* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. [00:00:01] WE'RE BACK. [1.  Call meeting to order] NO, I WOULD LIKE TO OPEN THE CITY OF KYLE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION WORKSHOP MEETING. CAN I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE? SHAQ MEYER HERE, HERE. MCCALL CHRISTIE HERE. GARAH HERE. JAMES HERE, CHASE HERE. ITEM NUMBER THREE, CITIZENS COMMENTS. I WILL OPEN CITIZEN'S COMMENTS SEEING NO ONE HERE AND KNOWING NO ONE'S ON THE PHONE. I WILL CLOSE CITIZENS COMMENT, [B.   Discussion regarding code changes to Sec. 11-176, Sec. 11-177, Sec. 41-136, Sec. 53-33 (Chart 4), Sec. 53-143 and provide direction to staff to pursue code amendments. ] ITEM NUMBER FOUR, GENERAL DISCUSSION DISCUSSION REGARDING CODE CHANGES TO SECTION 11 DASH 1 7 6, SECTION 11 DASH 1 7 7, SECTION 41 DASH 1 36, SECTION 53 DASH 33 CHART FOUR, SECTION 53 DASH 1 43 AND PROVIDE DIRECTION TO STAFF TO PURSUE CODE AMENDMENTS, MR. ATKINSON. ALL RIGHT, WELL ATKINSON FOR THE RECORD. AND SO WE BROUGHT A FEW MORE TOWARDS, UH, BACK TO YOU. UM, A COUPLE MORE HANDFUL OF THEM, IF YOU WILL. UM, SOME OF THEM ARE RELATIVELY BENIGN. SOME OF THEM MIGHT WARRANT A LITTLE BIT OF DISCUSSION AND THAT'S QUITE ALL RIGHT. ALL RIGHT. SO, UH, THE FIRST ONE COMING FORWARD TO Y'ALL, UM, WE ARE LOOKING TO AMEND OUR FOOD TRUCK ORDINANCE. UM, WE'VE HAD SOME DISCUSSION FROM HIGHER UP ABOVE US. THEY WANTED TO BETTER FACILITATE, UM, FOOD TRUCKS, UM, IN OUR DOWNTOWN AREA AS WE'RE, UM, MAKING THE MOVES FROM THE CITY SIDE TO, UH, IMPROVE, UM, MAYBE TRY TO JUMPSTART SOME, A PROJECT OR TWO, PRIMARILY OUR ONE OVER THERE, ONE BEFORE SOUTH GIRLS. AND SO, UM, THEY ASKED US TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE FOOD TRUCK ORDINANCE AND SEE WHAT, IF ANYTHING NEEDED TO BE CHANGED IF WE THOUGHT ANYTHING NEEDED TO BE CHANGED AND ALSO TO DISCUSS WITH, Y'ALL SEE IF Y'ALL HAD ANY IDEAS OF THE STUFF THAT WAS ON THE AGENDA FOR TONIGHT IS PURELY STAFF'S IDEAS. IF THERE'S ANYTHING THAT Y'ALL LIKE OR DON'T LIKE, OR WOULD LIKE TO SEE AMENDED, YOU MIGHT THINK IT'S BETTER. WE CAN TALK ABOUT THAT. SO, BUT IF YOU DON'T MIND, I'M GOING TO GO AHEAD AND START THE EDITS THAT WE FOUND THAT WE THOUGHT MIGHT BE HELPFUL, UM, FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE. SO, ALL RIGHT. LET ME JUST GO DOWN THE LIST HERE. BEAR WITH ME JUST A MOMENT. OKAY. SO SECTION 11 DASH 1 76, THAT'S FOR TEMPORARY FEED VENDORS. CAN YOU PLEASE SHARE YOU'RE HAVING IN FRONT OF ME, RIGHT? YES, ABSOLUTELY. THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME KNOW. THANKS. OKAY. THIS IS THE, UM, WELL, THIS IS THE, THE RED LINE VERSION OF THE CODE. UM, AND SO RIGHT NOW, UH, TEMPORARY FOOD VENDORS ARE DEFINED AS, UM, VENDORS THAT ARE IN A LOT TO BE ON SITE FOR 12 MONTHS OR LESS. UM, AND THEY ALSO HAVE, UH, THEY HAVE SUBMITTED A SITE PLAN AND THEY HAVE, UM, FACILITIES TO WHERE GUESTS CAN GO USE THE RESTROOM. AND HAVING TYPICALLY WE'LL HAVE SOME TABLES, MAYBE SOME, SOME UMBRELLAS, A LITTLE, MAYBE SOME POTTED POINT, BUT THERE WERE TEMPORARY STILL, EXCUSE ME, THEY'RE ALLOWED IN THE RETAIL SERVICES ON THE DISTRICT'S CB ONE, CB TWO AND THE EAS OR ENTERTAINMENT, ZONING DISTRICTS. UM, SO IN SECTION G SUBSECTION ONE G THREE, UM, WE STRUCK OUT, UM, THE 50 FEET AND NO CLOSER THAN 50 FEET FROM THE THOROUGHFARES TO, IN AN ATTEMPT TO, ESPECIALLY IN DOWNTOWN KYLE AND THE CBD TO WHERE THERE ARE MUCH SMALLER, LOTS AND SMALLER SPACES TO WORK WITH, UM, TO MAKE IT A LITTLE BIT MORE FLEXIBLE IN THAT WHERE THEY'RE LOOKED TO BE LOCATED, UM, THEY CAN FACE INTO THE PROPERTY SERVING WINDOW CAN BE NEXT TO THE RIGHT OF WAY. UM, IF THERE'S AN ADA COMPLIANT SIDEWALK, AT LEAST SIX FEET WIDE, THAT'S JUST, SO YOU STILL ALLOW SOMEONE ON A SCOOTER OR A WHEELCHAIR TO GO BY. IF YOU'RE QUEUING CUSTOMERS, UM, MIGHT BE ABLE TO USE SOME PUBLIC PARKING THAT THE CITY OWNS IN SPECIFIC INSTANCES. UM, BUT THEY HAVE TO HAVE BARRIERS UP, UM, ESSENTIALLY REDUCING IT DOWN TO A FOREFOOT, UM, NO CLOSER THAN FOUR FEET TO THE PROPERTY LINE, IF IT'S ADJACENT TO SINGLE FAMILY OR TWO FAMILY RESIDENTIAL AND WHAT THAT IS, IT'S A NOD TOWARDS A SEPARATE SECTION OF THE CODE, I THINK IN 11, 1 77, WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT THEY HAVE TO BE 25 FEET [00:05:01] AWAY, BUT IN DOWNTOWN KYLE, AGAIN, THE LOTS ARE SO SMALL. IT'S REALLY HARD TO ACHIEVE THAT IF WE WANT TO BE ABLE TO HAVE SOME FOOD VENDORS DOWNTOWN, LIKE, UM, THEY NEED TO BE A LITTLE BIT OF A FLEXIBILITY. SO, UM, I STRUCK OUT THE, UH, UH, THE, THE NOT ALLOWING TO BE WITHIN 150 FEET OF EACH OTHER, UM, TO DIFFERENT VENDORS. THAT'S, UM, THAT'S A SIGNIFICANT, UM, DISTANCE BETWEEN FOOD VENDORS, ESPECIALLY IF YOU HAVE LIKE A, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE LIKE THREE OR FOUR SET UP, UM, I MEAN, THEY NEED TO BE, YOU KNOW, HAVE A SAFE DISTANCE AWAY FROM EACH OTHER, BUT THEY 150 FEET IS A LOT. UM, AND THEN ALSO THE SUBSECTION FIVE FOR THE SAME REASON, UM, THEY SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO BE A LITTLE BIT CLOSER, UM, THAN 150 FEET FOR PROPERTY USERS AND FOR RESIDENTIAL PURPOSES. SO JUST TO GIVE HIM SOME FLEXIBILITY TO SET UP SHOP, UM, ANY IDEAS, ANY, ANYTHING ON ABOUT THAT YET? ANYTHING POPPING UP IN YOUR HEAD? I HAVE, UH, ONE, UM, OR TWO ACTUALLY. SO YOU'VE STRUCK A, IS LOCATED NO LONGER, NO CLOSER THAN 50 FEET FROM THOROUGHFARES. IF THEY'RE GOING TO BE ALLOWED TO USE PUBLIC PARKING, I'M JUST THINKING, WELL, ARE THEY GOING TO PARK THERE, RIDE ON, SAY CENTER STREET ON THE PUBLIC PARKING SPACES. THERE IS THAT, IS THAT A GOOD, A GOOD THING TO ALLOW? WOULD THEY NEED TO BE OFF OF AT LEAST OFF OF THE MAIN THOROUGHFARE AND ON THE SIDE, JUST TO PREVENT ANY KIND OF TRAFFIC ISSUES THERE. AND I'M THINKING THAT ONE THROUGH STILL A LITTLE BIT, AND THEN THE OTHER THING, UH, ITEM D 3D YOU'VE GOT TO KNOW CLOSER TO ENFORCE FEET PROBABLY NEEDS TO BE AT LEAST FIVE TO KIND OF MATCH THE, YOU KNOW, THE STANDARD SETBACK REQUIREMENTS YOU'D HAVE OR A STRUCTURE BETWEEN, YOU KNOW, RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURES OR OTHER THINGS. I THINK THE BUILDING CODE FIRE CODE USUALLY HAVE SOMETHING THERE. AND I WOULD THINK WE'D, THERE'S SOME LOGIC IN THE CODE FOR WHY THEY HAVE THOSE FIVE FOOT SETBACK REQUIREMENTS. I THINK YOU'D PROBABLY WANT TO AT LEAST MATCH THAT. THOSE ARE TWO ITEMS THAT I SEE. YEAH, I CAN ANSWER. I CAN PROBABLY ANSWER THE FIRST ONE AND MAYBE THE SECOND ONE TOO. UM, FOR YOUR EXAMPLE ON CENTER STREET, THAT'S A TEXDOT ROAD. AND SO THEY'D HAVE TO GO AND TRY TO GET A PERMIT FROM TXDOT TO DO THAT. BUT I AGREE. I THINK WHEN I WAS DRAFTING THIS SECTION OF THE CODE, IT WAS MORE OF A, IT'D BE ON A SIDE STREET LIKE SOUTH BURLESON OR MILLER STREET OR, OR SOUTH MAIN OR NORTH MAIN OR SOMETHING TO THAT EFFECT WHERE A CITY HAS FULL JURISDICTION TO DECIDE, IS IT APPROPRIATE IF SOMEONE WERE TO ASK AND WE DO HAVE THAT SYSTEM, UM, THAT PROCESS SET UP THROUGH THE CITY ENGINEER'S DEPARTMENT WHERE THEY CAN, UM, USE PARKING SPACES FOR SEATING OR, OR VARIOUS OTHER REASONS, UH, A RESTAURANT CAN OR A VENDOR CAN. SO, UM, YEAH, NO, IT WOULD NOT BE ON CENTER STREET. THAT WOULD BE, THAT WOULD BE TERRIBLE. AND THE REASON WHY I ALSO PUT UP THE, THE TEMPORARY BARRIERS SECTION IN THERE IS ALSO TO PREVENT IT TO BE FROM BECOMING A DEFACTO DRIVE THROUGH IF YOU WILL, RIGHT ON THE STREET. UM, THE, THE FOREFOOT, I, I HAVE NO OBJECTIONS TO THAT, UM, OR THE MAKING A FIVE FEET, UM, IF, IF IT HELPED FROM A BUILDING CODE PERSPECTIVE. GREAT. WELL, AND I'M NOT SAYING I HAVE THE RIGHT ANSWER THERE, AND MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING THAT YOU CAN TALK TO THE CITY FIRE MARSHALL ABOUT JUST TO MAKE SURE. BUT TO ME, IT JUST SEEMS A LITTLE CLOSE, YOU KNOW, WITH A BIG PROPANE TANK AND A GREASE FIRE GOING INSIDE, BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW, I'LL CHECK ANYONE ELSE. OKEY-DOKEY, I'LL KEEP GOING, TAKING NOTES WHILE I'M DOING THIS, UH, FOOD COURTS. UH, THIS WAS THE BEGINNING OF THE CONVERSATION INTERNALLY WITH STAFF AND, UM, THE CITY COUNCIL, UM, SECTION A, UM, RIGHT NOW CURRENTLY READS THAT ANY INDUSTRY, I KNOW A FOOD COURT WHEN IT COMES TO TEMPORARY VENDORS IS A, IS SOMEONE IS A PERSON WHO'S DEVELOPED A SITE TO ALLOW FOOD VENDORS TO PULL UP AND TIE INTO ELECTRICITY AND HAVE PORTABLE WATER WHERE IT'S KIND OF LIKE A, THIS IS KIND OF A BAD ANALOGY, BUT MAYBE NOT. UM, IT'S LIKE A, LIKE AN RV PAD SITE, BUT FOR FOOD TRUCKS WHERE THERE'S GOING TO BE, UM, UM, SOME TABLES, THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME BATHROOMS THEY'RE ALREADY ON SITE. IT'S A, A SITE DEVELOPMENT PLAN, BUT WITH THREE TRUCKS ON IT. SO, UM, [00:10:01] THE MINIMUM SIZE WAS 20,000 SQUARE FEET. I WANTED IT TO CHANGE, TO MATCH THE LOT DIMENSIONS PER EACH ASSOCIATED ZONING DISTRICT, WHICH ARE REFERS BACK TO 11, 1 76. SO THE CB ONE, CB TWO RS AND E. SO, UM, THAT WAY IT'S JUST, IT'S EASIER TO MAINTAIN FROM A CODE PERSPECTIVE. SO YOU'RE NOT HAVING TO FIGURE OUT OKAY. SOMETIMES THE CODE CAN BE WEIRD IF IT'S NOT, IT DOESN'T MATCH UP, UM, ON THE FOOD COURTS. UM, I DID THE SAME THING FOR THE SETBACKS. THEY WON'T REQUIRE THEM, UH, FOR PERMANENT AND TEMPORARY STRUCTURES, EXCEPT FOR ANA SECTIONS, SIGHT LINE DISTANCES, UM, AND A LANDSCAPE BUFFER OF NO LESS THAN FOUR FEET ALONG THE PROPERTY LINE ADJACENT TO ARE SINGLE AND TWO FAMILY RESIDENTIAL PURPOSES. SO, UM, IF, IF IT'S, UH, IF THERE'S A CONCERN ABOUT FIRE SAFETY AND WHAT HAVE YOU, I CAN ALSO, UM, ASK THE BUILDING OFFICIAL OR, UM, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT AS WELL IN THIS ONE AS WELL. OKAY. YOU LOOKING FOR SOME FEEDBACK TOO? I THINK THE ONE THING WE GOTTA BE CAREFUL HERE IS THAT PEOPLE DON'T END UP LIVING IN THESE THINGS AND THEN IT DOES BECOME A RV PARK. ARE WE WORRIED ABOUT THAT AT ALL? NO, BECAUSE RVS ARE NOT ALLOWED EXCEPT FOR IN ANY ZONING DISTRICT IS TO BE LIVED IN EXCEPT FOR IN THE RVS ZONING DISTRICT. SO THIS IS SPECIFICALLY FOR FOOD COURT. I DON'T NECESSARILY MEAN AN RV, BUT SOMEONE HAS A NICE FOOD COURT TRAILER AND THEY HAPPEN TO LIVE IN IT