAT COULD BE HELPFUL TO THEM? I, I THINK WE DEFINITELY COULD, WE WOULD JUST LEAN ON LIKE TABC RULES, UH,
[02:25:01]
FOR THAT IN, IN REGARDS.SO, UM, BUT YEAH, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE COULD, WE COULD LOOK AT.
SO ANOTHER IDEA THAT IS JUST SPRUNG INTO MY MIND, I KNOW THAT WE'RE TRYING TO, UM, USE THAT MXD UM, ZONING IN ORDER TO PULL THINGS KIND OF CLOSER TO THE ROADWAY AND TUCK PARKING BACK BEHIND IT.
BUT THAT IS IN FACT CREATING A PARKING LOT THAT PEOPLE HAVE TO WALK THROUGH IN ORDER TO USE THE GREEN BELT.
DO WE VALUE MORE HAVING THE UNITS CLOSER TO THE ROADWAY FOR THE KIND OF LIKE URBAN FEEL OR DO WE VALUE MORE HAVING THE UNITS CLOSER TO GREENBELT AS FOR PARKING OR MAYBE WE DO A BIT OF BOTH WHERE SOME THINGS ARE RIGHT ON THE GREEN BELT AND SOME THINGS HAVE A PARKING BUFFER.
IT IS THE, THE CRUX THERE WHERE IT'S, IF YOU REALLY VALUE PUSHING THINGS TO THE STREET, THEN YOU GET THE SEA OF PARKING IN BETWEEN ALL THE BUILDINGS AND IT'S HARD TO MAKE THOSE SPACES REALLY ATTRACTIVE.
AND SO THIS WAS KIND OF THE, UH, YOU KNOW, THE HAPPY MEDIUM OF LIKE, CAN WE GET ENOUGH GREEN IN THAT SPACE TO BREAK UP THE ASPHALT AND MAKE IT REALLY DESIRABLE? BUT I WOULD TEND TO AGREE THAT IF WE COULD GET MORE OF THAT GREEN RIGHT UP AGAINST THAT, UM, COMMERCIAL AND AND RESIDENTIAL UNITS, THAT IT ACTIVATES THAT SPACE MORE ALLOWING FOR SOME OF THE, THE PARKING OUT ON THE STREET EDGE BECAUSE THAT THE RIGHT OF WAY IS NOT QUITE AS WALKABLE AS THE GREEN SPACE WOULD BE.
AND I THINK THAT THAT'S THE INTENT OF MIXED USE DESIGN IS TO BE ABLE TO MAKE IT WALKABLE.
LIKE IF I'M IN BUILDING LOT D BUILDING FOUR AND I WANNA GO OVER TO, I DON'T KNOW, SOMETHING LOT A BUILDING ONE OR LOT E BUILDING THREE, UM, HAVE TO WALK THROUGH PARKING LOTS OR DRIVE TO GET THERE.
THAT'S NOT THE MOST PLEASANT EXPERIENCE WHEN IT'S LIKE A HUNDRED DEGREES OUTSIDE FOR LARGE SWATHS OF THE YEAR HERE.
UH, SO FOOD FOR THOUGHT, DEFINITE FOOD FOR THOUGHT.
I DO AGREE, UM, WITH WHAT VICE CHAIR STEGEL SAID, THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT PARCEL FOR THE CITY OF KYLE.
THE PROXIMITY TO THE HOSPITAL, IT'S VERY CENTRAL.
THERE'S GONNA BE, UM, A LOT OF IMPORTANCE ON THIS AREA OF OUR CITY.
A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE GONNA MOVE THROUGH HERE EVERY DAY AND WE WANT PEOPLE TO STAY AND USE IT.
AND SO I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT THIS AREA IS ATTRACTIVE AND DURABLE AND IT'S SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, 20, 30 YEARS FROM NOW WHEN IT NEEDS REINVESTMENT, SOMEBODY WOULD BE HAPPY TO TO DO THAT.
AND I THINK THAT STARTS WITH HOW IT'S DESIGNED AT THE START.
ANY OTHER FEEDBACK? I GUESS NOT.
APPRECIATE YOUR FEEDBACK COUNSEL.
SO DO Y'ALL WANT ME TO CLOSE THIS OUT OR DOES SOMEBODY WANNA MAKE A MOTION? I MAY MAKE A MOTION THAT WE ADJOURN.
A MOTION TO ADJOURN FROM VICE CHAIR STEGEL.
COMMISSIONER COPELAND, I JUST DRUG THAT OUT FOR AN EXTRA 30 SECONDS 'CAUSE I JUST REALLY ENJOYED BEING HERE WITH Y'ALL TONIGHT.
YOU JUST ON YOUR OWN EVERY NIGHT OR TIME ABOUT YOU.
WE ARE OFFICIALLY ADJOURNED AT 9 0 4.