AS WELL AS THAT. WE'RE OKAY WITH THAT KIND OF THING. I DON'T THINK I NECESSARILY DO THAT. I DON'T THINK I'VE EVER MET A MOBILE SHOP THAT LIVES IN THEIR OWN. LIKE, I MEAN, YOU GOTTA THINK ABOUT THERE'S A KITCHEN INSIDE OF THAT THING. WHERE ARE YOU GOING TO PUT IT? YEAH. I DON'T THINK HAVE ANY OF THAT SORT OF THING GOING ON. OKAY. YEAH, WE WOULD, WE WOULDN'T ALLOW IT ANYWAY, BUT YEAH, I THINK, I THINK, UM, THAT'S CORRECT. I, I DON'T BELIEVE THERE'S ANY INSTANCE WHERE THAT'S HAPPENED AND, AND I DON'T HAVE AN EXAMPLE AND I'M, UM, I'M LOOKING FOR LOOKING FOR HOLES TO PUNCH IN IT AND IT MAY NOT BE A HOLE, UH, JUST WANT TO KNOW IT OR, YOU KNOW, DO WE NEED TO WORRY ABOUT IT? IT SOUNDS LIKE NO, THEN. OKAY. OKAY. UM, VENDOR DENSITY STRUCK OUT 12 GETS SPREAKER AND JUST MADE IT EASIER FROM THE PRACTICAL LIMITATION INTO THE SITE LAYOUT, WHICH THERE IS GOING TO BE DENSITY LIMITATIONS BASED ON THAT FROM BETWEEN DRIVE ISLES, UM, THE FIRE CODE PARKING, THEY HAVE A MINIMUM OF FOUR PARKING SPACES PER VENDOR THAT THERE'S ANY LANDSCAPING REQUIREMENTS, DETENTION, ET CETERA. UM, IT'LL, IT'LL EAT UP SPACE QUICKLY. SO FIVE UNITS PER ACRE OR, OR THIS. YEAH. AND, UM, ANOTHER THING YOU'VE GOT PERMANENT LABORATORY AND HAND-WASHING FACILITIES THERE, BUT ARE THERE GOING TO BE PROVISIONS FOR SEWAGE? AND IF SO, WHAT ARE WE DO ABOUT GREASE INTERCEPTORS AND THINGS LIKE THAT? OR ARE WE NOT ALLOWING SEWAGE? THEY HAVE TO HOLD ALL THAT. UM, RIGHT. THAT'S CORRECT. THEY, UM, THE RESTROOMS, UM, AND PERMANENT STRUCTURES ON SITE, THEY'RE ALLOWED TO TIE DIRECTLY INTO THE WASTEWATER. UM, WHAT THE FOOD COURTS DO NOT ALLOW IS THE MOBILE FOOD VENDORS TO DUMP THEIR, THEIR GRAY WATER OR BLACKWATER WITH GREASE, OR WHAT HAVE YOU INTO THE CITY SEWER SYSTEM. THEY HAVE TO TAKE THAT OFF SITE AND GO GET THERE AT A COMMISSARY AND GET IT ALL CLEANED OUT AND PRE PREPARED ALREADY. SO, OR THEY CAN BE SERVICED ON SITE BY A MOBILE TRUCK. LIKE THEY CAN, THEY CAN BE PUMPED OUT WHILE THEY REMAIN AT THE SITE, BUT THEY DON'T GET TO TIE INTO CITY SERVICES. AND THERE WOULDN'T BE A REQUIREMENT THAT THE FOOD COURT HAVE A GREASE TRAP INSTALLED. OKAY. AND THAT IS ALL THE EDITS THAT WE HAVE PROPOSED FOR, UM, 1 76 AND 11, 1 77. ANY THOUGHTS, QUESTIONS, IDEAS, ANY ISSUES WITH NOISE THAT WE NEED TO BE WORRIED ABOUT IN THIS, ON THE COURTS IN PARTICULAR, OR IS THAT HANDLED ELSEWHERE ADEQUATELY FROM A, FROM AN AUDIO STANDPOINT, WE WOULDN'T ALLOW ANY LIVE MUSIC ANYWAY, UNLESS THERE WAS A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT THAT WAS, THAT WAS PRESENTED AN ACTUAL USE PERMIT, A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT ON ONE. UM, AND SO, UH, BUT COULD HAVE, UM, ACOUSTIC MUSIC, THEY WANTED US ON AMPLIFIED AND THESE ARE ALREADY GOING IN OUR S LOCATIONS. YES. UH, [00:15:01] THERE, THERE'S A, THERE'S A HANDFUL AROUND TOWN. UM, TWO OR THREE, I'M MOST THINKING, JUST A SMALL HANDFUL WHEN I ON EAST F150 AND A GAS STATION. UM, THERE'S PROBABLY A COUPLE OTHER ELSEWHERE, BUT THAT'S THE ONE I'M THINKING OF W WHAT IS OUR NOISE ORDINANCE ALLOW IN TERMS OF HOW LATE THINGS CAN BE? IS IT CUT OFF AT 10 O'CLOCK? I KNOW THAT'S NOT NECESSARILY PART OF YOUR STUFF, BUT IT'S ELSEWHERE. BUT WHAT I CAN SAY IS THAT THE BUSINESSES WOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO BE OPEN WELL WITH THE EXCEPTION OF A FOOD COURT. THE, UM, IF IT'S, UH, JUST A, UH, A, ONE-OFF A TEMPORARY FOOD VENDOR ON SOMEONE'S PARCEL, THEY HAVE TO CLOSE UP SHOP WHEN THE, WHEN THE PLACE OF BUSINESS CLOSES UP SHOP, BECAUSE THE DATE, THE PLACE, THE BUSINESS HOUSE RESTROOMS, UM, OTHERWISE I BELIEVE THE ZONING DISTRICT ITSELF WOULD APPLY FOR, FOR HOURS. SO LIMITATIONS ON THE FOOD COURTS, I WILL, I'LL SAY THAT'S COVERED IN 1 76 0.1 POINT J WHERE IT SAYS TEMPORARY, THE TEMPORARY FOOD VENDOR MAY NOT USE AMPLIFIERS, LOUDSPEAKERS, MUSICAL INSTRUMENTS, OR EITHER DEVICES FOR LIKE A PRODUCTION OF SOUND. I'M JUST WONDERING THE PROXIMITY TO RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOODS. SO, UH, THERE COULD BE LOTS OF MARIEMONT GOING ON AROUND HERE, WHICH IS PROBABLY WHAT WE WANT. RIGHT. BUT DO, DO WE NEED TO BE WORRIED ABOUT THERE BEING ANY CONFLICT WITH THESE, NOT NECESSARILY BEING IN AN NRS AREA WHERE WE MIGHT HAVE A NOISE ORDINANCE THAT WOULD END BEFORE THESE GUYS WOULDN'T ANTICIPATE, UH, WHERE W WHERE THEY MIGHT WANT TO EXTEND THE HOURS BEYOND WHERE A NOISE ORDINANCE WOULD ALLOW. AND AGAIN, I'M NOT SAYING THERE'S A PROBLEM HERE. I'M JUST THINKING OUT LOUD ON THAT. IS THERE ANYTHING THERE? WHAT WE NEED TO BE CLEAR, OR IS THIS A, IS THIS A BRIDGE TO CROSS WHEN WE GET THERE KIND OF THING, WOULDN'T THEY HAVE TO FOLLOW OUR NOISE ORDINANCE. LIKE, ISN'T THAT THE BOTTOM LINE? SO WHATEVER THE NOISE ORDINANCE IS, I DON'T KNOW IT OFF HAND THERE'S A FOOD COURT WOULD BE SUBJECT TO THOSE REGULATIONS. AND IF THEY GO AWRY, THEY GET CITED. AND MAYBE I'M JUST LOOKING AT IT TOO SIMPLISTICALLY, BUT IF THEY GET TOO LOUD, SOMEONE COMES AND TELLS THEM, KNOCK IT OFF. IF THEY'RE GOING LATER THAN THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO, SOMEONE COMES AND TELLS THEM YOU GOT TO CLOSE SHOP. I DON'T KNOW. UM, I THINK PAUL DOES MAKE A VALID POINT THOUGH, BECAUSE IF, IF FOR THIS DISCUSSION SPECIFICALLY, IF WE ARE CHANGING THE BUFFER FROM, UH, 30 FEET TO FOUR OR FIVE OR WHATEVER IT'S GOING TO BE, THEN I THINK NOISE NEEDS TO BE MORE A ON OUR MIND THAN IT WOULD HAVE BEEN PREVIOUSLY, BECAUSE IT'S POSSIBLE TO BE MUCH CLOSER. NOW, IF WE DO APPROVE THIS THAN BEFORE, BUT THEN WOULDN'T THAT BE THE SAME AS A HOME BEING FOUR FEET FROM ANOTHER HOME. AND THERE'S A NOISE ISSUE YOU WOULD CALL THE AUTHORITIES IF THEY WERE GETTING TOO LOUD, USE YOUR HOME AS LOUD AS A FOOD TRUCK. WELL, IF IT GOT THAT LOUD AT THE FOOD TRUCK, THE RESIDENT WOULD THEN CALL AND SAY, YOU CAN'T DO THAT. AND IF YOU HAVE A FOOD TRUCK, FOUR FEET OR FIVE FEET FROM A HOME, YOU HAVE TO BE COGNIZANT OF THAT. YOU HAVE TO KNOW THAT WELL, AND THE CITY CAN PULL A PERMIT CANDIDATE. LIKE IF IT, IF THEY, YEAH. SO, I MEAN, I THINK THAT THERE ARE SOME CONSIDERATIONS ALSO. I DON'T THINK THAT WE NEED TO BE TOO WORRIED ABOUT IF SOMEONE PICKS A FOOD TRUCK SPOT THAT IS OUTSIDE OF, UM, THE RS, UM, SEPARATION OF THE NOISE ORDINANCE. I DON'T THINK THAT WE SHOULD NECESSARILY LEGISLATE FOR THEM THAT DECISION IF THEY MAKE THAT DECISION, THAT'S ON THEM TO UNDERSTAND AND KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON AT THAT SPOT. YEAH. AND I DON'T NECESSARILY THINK THIS IS THE PLACE TO HANDLE THAT, BUT I JUST WONDER IF THERE'S SOME POTENTIAL CONFLICT. SO, BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE THE DEFAULT IS YOU GOT TO OBEY THE NOISE ORDINANCE, AND IF YOU'RE TOO CLOSE, YOU'LL, YOU'LL LEARN YOUR LESSON. AND IN ORDER TO LOWER YOUR COMPLAINT, YOU'LL MOVE IT A LITTLE SOMEWHERE FURTHER AWAY. YEAH. THAT'S A DECENT ANSWER. OKAY. THEY'RE PERMITTED, AREN'T THEY TO GET A VENDOR'S PERMIT. SO IF THERE WAS A PROBLEM, YOU KNOW, THEN THE CITY JUST SIMPLY WOULDN'T RENEW THEIR PERMIT OR WOULD PULL THEIR PERMIT. SO THEY KNOW THAT THEY HAVE SOMETHING ON THE LINE. IF THERE ARE COMPLAINTS AGAINST THEM, I WOULD ALSO NOTE, THIS IS A QUESTION THAT I HAVE LOOKING AT THE ORDINANCE AS A WHOLE OF HOW THIS FITS I'M ON 11 1 76, 1 POINT, I, IT SAYS TEMPORARY FOOD VENDOR MAY NOT REMAIN ON A PARTICULAR PROPERTY IN THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE THING, THAT PART, UM, FOR A PARTICULAR PERIOD FOR A PARTICULAR PROPERTY, FOR A PERIOD OF TIME THAT EXISTS [00:20:01] OR EXCEEDS 12 MONTHS. DOES THAT MEAN THE TRUCK ITSELF, OR DOES THAT, WHEN YOU SAY REMAIN, DOES THAT MEAN THAT THEY CANNOT REMAIN? UM, THEY CANNOT HAVE ACCESS TO THAT AFTER 12 MONTHS. SO LIKE AFTER 12 MONTHS I WOULD HAVE TO MOVE TO MY FOOD TRUCK TO A DIFFERENT SPOT, OR, UM, DOES THAT MEAN THAT THE, THE TRUCK ITSELF CANNOT SIT THERE FOR 12 MONTHS? SO LIKE, I COULD GET A RENEWAL FROM THE CITY YEAR OVER YEAR, BOTH, YOU HAVE TO REMOVE IT. AT LEAST THAT'S WHAT WE'VE ALWAYS BEEN. WE'VE VIEWED THAT AS BASED ON WHAT THAT'S, WHAT THAT'S BEEN, AND THEN THE PRINTED, IT WOULD ALSO EXPIRE 12 MONTHS. SO AS IT CAN'T BE THERE, IT'S MORE THAN 12 MONTHS, THEN THEY HAVE TO REVERT IT. I THINK THE THING THAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT HERE IS WHAT, IF YOU HAVE A BUSINESS THAT IS A SUCCESS WHERE YOU SAYING YOU HAVE A FOOD TRUCK THAT IS KNOWN FOR BEING AT A SPECIFIC LOCATION AND IS DOING A GOOD JOB, AND THAT LET'S SAY IT'S AROUND A FOOD COURT, UM, DOES THAT THEN MEAN THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO MOVE THEIR BUSINESS SOMEWHERE ELSE, REMARK IT TO THEIR CUSTOMERS. THEY ARE IN A DIFFERENT LOCATION. UM, OR DOES THIS ONLY EXIST IN A PLACE WHERE A FOOD TRUCK PERMIT IS OUTSIDE OF THE FOOD PART? BECAUSE I WOULD HATE TO PUT AN UNDUE BURDEN ON, UH, ON, UH, SOMEONE WHO STARTED A SMALL BUSINESS AND DECIDED, HEY, I'M GOING TO START A FOOD TRUCK. I'M DOING REALLY WELL 12 MONTHS, BUT I GOT TO MOVE TO A DIFFERENT PLACE OR GO MOBILE. THAT JUST SEEMS LIKE A CONCERN TO ME. I MEAN, I'D SAY THAT'S HOW IT READS NOW, IF WE MAKE IT RENEWABLE, YOU KNOW, REVIEWED AND RENEWABLE, NO, I KIND OF HAVE AN OPPOSITE CONCERN AND THAT'S THAT THIS ENDS UP BECOMING A KIND OF A BACKDOOR WAY TO PUT IN A PERMANENT FACILITY. AND I THINK THAT'S, THERE IS SOME WISDOM IN LIMITING THE AMOUNT OF TIME. UM, I SUSPECT IF IT IS A FOOD COURT THAT CAN MAKE ARRANGEMENTS TO THE FOOD COURT TO PULL INTO ANOTHER BIRTH LOCATION AND SWAP WITH SOMEBODY ELSE. BUT I DON'T KNOW, IS THAT, IS THAT THE INTENT BEHIND THE 12 MONTH LIMITATION, I'M ACTUALLY LOOKING FOR THE ACTUAL LANGUAGE. IT'S A HIGH MAY NOT REMAIN ON A PROPERTY FOR A PERIOD OF TIME THAT EXCEEDS 12 MONTHS. YEAH, THAT, THAT WAS SO SOMEBODY DIDN'T BACKDOOR INTO CREATING A PERMANENT EXISTENCE WITH A, WITH A TEMPORARY INFRASTRUCTURE, YOU KNOW, WITH, WITH TERRACE, COUNTER ARGUMENT, TO ALL OF THIS, IF YOU LOOK AT MANY OF THE SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS RESTAURANTS IN AUSTIN, SOME OF THE NEWER ONES, THEY STARTED OUT AS BEING FOOD TRUCKS FOR TWO OR THREE YEARS. NOT TOO MANY PEOPLE WANT TO HAVE A FOOD TRUCK YEAR OVER YEAR, OVER YEAR, OVER YEAR AFTER FOUR OR FIVE YEARS, YOU WANT TO TURN IT INTO THAT RESTAURANT. SO THAT WAY YOU CAN EXPAND OPPORTUNITY AND MAKE MONEY. LIKE NO ONE IS LOOKING TO BUILD AND SELL A FOOD TRUCK. I WOULD SAY NO ONE, THERE MIGHT BE SOMEBODY OUT THERE, BUT THAT IS HIGHLY UNLIKELY BECAUSE YOU'RE, AS YOU'RE GETTING MORE CUSTOMERS, THE THING YOU WANT TO DO IS HAVE A BIGGER SPACE TO BRING MORE CUSTOMERS IN THE DOOR AND MAKE REVENUE. LIKE I, MY WORRY IS, ARE WE WORRYING ABOUT A CONCERN? THAT'S NOT NECESSARILY, UM, SOMETHING THAT OUR CITIZENS WILL BE WORKING ON DOING? UM, I DO BELIEVE WE SHOULD HAVE A LIMIT, UM, IF, IF WE EXTEND THAT TIME LIMIT. YEAH, WE DEFINITELY TALK ABOUT THAT. BUT, BUT, BUT I, I DO THINK THERE SHOULD BE A, IF IT'S 12 MONTHS, IF IT'S, YOU KNOW, 18, WHATEVER TEMPORARY FOOD VENDOR PERMITS EXPIRE A YEAR FROM THE DATE ON WHICH THEY WERE ISSUED AND MUST BE RENEWED ANNUALLY, THAT'S LATER IN THE SECTION, BUT WHERE THEY'RE RENEWED IS THE QUESTION. NOT, NOT WHETHER, BUT WHERE ARE THEY RENEWED? THE FOOD VENDOR. YEAH. COULD YOU, COULD YOU DO SOMETHING THAT'S 12 MONTHS RENEWABLE UP TO A TOTAL OF THREE YEARS, BECAUSE YOU COULD HIT A YEAR IN BETWEEN THERE WHERE THERE'S A TOTAL BUST AND LUCKILY THEY'RE STILL IN A FOOD TRUCK SO THEY CAN SURVIVE, BUT THEY MAY NEED ANOTHER YEAR OR TWO TO BUILD BACK UP AND GET THEIR RESTAURANT. RIGHT. SO, YOU KNOW, THINGS GO UP AND DOWN. SO IF YOU COULD RENEW IT EVERY 12 MONTHS FOR SAY UP TO THREE YEARS, THEN THAT GIVES THEM TIME TO GROW AND FIGURE OUT THAT, JUST MY THOUGHT, UM, THE [00:25:01] PERMITS ACTUALLY FOR THE ACTUAL TRAILER ITSELF, IT'S NOT DEDICATED TO WHATEVER SPOT IT'S IN, RIGHT. YOU'RE JUST CERTIFYING THAT THAT PERSON IS QUALIFIED TO, TO OPERATE, UH, A MOBILE FOOD TRUCK. BUT THE PARTICULAR THING ABOUT A FOOD COURTSHIP SPECIFICALLY FOR THAT CORE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE NOT HAVING SOMETHING PERMANENTLY INSTALLED THERE. AND SO WE PUT THE 12 MONTH THING IN THERE TO MAKE SURE THAT THE DECK GETS SHUFFLED A LITTLE BIT, AT LEAST SO THAT THEY'RE NOT, AGAIN, TRYING TO CIRCUMVENT WHAT I WOULD CALL A WELL CIRCUMVENT TO WHAT IT WOULD TAKE TO PUT IN AN ACTUAL RESTAURANT AND JUST DOING IT ALL WITH, WITH MOBILE CARTS. I AGREE WITH YOUR FIRST PREMISE THAT THE PERMIT IS FOR THE VENDOR, UM, AND THE, AND THE VENDORS, UM, TEMPORARY OR MOBILE INFRASTRUCTURE. UM, THE, THE SPATIAL RESTRICTION PROBABLY A LITTLE BIT MORE NUANCED THAN THAT, BUT I'LL, I'LL SAY THAT THE LAST TIME THIS CAME UP IN LATE 2016 WAS ACTUALLY ADOPTED BY THE COUNCIL IN JANUARY OF 2017, UM, WAS PARTICULARLY STRICT THERE. THE REQUIREMENTS WERE, UH, WERE PRETTY ONEROUS AND THAT WAS BY DESIGN. SO, UH, THE EXPECTATION I THINK OF, YOU KNOW, THE CONVERSATION WE'VE HAD TONIGHT, I THINK WAS PROBABLY ACCURATE. I THINK IT'S SAFE TO ASSUME THAT THE IDEA WAS THAT, UM, FOOD TRUCKS NEED TO EITHER CONVERT INTO BRICK AND MORTAR HERE IN THE CITY, OR NEED TO MOVE ON AND THAT THE, THE ROTATION WAS PURPOSEFUL. SO MAKE, YOU KNOW, MAKE OF THAT, WHATEVER YOU WILL, WHETHER OR NOT YOU'RE, YOU'RE INTERESTED IN THAT CONTINUING OR NOT CONTINUING. UM, ULTIMATELY IT'LL BE A QUESTION FOR THE COUNCIL TO DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES IF THEY WANT HIGH TURNOVER OR IF THEY WANT, UH, A PERMANENT PRESENCE FOR TEMPORARY AND MOBILE FOOD VENDORS. BUT, UM, I THINK REALLY GOOD ARGUMENTS CAN BE MADE, UH, EITHER WAY I WILL SAY THE PERMITS DEFINITELY HAS TO BE INCLUDE SOME SORT IT'S NOT NECESSARILY FOR, JUST FOR THE TRUCK, BECAUSE IT INCLUDES A SITE PLAN. UH, IF YOU LOOK AT, UM, 0.8 UNDER THE SAME SECTION IS F EIGHT. UM, THIS IS A TEMPORARY FOOD VENDOR UNIT. IT'S NOT COMMERCIALLY DESIGNED, UM, TO BE A BRICK AND MORTAR MUST SUBMIT TO THE CITY BUILDING DEPARTMENT FOR REVIEW WITH APPLICATION OF PERMIT. ADDITIONALLY, A SITE PLAN MUST BE SUBMITTED. SO DO THEY HAVE BEEN WHERE THEY HAVE TO, IF WE'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT THE TRUCK, THEN DO THEY HAVE TO SUBMIT DIFFERENT SITE PLANS EVERY SINGLE TIME THEY GO OUT? OR IF THAT'S NOT THE THING THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, THE SITE IS INCLUDED IN THE PERMIT, THEY HAVE TO SHOW WHETHER THEY'RE GOING TO BE SETTING UP ON THE PROPERTY THAT THEY'RE GOING TO, UM, THAT'S WHAT THE PURPOSE OF THE SITE PLAN. AND ALSO, SO THEY CAN SHOW WHERE, UM, YOU KNOW, WHERE THE RESTROOM FACILITIES ARE, WHERE THE, UM, IT'S PRIMARILY JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE NOT TOO CLOSE TO THE PROPERTY EDGE AND STUFF LIKE THAT. AND NEIGHBORHOOD RESTROOM, FACILITIES AND PARKING TOO, IF, IF THERE'S PARKING AVAILABLE AND THIS AND THAT. SO THAT'S UNDER THE TEMPORARY SECTION AND THE DEFINITION BETWEEN TEMPORARY AND MOBILE IS, IS NUANCED, BUT IT'S THERE. AND IF I RECALL CORRECTLY, UM, MOBILE ARE POWERED UNITS AND TEMPORARY, UM, COULD EITHER BE TRAILERS OR THEY CAN BE NOT TO BE PEJORATIVE, BUT SHACKS, YOU KNOW, SMALLER SHEDS THAT TYPE OF THING. SO, UM, WE DEFINITELY WANT TO KNOW IF SOMETHING IS PLACED AT A SITE THAT ISN'T UPWARDLY MOBILE, THAT DOESN'T HAVE WHEELS LIKE THE SHEDS. SO THAT, THAT WOULD BE THE REQUIREMENT FOR THE, FOR THE SITE PLAN. SO YES, THERE IS A REQUIREMENT THAT WE WANT THEM TO BE COMPLIANT BEFORE THEY, BEFORE THEY START. SO THEN TO THE POINT THAT PAUL MADE ABOUT WHETHER IT FOLLOWS THE TRUCK OR THE SPOT, IT FOLLOWS THE SPOT, NOT EXCLUSIVELY. OKAY. YOU READY FOR SOME DIFFERENT QUESTIONS? UM, DO WE NEED TO BE CONCERNED? I KNOW WE'VE GOT SOMETHING IN HERE IN THE FOOD COURTS FOR PERMANENT LABORATORY FACILITIES, BUT DO WE NEED TO GET CONCERNED ABOUT TEMPORARY LABORATORY FACILITIES OR PORTA-POTTIES BEING INSTALLED IN SITES LIKE THAT? IS THERE A PROHIBITION AGAINST THAT? UM, THE REASON I BRING THAT UP AND THAT'S KIND OF A TWO-PART THINGS, ARE WE CONSIDERING, UH, ODORS IN ALL OF THIS, GIVEN THE POTENTIAL PROXIMITY FOR THEM TO BE WITHIN FOUR OR FIVE OR WHATEVER FEET, UH, YOU KNOW, IS ULTIMATELY DECIDED FROM A RESIDENTIAL, UH, DEVELOPMENT. UM, WHAT CONSIDERATION HAVE WE THOUGHT ABOUT WITH REGARD TO ODORS? UM, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, [00:30:01] IF A RESTAURANTS ARE ALLOWED IN ANY OF THESE, UH, TYPES OF ZONINGS, THERE MAY BE THAT, THAT PARTICULAR, UH, NUISANCE, IF YOU WILL PRESENT OR THAT POTENTIAL NUISANCE PRESENT ANYWAY, THAT, IS THERE SOMETHING ABOUT FOOD, FOOD COURTS? SO THAT'S MIGHT BE A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. MAYBE IT'S A LITTLE MORE DENSE OR A LITTLE CLOSER TO THE PROPERTY LINE. THAT, AND AGAIN, I DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE ANYTHING IN MIND, BUT I'M JUST WORRIED ABOUT WHAT ARE THE POTENTIAL THINGS THAT COULD COME UP AND BITE US AND BE A HEADACHE FOR COUNCIL AND, OR EVEN STAFF DOWN THE ROAD. SO IF YOU'RE HAVING A TEMPORARY VENDOR ON SITE, BUT YOU'RE NOT PART OF A FOOD COURT, YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO USE, UH, EXISTING PUBLIC FACILITIES THAT ARE NOT WELL. THEY HAVE TO HAVE BATHROOMS THAT ARE PROVIDED BY THE BUSINESS OWNER. IT'S ALREADY ON SITE. YOU CAN'T PUT A TEMPORARY FOOD TRUCK ON SITE WITHOUT THERE BEING RESTROOMS AVAILABLE. IF IT'S, UM, IF IT'S THERE FOR A LOT OF THEM, FOUR HOURS, I THINK IS THE ANSWER. UM, BECAUSE YOU, YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO PROVIDE TO A LOT OF PEOPLE USE THE RESTROOM AND THOSE, THOSE FACILITIES AREN'T PERMANENT. UM, THE, THE FOOD COURT, THEY HAVE TO HAVE PERMIT FACILITIES. THEY CANNOT HAVE, UM, PORT-A-POTTIES WELL, I GUESS THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN IS YOU COULD PLOP IN ONE PERMANENT FACILITY, BUT THEN THAT'S NOT ADEQUATE. AND SO YOU THROW A BUNCH OF PORTA-POTTIES ARE NEXT TO IT. DO WE, ARE WE ALLOWING THAT TO HAPPEN HERE? BECAUSE I THINK THAT WE PROBABLY DON'T WANT THERE TO BE TEMPORARY LABORATORIES, RIGHT? THAT'S CORRECT. THEY HAVE TO BE PERMANENT. THEY WENT WHEN THEY HAVE TO, IT COMES DOWN TO THE BUILDING CODE AND I DON'T KNOW THE DETAILS BEHIND IT, BUT, UM, IF THEY'RE PROJECTING TO HAVE SO MANY TABLES OR, OR WHATEVER SEATS AT THIS TEMPORARY FOOD VENDOR, AND THEY HAVE TO HAVE SOME PUBLIC RESTROOMS THAT ARE ALREADY ON SITE, THOSE RESTROOMS HAVE TO BE ABLE TO, THERE'S A RATIO FOR SEATS TO, UM, BOIL IT IF YOU WILL, UM, IN THE BUILDING CODE. AND SO THEY HAVE TO, THEY HAVE TO HAVE A SUFFICIENT NUMBER OF PLACES FOR PEOPLE TO USE THE RESTROOM. DO WE NEED TO BE EXPLICIT ABOUT THAT THOUGH? DO WE NEED TO PROHIBIT IT DIRECTLY? OR IS THERE ANOTHER MECHANISM FOR DOING THAT SOMEWHERE ELSE? LIKE YOU HAVE TO HAVE A PERMIT TO INSTALL, TO HAVE A PORTABLE FACILITY LIKE THAT. WHAT SPECIFIC LANGUAGE IN 1 77 READS THAT PERMANENT LABORATORY AND HAND-WASHING FACILITIES HAVE SUFFICIENT NUMBER AS DETERMINED BY THE BUILDING OFFICIAL USING THE INTERNATIONAL CODE COUNCILS RECOMMENDATION. SO IF YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE 12 PAD SITES, THERE SHOULD, THERE SHOULD BE AN EXPECTATION OF HOW MANY USERS CAN BE SERVICED BY THAT. AND, AND THERE'S, THERE'S A TABLE. I AM, I TRUST THAT THERE'S A TABLE. UH, SOMEWHERE THAT, THAT LISTS THAT INDICATES ON A SCHEDULE OF HOW BIG A SITE IS AN OUTDOOR SITE AND HOW MANY, UM, HOW BIG THE FACILITIES NEED TO BE, BUT WOULD ASSUME THEY PUT ENOUGH IN, BUT WE'RE NOT NECESSARILY PROHIBITING IT THOUGH. THERE'S NOTHING THAT WOULD PREVENT THEM FROM DOING THAT. I DON'T KNOW OF ANY LANGUAGE THAT'S IN 11, 1 77, THAT WOULD PROHIBIT THEM FROM PUTTING IN PORTABLE LABORATORIES. UM, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S THE ONLY CODE THAT WOULD, UM, WEIGH IN ON THAT. I WOULD HAVE TO TALK WITH SOME OTHER FOLKS IN PUBLIC WORKS OR ENGINEERING TO FIND OUT IF, IF THERE'S MORE TO IT THAN THAT. OKAY. I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION ON THAT LINE, JUST SO I UNDERSTAND THE CONCERN. IF IT'S A, IF IT'S A FOOD TRUCK ALONG THE SIDE OF THE ROAD, PORTA-POTTY, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE NOT EXCLUDING. AND I HESITATE TO USE THIS WORD BECAUSE I KNOW THEY HAVE TO HAVE PERMITS. AND I KNOW THAT LIKE POP-UP FESTIVALS, YOU KNOW, LET'S SAY IT'S 10 YEARS DOWN THE ROAD AND, AND THEY WANT TO HAVE SOMEBODY WANTS TO HAVE A FESTIVAL SOMEWHERE AND HAVE FOOD TRUCKS AND PORTA-POTTIES, BUT THAT WOULD ALL BE PART OF THE PERMITTING PROCESS RIGHT. OF EVERYTHING THEY DID. SO THAT WOULDN'T, YEAH, THAT'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT, IT WOULD ALL BE GOOD. OKAY. I'M FINE WITH SPECIAL EVENTS LIKE THAT OR NOT THIS, YEAH. THE ONE THING I DO WANT TO SAY LISTENING TO BOTH OF THESE THINGS, UM, IS IT, IT DOES BRING ME A LITTLE BIT OF CONCERN BECAUSE WHERE IS THE LINE BETWEEN AN EVENT OR A SPECIAL EVENT AND HAVING A REALLY SUCCESSFUL FOOD BARK, BECAUSE LIKE, WE CAN SAY IT IN A TABLE SOMEWHERE LIKE THIS IS HOW MANY BATHROOMS WOULD NECESSARILY BE NEEDED. WHAT IF WE EXPERIENCED A SUCCESSFUL FOOD PARK OR THAT THEY'RE SERVICING MORE THAN THAT? IS THERE, THERE, THERE ARE EXCEPTIONS MADE FOR BEING ABLE TO PUT ADDITIONAL RESTROOMS IN? CORRECT. IF NEEDED? I DON'T KNOW. I CAN'T ARTICULATE THAT TO YOU RIGHT NOW. OKAY. [00:35:09] ANYONE ELSE? ONE OTHER THING. AND I'LL STOP. HOW DOES ALCOHOL RELATE TO THIS? I'M JUST COMPLETELY AGNOSTIC TO LIQUOR SALE OR BEER AND ALCOHOL SALES. THAT'S COMPLETELY, THAT'S ENTIRELY SEPARATE THING. UM, CORRECT. OKAY. IS THAT ALL MR. ATKINSON? THAT'S ALL I HAVE ON THE, UH, THE FOOD TRUCK AMENDS. UM, SO IF BASICALLY THE CONVERSATION WE'LL BE LOOKING AT THE, UM, THE SETBACKS, UM, INFRASTRUCTURE IS PERMANENT OR NOT. AND ALSO LOOKING AT THIS, THIS PRO, DO WE NEED TO ADD ANYTHING PROHIBITING PORT-A-POTTIES OR NOT, OR A TEMPORARY LABORATORIES, IF YOU WILL. UM, IS THAT PRETTY ACCURATE FOR THE MOST PART? W WHAT ABOUT THE LENGTH THAT, THAT A FOOD TRUCK AND STAY AT ONE LOCATION? I MEAN, UH, I KNOW IT WASN'T PART OF THE LINE ITEMS HERE, BUT IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE DON'T HAVE A RECOMMENDATION, CAN WE ADD THAT ON? OR, YEAH. YEAH. THIS IS A WORK SESSION. SO ALTHOUGH, YOU KNOW, THIS WAS ADVERTISED IN YOUR PACKET AS OF LAST WEEK, THERE'S NO DECISION BEING MADE TONIGHT. THERE'S NO VOTE BEING TAKEN BY. IF SOMETHING WE WANT TO ADD, ADD IT, UH, IF THERE'S SOMETHING YOU WANT TO SEE CHANGE, CHANGE IT. IF YOU CAN THINK OF SOMETHING LATER ON, YOU CAN EMAIL STAFF AND WE'LL PUT IT IN THERE BECAUSE YOU WILL GET ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY TO ADDRESS THIS AT A PUBLIC HEARING. WHEN IT ACTUALLY COMES FORWARD TO YOU FOR THE, FOR THE TEXT CHANGE, WE'RE JUST, THIS WAS BROUGHT TO US BY EXECUTIVE MANAGEMENT AND THEY WANT THE CONVERSATION TO BEGIN BECAUSE THEY, THEY WANT TO SEE THIS CHANGE AND THIS, THIS AUTUMN, SO WE'RE STARTING TO, YEAH. SO I'D LIKE TO SEE THE ONE YEAR PERMIT RENEWABLE UP TO THREE YEARS PER LOCATION. CORRECT. BECAUSE IF WE GET SOMETHING THAT'S REALLY A DRAW THAT'S TO OUR ADVANTAGE TOO, YOU KNOW, IF, IF YOU GET ONE THAT'S REALLY A DRAW AND THEN IT ALSO CLUSTERS THE LITTLE STARTERS AROUND IT. AND IF THE HOT COMMODITY HAS TO MOVE DOWN THE ROAD, I THINK IT HURTS THE FOOD CODE OR FOR ALL, TO BE HONEST. OKAY. WHAT'S THE EXPECTATION IF THE OPERATOR CHANGES. SO AFTER TWO YEARS YOU GET A BRAND NEW OPERATOR, DOES THE CLOCK RESET OR DOES, IS IT THE INSTITUTION OR IS IT THE PERSON THAT NEEDS TO MOVE? WELL, I DON'T KNOW. WHAT DO YOU GUYS THINK OR UP TO, AND INCLUDING, BECAUSE THIS IS JUST REMOVE, REMOVE THE PROHIBITION ON, ON TIME PROHIBITION ON TIME. I'M WITH ALEX ON THAT. UM, WELL, AS FAR AS TO YOUR QUESTION, I THINK IT WOULD HAVE TO BE THE ACTUAL UNIT ITSELF, NOT NECESSARILY THE OWNER, BECAUSE OTHERWISE YOU COULD GET AROUND THIS BY SAYING, OH, WELL, MY WIFE NOW OWNS THIS BUSINESS. SO NOW WE GET A NEW THREE YEARS. AND SO I THINK THE ACTUAL UNIT ITSELF, AND, UH, YOU KNOW, BE PERSONALLY THREE YEARS IS A BIT LONG. I WAS THINKING MAYBE 24 MONTHS. BUT, UM, BUT, BUT YEAH, I'M, I'M FINE. I'M FINE GOING WITH WHATEVER EVERYBODY ELSE THINKS. UM, BUT I THINK WE HAVE TO BE THE UNIT ITSELF AND NOT THE OWNER. YEAH. I AGREE. I AGREE WITH, YEAH. AND THEN WE'LL BE BACK ON THE, OH, SORRY, GO AHEAD. I SAYING, JUST FOR REFERENCE, IT TOOK, UM, THE TOP FOOD TRUCK IN AUSTIN FOR AWHILE ALREADY PASTA ABOUT 27, 28 MONTHS TO START TO BEGIN TO TRANSITION TO A BRICK BUILDING. AND BY ABOUT 32, 33 MONTHS, THEY WERE INSIDE THE BRICK BUILDING. WELL, THAT'S GOOD. THREE YEARS MIGHT BE OKAY. OKAY. WELL, MY WHOLE THING ABOUT PORTA-POTTIES WASN'T PORTA-POTTIES HIMSELF. IT WAS JUST NOXIOUS ODORS. I'M WORRIED ABOUT THAT. AND I DON'T WANT THERE TO BE SOME OTHER ISSUE THAT MIGHT HAVE THE DOWNTOWN RESIDENTS, UH, NOT WANTING TO MOVE FORWARD ON SOMETHING. IT WAS CALLED THAT'S FAIR. RIGHT. SO IF THERE'S NO OTHER QUESTIONS, LET'S MOVE ON TO THE OTHER PORTION OR CODE THAT I PULLED UP. SO LET ME SHARE THE SCREEN. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. SO THE FIRST ONE IS SECTION 41 DASH 1 36, I BELIEVE BACK IN JULY, MAYBE LATE JUNE. UM, WE ALREADY REVIEWED THIS SPECIFIC SECTION, UM, FOR UTILITY LOTS, ALLOWING THOSE IN OUR SUBDIVISION CODE, BUT I JUST WANT TO BRING THERE, CAN YOU TELL ME SIDEBAR [00:40:01] TO MAKE YOUR, UH, THE TEXT A LITTLE BIT BIGGER? YEAH, I CAN MAKE IT BIGGER. I DON'T, I ACTUALLY HAVEN'T FIGURED OUT HOW TO DO THERE WE GO. JUST FIGURED IT OUT. AWESOME. THANK YOU. THERE YOU GO. UM, YES, SIR. UM, THIS IS JUST TO GIVE IT A LITTLE BIT OF FLEXIBILITY IN OUR SUBDIVISION CODE FOR ATYPICAL LOTS. UM, WE, UH, WE HAD INITIALLY PUT IT ON A COUNCIL AGENDA IN AUGUST EARLY AUGUST, LATE JULY, AND I THINK I SUSPECT THE COUNCIL AGENDA WAS OVERLOADED AND IT GOT REMOVED. SO I JUST WANT TO BRING IT BACK FORWARD. SO MAKING SURE THAT WE WERE ALL STILL ON THE SAME PAGE, THAT WE WERE STILL GOOD WITH. IF A SECTION 41 DASH 1 36, ADDING SOME SECTION G FOR UTILITY LOTS. ALL RIGHT. IF THERE'S NOTHING THERE AND PLEASE STOP ME IF THERE IS, I'M GONNA TO DOWN TO SECTION 53 33 CHART FOUR. OKAY. SO THIS ONE, THIS ONE HAS THE, THE ABILITY TO BE A LITTLE BIT EXPLOSIVE FROM A POLITICAL STANDPOINT, BUT WE'LL, WE'LL S WE'LL CHARGE FOR IT ANYWAY. UM, BECAUSE THE DEALS OF WORKING IN DOWNTOWN, WHICH IS ALWAYS, UM, LARGELY CONSIDERED THERE'S NOT ENOUGH PARKING, UM, WHETHER IT'S TRUE OR NOT. UM, THAT'S THE GENERAL FEELING OF IT. IT SEEMS THAT FROM THE CARE FROM GUESTS OR, UM, CITIZENS OR OTHER PEOPLE. SO, UM, RIGHT NOW, WHAT FOR A CBD ONE IN THE TWO ZONING DISTRICT, UM, IT PRETTY MUCH SAYS, UM, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF BEING, UM, ALONG CENTER MAIN OR FRONT STREETS. SO YOU HAVE TO HAVE ONE SPACE, ONE PARKING SPACE PER TWO SQUARE FEET OF GROSS FLOOR AREA. THAT GROSS FLOOR AREA IS SQUARE FOOTAGE OF EACH FLOOR WITHIN THE BUILDING COMBINED. SO IF IT'S A ONE-STORY BUILDING, IT'S JUST A SQUARE FOOTAGE. IT'S A TWO, IT'S A 2000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING. ONE STORY IS 2000 SQUARE FEET. IF IT'S A TWO STORY BUILDING, IT'S 2000 SQUARE FEET PER LEVEL, IT'S 4,000 SQUARE FEET. SO THE BIGGER, THE MORE LEVELS YOU HAVE, UM, THE MORE PARKING IS REQUIRED AND IT COMPOUNDS THE, THE COST AND THE, THE ABILITY OF HOW THE SITE IS LAID OUT. NOW, THIS IS IMPORTANT BECAUSE THE CBD ONE, AND PARTICULARLY THIS CBD TWO ZONING DISTRICT AROUND MARY HARTSON PARK, THIS IS A TRADITIONAL DOWNTOWN THAT WE HAVE THE PART THAT IS DEVELOPED AS A DOWNTOWN, THAT THE BUILDINGS ARE PUSHED RIGHT UP TO THE STREET. YOU HAVE A LOT OF PUBLIC STREET PARKING THERE'S ALLEYS BEHIND THEM WITH VERY LITTLE SPACE OTHERWISE, AND OUR PARKING CODE SHOULD REFLECT THE DESIGN OF THAT TRADITIONAL, UM, DOWNTOWN LAYOUT. AND SO THIS EDIT IS MEANT TO REFLECT THAT THE FIRST THING IT DID WAS TO REDUCE THE AUTOMATIC ONE SPACE FOR 200 SQUARE FEET OF, OF GROSS FLOOR AREA DOWN TO ONE, THREE SPACES PER 1000 SQUARE FEET. SO WE'RE, WE'RE LOWERING IT BY, BY TWO SPACES PER THOUSAND SQUARE FEET, IF YOU WILL. AND THAT'S PRETTY TYPICAL ALL ACROSS AMERICA, THAT'S PRETTY STANDARD FOR CODES, THREE SPACES PER THOUSAND SQUARE FEET. UM, SO THIS JUST MAKES IT MORE IN LINE WITH THAT, AND ALSO REDUCES THE BURDEN ON DEVELOPING A SITE, ESPECIALLY WHEN PARKING IS SUPER, SUPER LIMITED. RIGHT NOW, THE PARKING CODE REQUIRES MORE PARKING THAN YOU WOULD REQUIRE FOR A TARGET IN DOWNTOWN KYLE IN A PARKING LOTS LIKE FOR TARGET OR WALMART THEMSELVES. THE PARKING LOTS ARE BIGGER THAN MOST OF OUR DOWNTOWN IS AREA WISE JUST BY THEMSELVES. AND THAT'S JUST ABSOLUTELY PRACTICAL. AND YOU NEVER GOING TO GET THAT AMOUNT OF PARKING. AND IT'S ALSO GOING TO LIMIT DEVELOPMENT THAT WE MAY WANT TO SEE AROUND THE SQUARE OF THAT TRADITIONAL DOWNTOWN FEEL. UM, I ALSO INCLUDED, UM, SOME STUFF IN THERE WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT IT EXPANDS THE FLEXIBILITY FOR COUNCIL TO CONSIDER PARKING EXCEPTIONS IN A NINE BLOCK AREA AROUND CENTERED ON MARY ARTS PARK, WHICH IS THIS R SQUARE, IF YOU WILL, UM, WHERE THE SENIOR CENTER IS AND INCLUDING THE PERIMETER, ALL THE STREETS AND INSIDE THAT NINE AREA OF WALKING THE PERIMETER OF IT AS WELL, BECAUSE MOST OF THE PARKING WILL BE ALONG THE STREETS. UM, THIS IS WHERE YOU WON'T HAVE TO GO TO THE BOARD OF ADJUSTMENT TO GET A VARIANCE FOR PARKING, BUT THE COUNCIL AT THE, IT FEELS APPROPRIATE, CAN GRANT AN EXCEPTION FOR IT. AND THEY'VE DONE THAT ON SEVERAL OCCASIONS, UM, THROUGHOUT DOWNTOWN. NOW THE ONE PART THAT MAKES IT, ESPECIALLY, UM, THIS, THIS NEXT PART OF IT IS SOMETHING THAT I PERSONALLY BELIEVE IS A GOOD IDEA, BUT IT COULD BE CONSIDERED EXTREMELY PROGRESSIVE AND MAY SCARE PEOPLE RIGHT NOW, THE CBD CBD TWO ZONING DISTRICT, WE ALLOW VERTICAL MIXED USE, WHICH ALLOWS MULTIFAMILY ON NOW, ACTUALLY ON THE BOTTOM FLOOR AT THE BACK AND ALL THE FLOOR ABOVE IT. BUT THE WAY OUR CODE IS CURRENTLY WRITTEN WITH THE, WITH THE PARKING IS [00:45:01] IT'S ONE, IT'S PART OF THE ONE SPACE FOR 200 SQUARE FEET OF GROSS FLOOR AREA AND EVERYWHERE ELSE IN THE CITY WHEN IT COMES TO MULTI-FAMILY IT'S BETWEEN ONE AND A HALF TO TWO SPACES PER RESIDENTIAL UNIT OPS, IN MOST CASES, MAYBE TWO AND A HALF SPACES. AND SO THIS IS AN ATTEMPT TO BRING THEM BACK DOWN TO EARTH IN TERMS OF WHAT'S STANDARD FOR ARCANE, AND THEN IN TERMS OF MULTI-FAMILY AND THEN ALSO PUTTING A CAP ON IT AND GIVING IT MORE FLEXIBILITY. SO AS, AGAIN, AS PARKING IS AT A PREMIUM IN DOWNTOWN FROM HOW YOU CAN DEVELOP IT, THIS ALLOWS US TO BRING PEOPLE DOWNTOWN, BUT ALSO GIVES THE DEVELOPER A CHANCE TO ALLOW PARKING IF THEY WOULD LIKE FOR MULTI-FAMILY OR RESIDENTIAL USES IN THE CBD TWO ZONING DISTRICT. SO TYPICALLY NOT TYPICALLY, BUT ONE COULD BUILD IT WHERE THEY HAVE A HEAD IN PARKING AT THE BACK OF THE BUILDINGS, AND THOSE WOULD BE ONSITE. AND THEY WOULD BE FOR THE GUESTS OR FOR THE, FOR THE RESIDENTS. AND THEN THE COMMERCIAL PARKING WILL BE AT THE FRONT ALONG THE STREET. AND THAT'S, THAT'S A PRETTY TYPICAL LAYOUT. UM, THAT'S, THAT'S THE PARKING UPDATE. AND IF YOU WANT ANY CLARITY, PLEASE ASK WHAT I'M UNDERSTANDING HERE IS THERE'S NO MINIMUM PARKING. SO IF YOU HAVE AN APARTMENT ABOVE A BUSINESS, YOU'RE PARKING ON THE STREET, BUT THEN YOU'RE BLOCKING THE PARKING FOR THE RETAIL BUSINESS. I'M, I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THE RESIDENTS NEEDING THE STREET PARKING SO MUCH THAT THERE'S NO BUSINESS PARKING IN AN ISSUE. UM, I'M NOT GOING TO LIE, BUT, UM, I ALSO THINK THERE'S SOME, THERE'S AN ADVANTAGE TO HAVING A DEVELOPER TO HAVE FLEXIBILITY TO WHETHER THEY ARE REQUIRED TO HAVE PARKING FOR MULTIFAMILY OR NOT. AND THEN IF THEY DO WANT IT, THEY CAN, THEY CAN PROVIDE IT FOR THEIR, FOR THEIR TENANTS AS WELL. SO, YEAH. WELCOME TO CITY LIVING. THAT'S WHAT CITY, THAT'S WHAT CITY LIVING IS ABOUT. UH, I'M FROM A LARGE URBAN AREA AND THERE'S BUSINESSES AND THERE'S HOMES ABOVE APARTMENTS ABOVE THE BUSINESSES. AND IT'S CATCHES CATCH CAN SOME OF THE, UM, AREAS, NEIGHBORHOODS OFFERED, UH, PARKING PASSES FOR, TO PARK ON THE STREETS, BUT IT'S, YOU KNOW, LIVE AND LET LIVE. YOU JUST, YOU FIGHT FOR SPOTS AND THAT'S WHEN YOU'RE GOING MORE URBAN, THAT'S WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN. RIGHT. I, I, HONESTLY, WHEN I COME DOWNTOWN, I HAVE NOT HAD A PARKING PROBLEM. I WAS THE HEAD OF A DDA IN COLORADO THAT WE PRAYED FOR A PARKING PROBLEM IN OUR DOWNTOWN. WE WERE REDEVELOPED. WE WERE REDEVELOPING THAT ONE. AND, UM, ARE THERE PARKING LIMITS SO MANY HOURS SO MUCH TIME? OR IS IT SO, SO A RESIDENT COULD PARK IN FRONT OF A BUSINESS FOR AS LONG AS THEY WANTED TO OR NEEDED TO AND NOT HAVE TO MOVE THERE. THE RESIDENT CAN PARK ON THE CITY STREET, ANYBODY CAN PARK, RIGHT. BUT FOR AS LONG AS THEY WANT. OKAY, THANK YOU. THAT'S WHAT I NEED. I BELIEVE THAT AS LONG AS THE VEHICLE IS IN PROPER REPAIR, RIGHT, THEY CAN'T BE DERELICT. IT CAN'T HAVE EXPIRED TAGS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. I DON'T BELIEVE WE HAVE ON BLOCKS TRYING TO THINK OF THERE ANY LIMITED HOURS FOR STREET CLEANING OR GARBAGE SERVICE, OR I DON'T, I'VE NEVER SEEN ANY SIGNS ON CENTER STREET THAT, THAT MAKE YOU MOVE A VEHICLE. YOU MAY SEE THAT DOWN THE ROAD, BUT RIGHT. AND YOU'RE RIGHT. THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS. THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS. BUT IT'S IT'S, IF THIS IS GOING TO HAPPEN, IF THIS IS WHERE WE'RE GOING, THEN IT'S NOT JUST GOING TO BE DOWNTOWN. IT WILL BE IN OTHER SECTIONS OF THE CITY. THAT'S JUST THE WAY IT IS. OKAY. ARE ANY OF THE PARKING SPACES THAT ARE BEING DISCUSSED IN THESE, UH, POSSIBLY CAPABLE OF BEING DEDICATED? AND I MENTIONED THAT AS BEING A POSSIBLE NEGATIVE, LIKE THE ONES IN THE RAIN, IF THERE'S SOME IN THE REAR, WOULD THOSE BE DEDICATED PARKING SPOTS FOR RESIDENT? AND DO WE WANT THAT ON PRIVATE PROPERTY? THEY CAN BE. I MEAN, TH THE OWNER OF THE SPACE CAN DESIGNATE WHOMEVER IS ALLOWED TO BE ON THE PROPERTY AND PRESCRIBED THE MANNER THEY CAN BE ON THE PROPERTY IN THE RIGHT OF WAY. IT WOULD HAVE TO BE PRESCRIBED FROM THE COUNCIL. THEY HAD, THEY HAD TALKED EARLIER A LITTLE OVER A YEAR AGO. UM, WHEN, WHEN THE IDEA OF CLOSING DOWN RESTAURANTS AND BARS, RESTAURANT, AND BAR OWNERS CAME FORWARD WANTING TO KNOW IF THEY COULD, UM, BEGIN SERVICE OUTDOORS IN KYLE. AND BECAUSE SOME OF OUR SIDEWALKS ARE PRETTY THIN AND THERE WASN'T A LOT OF ROOM THEY WANTED TO MAKE, UM, THE SAME TYPE OF SPACES THAT I'VE SEEN IN SAN FRANCISCO, WHERE THEY TAKE THE PARKING SPACE [00:50:01] IN FRONT OF THE STORE AND MAKE IT NOT AVAILABLE FOR PARKING. AND INSTEAD THEY PUT IN BENCHES OR PICNIC TABLES OR BISTRO TABLES, OR WHAT HAVE YOU, AND TRY AND CREATE, UM, A SEPARATION FROM THE TRAFFIC TO, UH, THAT SPACE. AND THERE WERE, THERE WAS TALK ABOUT IT. UH, I DON'T THINK IT EVER WENT ANYWHERE, BUT IT WAS, UM, TRYING TO DELINEATE PUBLIC SPACES FOR PRIVATE PURPOSE. UM, SO THAT IS AN ACT THAT HAS TO, THROUGH, UH, OUR COUNCIL, THE THREE SPACES FOR EVERY THOUSAND AND UNDERSTOOD TO BE PUBLIC PARKING, OR IT COULD BE A MIX OF PUBLIC AND PRIVATE. IT CAN BE A BIT OF A MIX. IT REALLY IS. SITE-SPECIFIC. UM, FOR EXAMPLE, IF, IF YOU HAVE A, A CORNER LOT FLINK AND A SQUARE AT, AT THE INTERSECTION, YOU HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY. IF YOU HAVEN'T BUILT IT YET, UM, TO BUILD SPACES ON EACH CORNER THAT COULD BE PUBLIC, AND THEN YOU MIGHT HAVE SOME ROOM IN THE BACK TO DEDICATE A FEW SPACES FOR PRIVATE USES, UM, AND AS WELL, UM, IT JUST KIND OF DEPENDS. IT'S REALLY SITE SPECIFIC. OKAY. UM, I HAVE A COUPLE THINGS. SO, UH, FIRST WILL I DO, UM, AGREE WITH THE MULTIFAMILY AT THE END, THE MULTI-FAMILY HAS A MAXIMUM PARKING REQUIREMENT OF TWO SPACES PER RESIDENTIAL UNIT. I THINK FOR MULTI-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL SPECIFICALLY, WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT NUMBER OF SPACES PER UNIT, NOT NECESSARILY NUMBER OF SPACE SPACES PER, PER THE SIZE. SO, UM, I AGREE WITH THAT CHANGE. THE OTHER THING I HAVE, I HAVE A QUESTION IT'S PROBABLY A VERY BASIC QUESTION, BUT, BUT, BUT GOING FROM 200 SQUARE FEET FOR ONE UNIT TO THREE UNITS FOR 1000, UM, WHAT, W W WHAT HAPPENS IF THE SIZE DOESN'T END IN A NICE ROUND NUMBER? LIKE IF IT ENDS AT 900 D DO WE ROUND IT? UM, IS THAT HOW IT WORKS? I JUST, I DON'T KNOW. YEAH. SO, YEAH, WE DEAL WITH THAT ON A DAILY BASIS. FOR EXAMPLE, LET'S SEE, UH, IF, IF YOUR RATIOS, WE HAVE A MINIMUM AND A MAXIMUM TYPICALLY, SO THE W WHAT'S IN HERE ON THE T ON THE CHART IS THE MINIMUM THAT'S CALCULATED, AND THEN YOU CAN GET UP TO 50% INCREASE, UM, OF THAT. AND THAT'S YOUR MAXIMUM, TYPICALLY FROM A COMMERCIAL STANDPOINT. SO, UM, LET'S SAY YOU HAVE, OH, I DON'T KNOW. LET'S JUST SAY 31 SPACES, OR LET'S SAY YOU HAVE 30.6, SEVEN SPACES AND MINIMUM REQUIRED. WELL, YOU GOT AROUND IT UP TO 31 BECAUSE WE CAN'T HAVE POINTS SIX, SEVEN SPACES FOR A PARKING SPACE. UM, BUT IT GOES, IT GOES THE OTHER DIRECTION. WHEN YOU GO TO THE MAXIMUM, YOU HAVE TO ROUND DOWN BECAUSE YOU CAN'T EXCEED THE MAXIMUM. DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? YES. THANK YOU. I JUST WASN'T SURE. CAUSE CAUSE EVERY 200 FEET, YOU KNOW, THAT, THAT COMES PRETTY OFTEN A THOUSAND, IF SOMEONE WAS GOING TO TRY TO WORK THE SYSTEM, BUT NO, I'M GLAD. SO YES, I'M IN FAVOR OF, OF THIS AS IT'S PROPOSED, I'M VERY MUCH IN FAVOR OF THIS. UM, MY EXPERIENCE HAS DOWNTOWN TELLS ME WE HAVE TOO MUCH PARKING DOWNTOWN. I'M GONNA CATCH A LOT OF FLUX THAT, UM, BECAUSE WE SPEND A WHOLE LOT OF TIME TRYING TO SAY, WE WANT PEDESTRIANS DOWNTOWN, BUT WE'RE PUTTING OUR PEDESTRIANS IN MORE DANGEROUS SITUATIONS BY SHOVING MORE AND MORE AND MORE PARKING DOWN THERE. WHY WOULD I WANT TO WALK DOWN THERE? WE WANT TO, IF YOU WANT TO MAKE THIS A WALKABLE URBAN AREA, WE HAVE TO PUT THOSE POLICIES INTO PLACE AND YOU GOT TO EAT. SOME PEOPLE ARE GOING TO GO. SOME PEOPLE, OTHER PEOPLE ARE GOING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT THIS. I THINK I DEFINITELY SEE WHERE THERE'S GOING TO BE A LOT OF PUSHBACK, BUT I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO RECOGNIZE THAT AS KYLE GROWS, UM, WE NEED TO HAVE SPACES. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT HAVING HOUSING STOCK FOR EVERYBODY. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT HAVING COMMERCIAL STOCK FOR EVERYBODY. WE'VE TALKED ABOUT HAVING A SPACE FOR EVERYONE TO CALL KYLE HOME. URBAN PEOPLE ARE PART OF THAT TOO. AND WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT IF WE ARE DEVELOPING THE CBD AND CBD TO, TO BE IN THAT SORT OF SPACE, THAT WE INCLUDE THE FACT THAT THERE SHOULD BE NO MORE THAN TWO SPACES PER RESIDENTIAL UNIT. UM, AND I AGREE WITH ALEX ON THAT. UM, AND IT DEFINITELY ALSO LOOKING AT LIKE THE DIRECTION OF THE PARKING. THERE'S SO MUCH LIKE THIS NASTY PERPENDICULAR PARKING WHEN WE SHOULD BE LOOKING TOWARD, TOWARDS, UM, PARKING THAT IS, UM, CLOSER TO THE STREET SIDE. I CAME FROM THE NAME OF IT, THE BACKENDS PARKING, UM, STYLE SPACES. I KNOW THAT'S NOT ALWAYS THE MOST POPULAR THING TO SAY, BUT THAT IS MY SPECIFIC TAKE ON IT. AND I AM HAPPY TO STAND BY THAT WHEN RESIDENTS TELL ME THAT PARKING, THAT'S THE PROBLEM. USUALLY IT'S THE ON PARKING TOO. SO I HEAR YOU ON THE BACK END. ANYONE ELSE? OKIE DOKIES. WE'RE DONE WITH THAT. COOL. ALL RIGHT. SO THE NEXT SECTION IS 53 [00:55:01] DASH 1 43 FOR SITE OF REGULATIONS WERE PERTAINING TO THE ROTC ZONING DISTRICT AND THAT'S TOWNHOMES. UM, SO AT A TOWNHOME IN KYLE IS A MINIMUM OF FOUR ATTACHED UNITS THAT ARE SINGLE FAMILY. SO YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET A, MULTI-LEVEL LIKE A MULTILEVEL APARTMENT COMPLEX WITH STACKED FLATS ON TOP OF EACH OTHER. IT'S SIDE-BY-SIDE FORT APACHE IT'S MINIMUM. SO I TIP WHEN IT, WHEN PEOPLE ASK WHAT THAT IS, SOMETIMES I'LL SAY, OKAY, YOU KNOW, THE BROWNSTONES IN BROOKLYN, NEW YORK, THOSE ARE TOWNHOMES THEY'RE SIDE BY SIDE. AND THAT WAY IT MAY NOT BE THAT NICE NECESSARILY, BUT THAT'S THE TOWNHOME. THEY USUALLY GET A GOOD UNDERSTANDING. NOW WE ARE PROPOSING TO EDIT SECTION FIVE GARAGES WHEN THIS WAS WRITTEN AND WE'RE NOT SURE WHY IT HAPPENED. IT WAS BEFORE ANY OF US ON STAFF WERE HERE. UM, THEY REQUIRED GARAGES TO BE 480 SQUARE FEET PER TOWNHOUSE AND A TOWNHOME BY DEPTH. THE WAY OUR CODE READS, THEY ARE SUPER SMALL, LOTS THEY'RE MINIMUM OF 22 FEET WIDE AND 880 SQUARE FEET PER UNIT. SO REQUIRING A 480 SQUARE FOOT GARAGE, IT JUST SIMPLY DOESN'T FIT ON EACH LOT. UM, BECAUSE THEN YOU'LL BE STUCK TO A FRONT DOOR. IF YOU CAN FIT A FRONT DOOR ON THERE AT ALL, THAT'D BE TWO TO THREE FEET WIDE TOPS, INCLUDING THE HALLWAY BEHIND IT, NOT JUST THE DOOR ITSELF. UM, SO IT JUST, IT DOES, IT DOES IT, PHYSICS DOES NOT WORK. SO WE'RE ALIVE. WE'RE PROPOSING TO EDIT THIS, UM, FOR ONE, JUST TO STRIKE THE REQUIREMENT THAT WE DO REQUIRE GRADUATES FOR TOWN HALLS, YOU'RE ALLOWED TO HAVE ONE. UM, IT W WE'RE STRIKING THE REQUIREMENT THAT IT HAS TO BE 480 SQUARE FEET. UM, IF YOU DO HAVE ONE AND THEN MAKING IT A LITTLE BIT MORE FLEXIBLE ABOUT HOW YOU, UM, ALLOWED TO WHERE YOU'RE ALLOWED TO PUT IT ON THE LOT. SO, UM, THAT'S WHY WE ADDED SUBSECTION FOUR. AND IT'S AS SIMPLE AS THAT REQUIRING A 480 SQUARE FOOT GARAGE FOR A TOWNHOME IS ABSURD. AND WE'RE TRYING TO DIVERSIFY OUR HOUSING STOCK. AND EVERY TIME SOMEONE REZONES TO OUR WARRANTY, THEN THEY GET STUMBLED UPON THIS PART. AND LIKE, WE JUST CAN'T BUILD THIS, THIS DOESN'T WORK. LIKE THERE'S NO WAY TO MAKE THIS WORK. AND IT'S, IT'S EXTREMELY DIFFICULT. SO THAT'S WHY WE BROUGHT THIS ONE FORWARD. ANY QUESTIONS? YEAH, I, UM, I READ THIS AND I TOTALLY GET THE THING WITH THE GARAGE. I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH NOT REQUIRING THE GARAGE. UM, I LIVE IN A BRAND NEW NEIGHBORHOOD WITH A 380 SQUARE FOOT GARAGE SETBACK, 15 FEET AND NO PARKING ON THE STREETS. AND I WILL TELL YOU THAT IT'S ALMOST A WAR ZONE BECAUSE 60% OF THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE THERE HAVE PICKUP TRUCKS, THEY DON'T FIT IN THE GARAGE. THEY DON'T FIT IN THE DRIVEWAY IN THE CAMP PARK ON THE STREET, AND IT'S GETTING REALLY TOUGH. SO ALL I'M ASKING IS YOU HAVE OTHER LANGUAGE THAT I WENT THROUGH BEFORE. I WAS READING THIS, DOING MY HOMEWORK BEFORE THAT REQUIRED THAT THERE BE TWO PARKING SPACES PER TOWNHOUSE. AND I DON'T CARE IF IT'S THE DRIVEWAY OR IN A PARKING SITE, BUT IT NEEDS, THOSE NEED TO BE A CERTAIN SIZE BECAUSE I CAN TELL YOU, THE DEVELOPER WILL GIVE THEM 300 SQUARE FEET. NOBODY'S TRUCK IS GOING TO FIT AND IT'S GOING TO BE UGLY. SO LIKE 480 SQUARE FOOT, TWO PARKING SPACES, MINIMUM SIZE, 480 SQUARE FEET. I DON'T CARE IF THEY'RE IN A PARKING LOT, THEY NEED TO BE ABLE TO PARK THEIR TRUCK. YES. OKAY. SO OUR CODE ALREADY PROVIDES FOR THAT. SO OUR WARRANTY REQUIRES YES, MA'AM OUR WARRANTY ALONG WITH OUR ALL THE SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL. SO THEY REQUIRE TWO SPACES, MINIMUM FOR EACH LIVING UNIT AND ONE HALF SPACE FOR EACH ADDITIONAL BEDROOM ABOVE TWO BEDROOMS. UH, BUT IT'S NOT SAYING HOW LARGE A SPACE. WELL, BUT OUR MINIMUM IS 18 AND A HALF BY NINE. SO IF YOU HAVE, UM, SORRY, RIGHT. WE'LL PICK UP FIT IN THAT BIG EXTENDED F150. Y'ALL WITH TRUCKS. MY MOM, MY, MY, MY CREW CAB SHORT BED TRUCK IS MORE THAN 18 AND A HALF FEET LONG. I THINK THIS IS THE LITTLE TRUCK LIVE AND THAT'S, I THINK I KNOW, CAUSE I THINK I'VE DRIVEN AROUND THE LITTLE THING AND IT ISN'T TERRIBLE. IT'S UGLY. IT'S AWFUL. PEOPLE ARE SELLING THEIR HOUSES. AND I MEAN, IT'S BECOMING THIS FIGHTS IN THE STREET. IT IS THIS. I DON'T WANT TO SET THAT UP IN TOWNHOUSES. THESE FOLKS ARE WORK. I'M NOT KIDDING. AND THESE ARE BRAND NEW HOMES. [01:00:01] THESE ARE, UM, SO I'M I'M SINCE YOU KNOW IT, MY CAR FITS IN MY GARAGE AND I HAVE A DRIVEWAY, SO I'M NOT IN THE FIGHT, BUT, UM, I'M WATCHING THIS AND, UH, PEOPLE ARE HAVING TO SELL THEIR HOMES. IT'S JUST, IT'S REALLY BAD. SO WE NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT THE DEVELOPER IS, YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE BUYING THIS ARE WORKING PEOPLE AND A LOT OF THEM ARE GOING TO WORK IN CONSTRUCTION. AND A LOT OF THEM ARE GOING TO HAVE A NICE SIZED TRUCK. SO THE SPACE THAT THAT DEVELOPER PROVIDES, EVEN IF IT'S A SURFACE SPACE, NEEDS TO BE BIG ENOUGH FOR THEIR TRUCK TO PARK OR IT'LL END UP ON THE STREET. THAT'S WHERE LENDUP IS ON THE CITY STREETS. PLUM CREEK HAS A DIFFERENT STANDARD, RIGHT? WELL, THEY HAVE A SQUARE FOOTAGE STANDARD. THEY DON'T HAVE A DIMENSIONAL STANDARD. YEAH, IT'S AWFUL. DON'T THEY, IT'S JUST PUTTING THAT OUT THERE. WE'RE NOT VOTING TONIGHT. WE'RE JUST TALKING. WE'RE JUST TALKING HERE. SO THEY'RE PRIVATE STREETS AND THEY'RE NOT EVEN GLAD ENOUGH. I MEAN, TOWNHOMES, AREN'T THE ONLY OPTION, RIGHT? I MEAN, I, I KINDA THINK THIS IS ONE OF THOSE. LET THE MARKET DECIDE IF YOU'VE GOT TO. I MEAN, I HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT I THINK IT TAKES DEVELOPERS PICK A HOUSING TYPE. YOU SHOULDN'T PICK AN ARCHITECTURE TYPE BECAUSE OF WHAT'S YOUR DRIVE REALLY? WELL, IF YOU, IF YOU ARE PICKING A HOUSE THAT SPECIFICALLY DOES NOT HAVE A GARAGE, A HOME, THAT WAS IT. IT'S AN OPTION. WE HAVE, YOU WANT THAT OPTION. ABSOLUTELY. THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT SHOULD BE ALLOWED. THERE SHOULD BE MORE DIVERSIFICATION. AND SO I AM FOR THIS, BUT YES, LIKE I, IT'S ONE THING WHEN I BOUGHT MY HOUSE, I SPECIFICALLY BOUGHT ONE WITH THE DRIVEWAY THAT WAS LONGER THAN, THAN SOME OF MY OTHER NEIGHBORS, BECAUSE I CHOSE FOR THAT. AND SO I THINK THE OPTIONS ARE FINE. HAVING TOWNHOMES THAT DO NOT HAVE GARAGES, IF YOU WOULD LIKE THAT OPTION IT, IT COULD BE THERE. WOULD IT BE THE BEST OPTION FOR MANY PEOPLE? NO, BUT IT, BUT IT COULD BE AN OPTION FOR SOME, I THINK IT'S GREAT THAT YOU CAN AFFORD THAT CHEAPER THAT WAY, RIGHT? YEAH. YEAH. I I'M RIGHT AWAY. I'LL BUY THE CHEAPER ONE. THAT'S EXACTLY. WE HAD A COUPLE OF PEOPLE THAT BUY LESS EXPENSIVE HOMES WITH AN EIGHT FOOT DRIVEWAY AND A GIANT PICKUP TRUCK. HOW DO YOU, HOW DO YOU DO THAT? BUT I DON'T KNOW. PEOPLE SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO MAKE A DECISION IF THEY DIDN'T MAKE THE BEST DECISION THEY CAN. BUT I WANT TO PUSH BACK. I WANT TO PUSH BACK A LITTLE BIT ON THIS BECAUSE I WANT TO HEAR WHAT HE HAS TO SAY. I THINK WE'RE LOOKING AT THIS AS IF IT'S A CHOICE. WHEREAS IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT IT FROM AN EXPENSE PERSPECTIVE, YOU CAN SAY, WELL, I, YOU CAN GO LIVE IN ANOTHER NEIGHBORHOOD. UM, AS A CHOICE, MAYBE I DON'T WANT TO, MAY, I WANT TO SEND MY KIDS TO A SPECIFIC SET OF SCHOOLS. AND I THINK THAT WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL WHEN WE ARE DESIGNING THINGS TO NOT MAKE THAT CHOICE BETWEEN WHAT IS, UM, YOU KNOW, HOW WE WOULD MAKE THAT DECISION, BECAUSE WHILE WE MAY BE ABLE TO AFFORD TO MAKE THESE CHOICES, NOT EVERYBODY IS ABLE TO AFFORD TO MAKE THESE CHOICES AND THEY MAY WANT TO BE IN A SPECIFIC AREA. SO WE HAVE TO BE VERY CAREFUL WHEN WE PLAN THESE FOR IT, ESPECIALLY WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT THESE UNITS BEING MORE AFFORDABLE, THAT MAY BE THE ONLY CHOICE SOMEONE HAS FOR HOMEOWNERSHIP. ALL I'M SAYING IS I JUST LOOK AT THE PARKING PER PARKING SPACE MEASUREMENTS. THAT'S ALL I'M ASKING. SO A TOWNHOUSE SHOULD HAVE, OR ANYTHING THAT WE BUILD SHOULD HAVE AN AREA THAT'S BIG ENOUGH FOR A HUGE TRUCK TO PARK. EVEN IF IT'S A PARKING LOT, YOU KNOW, LIKE THEY MAY HAVE COMMON PARKING AREAS. EV EVERY THING WE OFFER IN THE CITY, THAT'S HOW YOU FEEL. I DON'T KNOW. DOES THAT INCLUDE DOWNTOWN PARKING? THAT'S WHAT I MEAN, LIKE, I DON'T KNOW HOW WE CAN CONTROL THAT. I DON'T KNOW HOW WE, HOW WE DO. CAN I ASK, CAN I ASK A QUESTION ABOUT TOWNHOUSES? GO? COOL. UM, W HOW MUCH R ONE T STOCK DO WE CURRENTLY HAVE? HOW MUCH DEMAND HAVE WE HAD FOR OUR WOMEN'S STUFF? AND DOES THIS ACTUALLY CHANGE ANY OF THIS? THIS WILL ENABLE IT, BUT IF WE GET RIDICULOUS AND ENFORCING OVERSIZED PARKING REQUIREMENTS, IT'S GOING TO KILL IT AGAIN AND WE'LL HAVE NONE. THAT'S THE WAY I LOOK AT IT. WAIT, WAIT A MINUTE. I HAVE TO SAY HI TO, TO MATTHEW, BECAUSE HE HAS NOT BEEN ON THAT SCREEN ALL NIGHT. I HAVEN'T SEEN HIM. SO HI, MATT. I KEEP GETTING UNSTABLE CONNECTION. SO I WAS TURNING IT OFF. I ACTUALLY AGREE, UH, WITH PAUL, UM, [01:05:01] YOU'RE, YOU'RE MAKING A POINT THAT YOU WANT AFFORDABILITY, BUT THEN YOU'RE FORCING THE DEVELOPER TO REDUCE THEIR, UH, ABILITY TO BUILD A HIGH DENSITY IS WHERE AFFORDABILITY COMES IN. AND UNFORTUNATELY IN HIGH DENSITY, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET THE 20 FOOT LONG DRIVEWAY. THAT'S GOING TO FIT A LARGE TRUCK. IT JUST IS WHAT IT IS A DEVELOPERS THAT COULD COME IN AND SAY, OKAY, WE'LL BUILD, WE'LL BUILD A 500 SQUARE FOOT GARAGE. THAT'LL FIT A LARGE TRUCK IN THERE. WHAT WE'RE GOING TO NOW HAVE LESS CAPACITY AND REDUCE THE, UM, THE DENSITY. IT JUST, IT'S JUST DOESN'T MAKE FINANCIAL SENSE FOR THEM TO DO THAT. WE HAVE TWO LARGE, UM, PROPERTIES INSIDE THE CITY OF KYLE THAT REESE WITHIN THE LAST YEAR HAVE BEEN REZONED FOR OUR WARRANTY. I WANTED TO BE IN THE LIVE OAK TRACK. UM, THAT'S A LITTLE BIT WEST OF KYLE ELEMENTARY, THREE, AND THE OTHER ONE BEING PART OF THE SPOONER TRACK, WHICH IS ON THE EAST POST ROAD. AND BOTH OF THEM, THIS IS THE, THE HITCH IN THEIR GIDDY-UP. THEY CAN'T, THEY CANNOT, THEY CAN'T GET PAST THIS 480 SQUARE FOOT ROLL. UM, AND IT'S LIKE, AND THEY WANT TO, THEY WANT TO BE ABLE TO TRY AND DESIGN OUR CODE TO OUR CODE, BUT THEY'RE HAVING A LOT OF TROUBLE WITH IT BECAUSE DIMENSIONALLY, IT CAN NOT MAKE IT FIT FOR WHAT THEY'RE ALLOWED TO BUILD WITHIN THE DISTRICT FROM, AND TO MAKE IT, AND THEY'RE NOT DOING IT FOR FREE. LIKE, WE ALL KNOW THAT THEY'RE THERE TO MAKE PROFIT, AND THAT'S FINE TO BE ABLE TO BUILD, TO BUILD HOUSES, BUT THERE, THE GARAGES ARE JUST TOO BIG. WELL, I GET THE, I GET EVEN NOT REQUIRING THE GARAGE IN THOSE SUBDIVISIONS IS STRAIGHT PARKING ALONE. SO IF PEOPLE'S CAR VEHICLE DOESN'T FIT LIKE IN THEIR DRIVE IS SO THE HALF THE PROBLEM WITH ANSWERING THAT QUESTION IS WE HAVEN'T HAD ANYBODY BUILD TOWNHOME PROJECTS SINCE I'VE BEEN HERE SIX YEARS NOW. UM, I, I, I PROMOTE IT SHAMELESSLY. I MEAN, EVERY TIME SOMEBODY COMES IN, WE HAD FIVE OR SO ACRES AND, UH, KYLE 47 OVER THERE, WHICH IS OVER BY, UH, WALLACE, RIGHT BEHIND THE POST OFFICE OF THAT. AND I'M MAKING THIS NUMBER UP. IT WAS WHAT, 30, SOME ACRES, 37, 47, SOMETHING LIKE THAT ACRES 45 ACRES. AND THEY CARVED OFF ABOUT FIVE ACRES IN THE SOUTHWEST CORNER FOR A TOWNHOME ATTACHED PRODUCT. BUT, UM, THE LONG ANSWER IS IT'S, IT'S POSSIBLE MOST LIKELY. I MEAN, SO WHERE WE COME FROM BACK EAST TOWNHOME PROJECTS WERE USUAL AND CUSTOMARY. UH, THE LAST COUPLE OF CITIES THAT I WORKED IN, IN SUBURBAN ATLANTA, ALMOST EVERYTHING THAT WAS HAPPENING WAS TOWNHOMES BECAUSE OF THE SMALL LOTS. AND THEY WERE ALL INFILL. AND TO GET THE DENSITY YOU NEEDED FOR IT TO PENCIL OUT, YOU NEEDED MORE DWELLING UNITS. AND TO GET THAT DENSITY, YOU HAD TO HAVE ATTACHED UNITS. UM, THEY'RE, THEY'RE A CURIOUS MIX OF SINGLE-FAMILY AND MULTI-FAMILY, UM, THE BUILDING CODE RESPECTS THEM AS BEING, UM, ACTUALLY COMMERCIAL. UH, THEY HAVE FIREWALLS BETWEEN THEM, BUT THEN FROM A LAND PERSPECTIVE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE ONE FAMILY ATTACHED, RIGHT? YOU HAVE YOUR OWN ENTRANCE INTO YOUR OWN SPACE THAT YOU SECURE. UM, AS FAR AS PARKING GOES, MOST OF THEM HAVE A VERY WIDE DRIVE AISLE IN FRONT OF THEM AND THERE'S 90 DEGREE PARKING. SO IN THAT RESPECT, IT'S ALMOST LIKE AN APARTMENT BUILDING, RIGHT? LIKE YOU GO TO ANY OF OUR GARDEN APARTMENTS THAT WE HAVE AROUND HERE, THREE-STORY GARDEN APARTMENTS. YOU'VE GOT A WIDE DRIVE AISLE THAT IS AT MINIMUM 24 FEET WIDE, BUT PROBABLY GOING TO BE CLOSER TO 26 OR 28 FEET. SO YOU'VE GOT 13 OR 14 FEET PER LINE. AND THEN OFF OF THAT IS 90 DEGREE PARKING SPACES, RIGHT? THAT IS NOT A ROAD BY OUR STANDARDS. IT'S IT IS A DRIVEWAY. UM, YOU COULD DO THE SAME THING WITH PRIVATE STREETS. YOU COULD TECHNICALLY DO THE SAME THING WITH PUBLIC STREETS. YOU COULD HAVE ON STREET PARKING BECAUSE, UM, THE WAY THAT WE'VE REDUCED THE MINIMUM LOT WIDTH REQUIREMENT AND OUR UNDERSTANDING THAT JUST BECAUSE YOUR PROPERTY TOUCHES PUBLIC RIGHT OF WAY, IT DOES NOT MEAN YOU HAVE TO TAKE ACCESS FROM THAT PUBLIC RIGHT OF WAY. FOR INSTANCE, YOU CAN SUBDIVIDE OFF THE FRONTAGE ROAD ALONG THE , BUT YOU DON'T NECESSARILY NEED A DRIVEWAY CURB CUT ONTO THAT FRONTAGE ROAD. THERE CAN BE A SERVICE ROAD BEHIND FROM WHAT YOU TAKE ACCESS. SAME THING CAN HAPPEN AT A SMALLER SCALE IN A TOWNHOME COMPLEX. AND YOU'VE SEEN THIS BEFORE, WHERE YOU'LL SEE A TOWNHOME FROM THE MAIN ROAD, BUT YOU MIGHT HAVE TO GO DOWN TO THE CORNER AND THEN GO IN, AND THEN YOU COME IN OFF THE BACK SOMEWAY, AND THEN THERE'S AN INTERIOR, UH, STREET NETWORK FROM WHICH THOSE HOMES, YOU KNOW, TAKE ACCESS. SO, UM, [01:10:03] IT'S A, IT'S A FOREIGN LANGUAGE HERE. UH, I'VE TALKED TO A NUMBER OF BUILDERS AND THEY'VE SAID, OH, WE DON'T DO THAT. WE JUST, WE JUST, WE, WE DON'T, WE DON'T BUILD TOWNHOMES, NOT OUR THING, NOT INTERESTED, NOT APPROVED BY US, WE'RE OUT. UM, AND THEN SOME OTHER FOLKS HAVE SAID THAT IT'S A MARKETING CHALLENGE BECAUSE THEY CAN'T GET TEXANS TO BUY TOWNHOMES TO WHICH I ANSWER. I NEVER MEET TEXANS ON THE STREET ANYMORE. EVERYBODY I TALK TO FROM SOMEWHERE ELSE. RIGHT. SO I THINK THERE'S A PROOF OF CONCEPT HERE. UM, W WE MAKE AS MUCH FLEXIBILITY AS POSSIBLE UP TILL NOW WITH THE IDEA OF BEING ABLE TO BUILD GARAGES, YOU CAN HAVE DETACHED GARAGES, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A COMPLETELY SEPARATE STRUCTURE. IT COULD BE 8,000 FEET LONG, AND THEN IT'S ALL CUT UP INTO SINGLE OR DOUBLE GARAGES, AND THAT THE HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION CAN OWN IT. AND YOU COULD LEASE IT, OR IT CAN BE IN YOUR CONDO DOCUMENTS THAT YOU OWN, NOT ONLY INSIDE THE TOWNHOME STRUCTURE, BUT THERE'S A RIDER THAT SAYS I GET GARAGE NUMBER 39, A AND B. SO YOU'VE GOT TWO SPACES THERE, JUST LIKE AN APARTMENT YOU CAN RESERVE COVERED SPACES AT APARTMENTS. SO THERE, THERE ARE WAYS DO IT. THE 480 SQUARE FOOT SEEM TO BE A BLANKET REQUIREMENT APPLIED TO ALL RESIDENTIAL IN KYLE BECAUSE OF THE PROBLEM. WELL, NOT PLUM PLUM. CREEK'S A DIFFERENT ANIMAL. THEY'VE GOT THEIR OWN CODE OUT THERE. UM, BUT FOR THE REST OF CHAPTER 53, KYLE WE'LL CALL IT. UM, THE QUITE HONESTLY, GARAGES WERE BEING USED AS STORAGE. PEOPLE WERE NOT STORING THEIR AUTOMOBILES OR PARKING THEIR AUTOMOBILES IN THEM. THEY HAD POOL NOODLES AND ALL THE KIDS' TOYS AND, YOU KNOW, EVERYTHING ELSE, YOUR, YOUR, YOUR WORKOUT EQUIPMENT, IT BECAME YOUR HOME GYM AND THEY WEREN'T PARKING IN IT. NOW, COUPLE THAT WITH THE IDEA OF SMALLER AND SMALLER FRONT YARD SETBACKS, RIGHT? THEY WANT BUILDERS WANT TO ADVERTISE LARGE BACKYARDS BECAUSE EVERYBODY WANTS TO HAVE A BACKYARD FOR THE KIDS AND THE BARBECUES AND STUFF. SO WHAT'S THAT MEAN THEY'RE SLIDING THE HOUSE FORWARD. THE PICKUP TRUCKS AREN'T GETTING ANY SHORTER. MY LITTLE TRUCK IS ABOUT 19 AND CHANGE. I THINK NOT INCLUSIVE OF THE HITCH THAT STICKS OUT IN THE BACK. UM, THE LAST TRUCK I HAD WAS, UH, 20 TO 22 FEET. IT WAS A LONG BED. SO THIS ONE'S SHORTER. UM, DRIVEWAYS ARE GETTING SHORTER AND SHORTER. AND, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, SO THE, THE IDEA WAS, WELL, A GARAGE HAS TO BE BIG ENOUGH TO BE ABLE TO STORE CARS AND ALL YOUR JUNK. SO THEY SAID 480 OR 480 FEET. UM, WE HAVE MADE SOME PROVISIONS FOR YOU CAN, YOU CAN MAKE A SMALLER IN THE STYLE GUIDE. YOU CAN MAKE A SMALLER GARAGE IF YOU PROVIDE FOR ONSITE STORAGE. SO YOU CAN EITHER HAVE A BUMPOUT INSIDE THE GARAGE, WHICH WOULD BE NOT FOR PARKING, OBVIOUSLY, BUT YOU COULD PUT SOME SHELVES IN THERE AND PUT STUFF THERE. SO THERE'S ROOM FOR THE CAR TO GET THEM OUT OF THE DRIVEWAY. YOU CAN HAVE A SEPARATE DETACHED STRUCTURE, UM, SOMEWHERE ON THE LOT, IF IT'S SINGLE FAMILY, OR YOU COULD BUILD A SEPARATE STRUCTURE THAT'S TO THE BENEFIT OF EVERYONE IN THE COMMUNITY. AND THEY COULD HAVE, YOU KNOW, MULTI-FAMILY UNITS IN CITIES, THE GROUND FLOOR IS USUALLY PARTITIONED WITH, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM, CHAIN-LINK CUBICLES. AND YOU GO DOWN THERE AND YOU PUT LITTLE THINGS IN STORES DOWN THERE, AND YOU CHAIN-LINK STUFF. AND THAT'S WHERE YOUR CHRISTMAS TREE IS. AND THAT'S WHERE YOUR EASTER DECORATIONS ARE. AND EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE YOU GO DOWN AND YOU SWAP THE STUFF OUT, YOU COULD DO THAT IN, IN SOMETHING LIKE THIS. AND WE WOULD BE ABLE TO MAKE A PROVISION FOR SMALLER THAN 480. THERE'S A NUMBER OF WAYS TO CUT THIS, BUT THE REQUIREMENT FOR THE GARAGE SHOULD PROBABLY BE TREATED THE SAME WAY THAT WE TREAT ANYTHING IN THE INTERNATIONAL PROPERTY MAINTENANCE CODE, WHICH IS IF YOU HAVE IT, THEN IT NEEDS TO MEET A CERTAIN STANDARD, BUT I'M NOT SURE NECESSARILY THAT WE WANT TO REQUIRE IT. THE PARKING SHOULD STAY. KYLE'S NOT THERE. THERE'S NO, WE'RE NOT RIPE FOR THIS MASS CITY DENSITY WHERE EVERYBODY WALKS AND YOU DON'T NEED A CAR. WE ARE 110% AUTO ORIENTED HERE. UM, YOU CAN'T W EVERYWHERE BECOMES A FOOD DESERT. IF YOU DON'T HAVE THE WAY TO GET UP THERE, YOU KNOW, TO THE HEB OR TO THE WALMART ACROSS THE INTERSTATE, OR WHEREVER YOU WANT TO GO AND BUY FOOD, WE ARE A HUNDRED PERCENT AUTO ORIENTED, AND WE NEED TO MAKE PROVISIONS FOR THAT IRRESPECTIVE OF THE UBER, YOU KNOW, PROGRAM THAT WE'VE GOT GOING. UM, SO WE'RE, WE'RE NOT BIG CITY GETTING RID OF PARKING, BUT WE, WE MAY BE ABLE TO ALLOW FOLKS THE, THE CHOICE TO HAVE A GARAGE OR NOT HAVE ONE PARKING YES. GARAGE, MAYBE, BUT IF GARAGE THEN PRESCRIBE WHAT THE GARAGE NEEDS TO LOOK LIKE THAT DO DEVELOPERS SAY IS THEIR STANDARD FOR A GARAGE. HOW BIG DO THEY WANT TO MAKE IT IN A TOWNHOUSE WHEN YOU SAY THEY CAN'T DO IT GENERALLY WOULD BE 22 BY 20, OKAY. 20 TO 22 FEET WIDE OR 20, 22 FEET DEEP AND 20 FEET WIDE. YEAH, THAT'S WHAT THOSE ARE INTERIOR DIMENSIONS. I GOT TO SAY THAT THE CASING FOR THE GARAGE DOOR [01:15:01] IS GOING TO COME IN. SO THE GARAGE DOOR MAY ONLY BE 16 FEET WITH ABOUT WHAT ABOUT TWO FEET ON THE SIDE WHERE IT WRAPS AROUND, AND THEN THE GARAGE DOOR, THE DOUBLE GARAGE DOORS COME DOWN. MINE'S 18 BY 19. I WOULD LIKE TO SAY THAT WE'LL JUST KIND OF LOOKING THERE SEEMS TO BE A DEMAND FOR THIS KIND OF THING. BUDA JUST BUILT A PLACE CALLED HARVEST MEADOWS, WHICH IS TOWNHOUSES. UM, SO THERE SEEMS TO BE A GROWING DEMAND FOR TOWNHOUSES. UM, THE PRICES ARE ABOUT HALF OF WHAT YOU WOULD PAY FOR WHAT MOST OF OUR STOCK OF HOUSING IS. SO IT WOULD BE A GOOD DIFFERENTIATION AND WHAT WE CAN TALK ABOUT BARKING. LIKE, I THINK THAT IS A GREAT THING TO THINK ABOUT. I THINK ALSO IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT THAT WE GO AHEAD AND GIVE THE ABILITY FOR BUILDERS TO BUILD HERE VERSUS BUILDING A BUDA OR BUILDING IN SAN MARCOS. UM, THAT IS JUST A PERSONAL OPINION THAT I HAVE ABOUT IT. AND IT MAY NOT BE THE RIGHT OPINION IN THE LONGTERM, BUT, UM, I THINK THAT IT IS A SMART DECISION FOR US TO BE ABLE TO ALLOW A VARYING SET OF THINGS. YEAH. I MEAN, THIS ONE, ONE LITTLE WORD RATHER THAN GARAGE IS BEING REQUIRED TO SAYING GARAGES ARE ALLOWED. YOU DON'T HAVE TO BUILD A GARAGE. I MEAN, MAYBE, MAYBE THEY JUST PARKED OUT ON THAT, THAT PARKING LOT OUT FRONT, LIKE, LIKE APARTMENT COMPLEXES DO, UM, OR, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN, YOU CAN BUILD SOME THAT SOME PERSONS CAN BUY OR LEASE VERSUS, YOU KNOW, NOT, NOT HAVING ENOUGH FOR THE ENTIRE UNIT PARKING. I WOULD NOT COMPROMISE ON THAT FOR ANY REASON, CREATING A SITUATION WHERE PEOPLE CAN'T PARK NEXT TO THEIR DOMICILE IS CREATING AN OPPORTUNITY FOR FIGHTS. BUT, UM, YEAH, THIS, THIS, IF WE'RE TRYING TO TALK ABOUT AFFORDABILITY AND I MEAN, THE PRICES FOR HOUSES, EVEN JUST SINCE I MOVED HERE HAVE JUST GONE NUTS. UM, SO AFFORDABILITY IS DEFINITELY SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO GET IN FRONT OF AND, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, UM, I CAN GO ON ALL NIGHT AND I'M NOT GOING TO CAUSE, WELL, I COMPLETELY SUPPORT THE CHANGE YOU WANT TO MAKE AS FAR AS MAKING THEM ALOUD, NOT REQUIRED. UM, ALL I ASK IS THAT WHEN STAFF IS REVIEWING A SUBDIVISION THAT HAS TOWNHOUSES AND I SUPPORT TOWNHOUSES TO THAT, YOU THINK ABOUT WHERE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO PARK THAT YOU, YOU, CAN YOU TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION MAKING YOUR DECISIONS AND HOW THEY ARE GOING TO ADDRESS THOSE NEEDS? THAT'S ALL I NEED, PAUL. OH, I WOULD SAY, UH, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE PERCENTAGE OF TRUCK OWNERS ARE, BUT IT'S NOT OVER 50%. AND SO THE REMAINING 50% ARE GOING TO HAVE AN UPWARD PRICING PRESSURE ON THEIR AFFORDABILITY OF A TOWNHOME. IF WE'RE, IF WE'RE TRYING TO MATCH EVERY POSSIBILITY FOR THE TYPE OF AUTOMOBILE THAT MIGHT BE PARKED THERE. I THINK THIS IS ONE OF THOSE AREAS WHERE YOU NEED TO GIVE THE MARKET THE FLEXIBILITY TO SORT THINGS OUT. NO, NOT ONLY THAT, BUT IT'S DESTROYED OUR ABILITY TO HAVE OUR ONE TEAM, RIGHT. COULD THIS CODE RIGHT HERE? YOU COULD BUILD ANY OF THIS STUFF THAT I'M FAMILIAR WITH. AS FAR AS THE TOWN, IT'S NOT A QUESTION OF, CAN THEY IT'S WILL THEY, THEY HAVE TO WORK A LITTLE BIT HARDER TO MAKE THIS WORK. YEAH, YOU'RE RIGHT, PERHAPS. RIGHT. OKAY. ANYTHING ELSE? YOU GOT ONE SUPER QUICK THING. IT'S KIND OF TANGENTIAL, SORRY, HOWARD, BUT I'M PROBABLY GOING TO KICK MYSELF, BRING IT UP, BUT I JUST, YOU KNOW, I NOTICED HOW WE HAVE ON HERE A STONE OR, YOU KNOW, A HUNDRED PERCENT BRICK, MASONRY HARDY PLANK PRODUCT. AND THIS IS THE PET PET THING FOR ME. UH, MY HOUSE PERSONALLY, WHOEVER PUT THE HARDY PLANK IN, DID A REALLY HORRIBLE JOB. AND I'VE NOTICED A LOT OF PARTICULAR ONES IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, THE HARDY PLINKING IS FAILING. AND SO THIS MAY BE MORE OF A CODE ENFORCEMENT OR A TECHNICAL CODE KIND OF THING. BUT IF WE'RE WORRIED ABOUT APPEARANCE WITH CERTAIN THINGS, AND WE HAVE THAT AS AN ALLOWANCE, DO WE HAVE ANY KIND OF INSPECTION PROCESS THAT MAKES SURE STUFF LIKE THAT IS PUT IN? UM, AND, UM, WELL I THINK WITH BRICK AND WITH STONE, YOU'RE JUST NATURALLY, IT'S GOING TO BE PUT IN CORRECTLY OR IT'S GOING TO FALL OVER WHILE THEY'RE DOING IT. BUT, BUT HARDY, UH, HARDY PRODUCTS, IF THEY'RE NOT INSTALLED CORRECTLY, TEND TO MANIFEST AFTER FIVE TO 10 YEARS. AND, AND THIS MIGHT BE ANOTHER SUBJECT MATTER FOR ANOTHER TIME, BUT, UH, I JUST WANTED TO PUT THAT OUT THERE AND SEE IF YOU, WHAT YOUR EXPERIENCE HAS BEEN. AND I JUST WORRY THAT, UH, PEOPLE WILL THEY'LL GRAVITATE TOWARD [01:20:01] THAT BECAUSE IT'LL PROBABLY BE THE LEAST EXPENSIVE OPTION ON THERE. AND IT MIGHT LOOK LIKE CRAP DOWN THE ROAD LIKE IT DOES IN MY BACKYARD IN A FEW SPOTS. THE CODE INSPECTION PROCESS FOR EXTERIOR SHEETING IS FOR THE WEATHER RESISTANT BARRIER TO MAKE SURE THAT THE, THE IMPORTANT PARTS UNDERNEATH ARE INSTALLED PROPERLY. UM, AND DON'T HAVE, UM, INAPPROPRIATE PENETRATIONS, THE, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM, THE DECORATIVE OUTSIDE, UM, MAY HAVE A TERTIARY INSPECTION AT THE TIME, A FINAL INSPECTION, BUT MORE OFTEN THAN NOT THE THING ABOUT HARDY AND I'M IN THE SAME BOAT WITH YOU, I'VE GOT A FORESIGHT HARDY HOUSE MYSELF. UM, IT'S NOT, MAINTENANCE-FREE, IT ACTUALLY REQUIRES THAT YOU GO IN THERE AND YOU HAVE TO END UP DOING A LOT OF, A LOT OF CAULKING AND, AND, UM, ESPECIALLY OVER THE NAIL HOLES AND THE JOINTS WHERE THE, IF YOU'VE GOT TWO, UM, JOINTS THAT BUTT UP AGAINST ONE ANOTHER, THAT AREN'T LAPPED, UM, THOSE NEED TO BE LOOKED AT. SO THE, THE REASON THE PROBLEM SHOW UP AFTER ABOUT FOUR OR FIVE YEARS IS BECAUSE THEY GO THROUGH ABOUT FOUR OR FIVE YEARS WITHOUT GETTING, UH, THE, THE APPROPRIATE MAINTENANCE TO KEEP THEM IN SHAPE. SO, UM, I DON'T KNOW NECESSARILY THAT WE DO ANYTHING AFTER THE FACT ONCE, ONCE THE HOME IS SEALED, WE DON'T GO BACK. UM, BUT, UH, AT THE, AT THE TIME THAT IT'S INSPECTED, WE LOOK TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE WEATHER RESISTANT, UM, AND NOT SO MUCH THAT LOOKING AT THE DECORATIVE, UH, VENEER THAT GOES ON THE OUTSIDE OF THE HOME. I MEAN, I'VE JUST DATED MYSELF AND LACK OF MAINTENANCE THERE TOO. I REALIZED THAT, OKAY, YOU'RE NOT THE ONLY ONE ON THE, I'M NOT MINE. SHAQ HAS FALLEN APART. I GOT, I GOT ISSUES AND I, I RECOGNIZE IT. I GOTTA DEAL WITH IT. THE ONLY THING THAT'S SAVING MY BUTT IS THAT MOST OF THE TIME IT'S PRETTY DRY IN TEXAS. I DON'T, I DON'T LIVE ON THE COAST OR I DON'T LIVE IN THE PACIFIC NORTHWEST OR IT'S RAINING ALL THE TIME, BUT I'M, I'M RIGHT THERE WITH YOU. MA'AM ALL RIGHT. OKAY. ANYTHING ELSE? CAN WE REQUIRE, UM, FULL DAY FAMILY TO USE THAT MATERIAL ALREADY AS WELL? I DIDN'T HEAR THAT. UH, DO WE REQUIRE MULTIFAMILY TO USE HARDY AS WELL, ALONG WITH THE OTHER MATERIALS? I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION. I'M TRYING TO THINK OF THE LAST APARTMENT COMPLEX THAT DIDN'T USE DURABLE MATERIAL. CAN ANYBODY THINK OF AN APARTMENT COMPLEX THAT DIDN'T USE HARDY OR BUILDING CODE HERE? YEAH, THE PROBLEM WITH IT NOW IS THE NEW HPE. WHAT NUMBER IS IT WHERE WE'RE NOT ALLOWED TO NOT ALLOWED NECESSARILY TO REGULATE ANYTHING THAT THAT'S NEW. IF IT WAS IN THE 2012 NEWER BUILDING CODE, THEN IT'S PERMISSIBLE TODAY. I'M NOT ASKING TO REGULATE IT. UM, I STILL HAVEN'T CONFIRMED THIS. I WAS TOLD TODAY HARDY'S GOING TO STOP SELLING TO MULTI FAMILY PROJECTS. UH, I DON'T KNOW THAT THEY JUST GET TO CONTINUE TO YEAH. UH, VERY PROPERLY PRODUCT LINE. THE ONE BY TWO WAS GOING AWAY TOO. SO, UH, I HAVEN'T CONFIRMED IT, BUT MAN, IT WAS A PRETTY BIG SURPRISE. IT'S MY FAVORITE STUFF. HE'S OUR INSIDE MAN. I LOVE HARDIE SIDING. STUFF'S GREAT. AND IT'S NOT JUST SIDING. YOU CAN GET BORED AND BAT. I MEAN, YOU CAN GET ALL SORTS OF DIFFERENT STYLES. THAT'S GOOD STUFF. THANKS FOR THE TIP, MATT. I'D BE SHOCKED. I WOULD BE WHEN I HEARD IT, LIKE I SAID, I STILL NEED TO CONFIRM IT, BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, IT MIGHT RESTRICT SOME OF OUR REQUIREMENT. I HEARD THAT. NOT, NOT JUST, NOT JUST HERE. I MEAN, OTHER THINGS TOO, NOT TO GET OFF TOPIC, WINDOWS, WINDOWS, WINDOWS ARE TOUGH RIGHT NOW. WE'VE HAD SOME RESIDENCES THAT ARE PUTTING IN COMMERCIAL WINDOWS SIMPLY BECAUSE THAT'S, WHAT'S AVAILABLE TO THEM. SO, WOW. THAT'S, THAT'S ALL THE CODE UPDATES. I GOT. UM, ANY QUESTIONS? ANY COMMENTS? NO, Y'ALL BEEN DOING IT THROUGHOUT THE DEAL, BUT ANY OTHER, ANYTHING ELSE? DAMN ANYTHING? UH, NO THANK YOU ALL FOR ALL THAT. THAT WAS, THAT WAS GOOD WORK. GOOD, GOOD RECOMMENDATION JOB. WELL, THANKS. THANK YOU. THANKS. [C.  Staff Report by Howard J. Koontz, Director of Planning and Community Development] OKAY. NUMBER FIVE, STAFF REPORT STAFF REPORT BY HOWARD J KOONS DIRECTOR OF PLANNING AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT. MR. COONS, JUST TWO REAL QUICK THINGS. THE FIRST THING IS THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP. I'M STILL TALKING WITH OUR COMMUNICATIONS DEPARTMENT. WE'VE GOT THE ROUGH OUTLINE THAT I'M PROBABLY GOING TO TRY AND FINALIZE BY THE END OF THIS WEEK, BUT EXPECT THAT THE PRODUCT OF THE [01:25:01] PUBLIC INPUT WILL COME TO YOU AT A WORK SESSION. THE SECOND, I'M SORRY, THE FOURTH TUESDAY IN SEPTEMBER, WHICH WOULD BE YOUR SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH. SO PUTTING YOU ON NOTICE RIGHT NOW THAT SEPTEMBER WE'LL HAVE A WORK SESSION AND THAT WORK SESSION WILL BE TO GO OVER ANY AND ALL COMMENTS THAT WE GET ABOUT THE FUTURE LAND USE MAP, REVISIONS THAT WE FINALIZED BACK IN WHAT MARCH? I DON'T KNOW. YEAH. LONG TIME AGO. UM, REAL ROUGH NUMBERS. AGAIN, NOTHING'S BEEN, BEEN, UH, DETERMINED YET, BUT THE WORK SESSION IN SEPTEMBER WOULD BE THE OPPORTUNITY TO, UM, EITHER INCORPORATE THE CHANGES OR NOT, OR MAYBE TALK ABOUT IT ONE LAST TIME. AND THEN, UM, TWO MEETINGS IN OCTOBER WOULD BE THE TWO PUBLIC HEARINGS AND WE'VE GOT ONE, UM, GO AROUND, I'LL CALL IT ONE WEEK OF FUDGE ROOM IN CASE WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT MORE, BUT THEN IT WOULD PROBABLY END UP GOING TO THE COUNCIL, UM, FOR THEIR PROCESS TO BEGIN. UH, THERE BE THE THIRD IN NOVEMBER. SO IT WOULD BE THE SECOND COUNCIL MEETING, I THINK. UM, AND THAT MEANS RATIFICATION BY THE END OF THE YEAR, BY, BY SOMETIME IN DECEMBER, THAT FUTURE LAND USE MAP WOULD BE DONE. SO THAT'S RIGHT NOW, LIKE I SAID, REAL ROUGH NUMBERS. THAT'S 30,000 FOOT VIEW. WE'VE GOT A MEETING ON THE 26TH. TODAY IS 24. SO THURSDAY, I'VE GOT A MEETING WITH COMMUNICATIONS TO GO OVER IT ONE LAST TIME, MORE THAN LIKELY IT'S GOING TO BE. WELL, MY HOPE WAS THAT WE WOULD HAVE BEEN ABLE TO USE PIE IN THE SKY AND HAVE LIKE A LITTLE OPPORTUNITY AS THAT PEOPLE WALK BY TO ISSUES WITH THAT WAS ONE IT'S BEEN CANCELED, BUT TWO, THEY EVEN THE IDEA OF PUTTING IT ON, THERE WAS SO MANY, UM, SO MANY FOLKS FROM OUTSIDE OF THE CITY WOULD GO THROUGH THERE. WE'RE NOT SURE WHAT, YOU KNOW, WHETHER OR NOT THE INPUT WOULD BE VALID. UM, SO WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO IS, IS HAVE WHAT'S, WHAT'S LIKELY AS A, WHAT WE TERM A WALKING CHARRETTE. SO IT WOULDN'T BE JUST BE A SINGLE EVENT THAT OPENS TALK AND THEN CLOSE WE'LL HAVE A DISPLAY DOWNSTAIRS, UH, PROBABLY IN THE HALLWAY OR MAYBE IN THE LOBBY, ONE OF THE OTHER, SOME MAPS ON EASELS, UM, SOME, SOME INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED AND WHAT THEY CAN LOOK AT, THEN THE OPPORTUNITY TO GIVE IMMEDIATE FEEDBACK THERE, OR A LINK WHERE THEY COULD GIVE FEEDBACK, MAYBE A QR CODE THAT THEY CAN GET WITH THEIR PHONE AND SEND SOME COMMENTS IN. AND WE'LL TRY AND COLLECT THAT IN A MASS THAT SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES. UH, ANYWAY, THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT THE PRELIMINARY BRAINSTORM SESSION WE HAD ABOUT TWO WEEKS AGO. IT WAS ABOUT, SO NOW WE'RE GOING TO TRY AND NAIL THAT STUFF DOWN. LIKE I SAID, THURSDAY, MAYBE WE COULD GET A SCHEDULE FOR THAT OUT ON FRIDAY OR EARLY PART OF NEXT WEEK. I'LL EMAIL YOU. SO IT'S NOT AN ACTION ITEM FOR YOU JUST TRYING TO KEEP YOU UP TO DATE ON WHERE IT IS. OKAY. UM, GOT FEEDBACK FROM TWO OF THE COMMISSIONERS ON HOW THE MEETING SHOULD WORK GOING FORWARD. UM, BOTH OF THEM SAID, UH, AT LEAST HYBRID, BUT AT LEAST BEING HERE IN PERSON IS PREFERABLE TO GOING, UM, UM, VIRTUAL. SO, UM, THAT CORRESPONDS WITH THE GOVERNOR'S ORDERS EXPIRING AS, UH, I WANT TO SAY SEPTEMBER 1ST OR AUGUST 31ST. SO THE, THE PROVISION THAT ALLOWED US TO HAVE THAT, UM, IS EXPIRING IN TEXAS. SO WE HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE WAY THAT THE STATE PRESCRIBES THE WHAT'S IMPORTANT TO KNOW THERE IS THAT, UM, REMOTE PARTICIPATION IS STILL AVAILABLE, UM, ON AN AS-NEEDED BASIS. BUT THE CHIEF CONDITION IS THAT A QUORUM OF THE BODY NEEDS TO BE AVAILABLE IN PERSON AT AN ADVERTISED VENUE. SO TONIGHT'S MEETING WOULD HAVE BEEN ALLOWABLE IN SEPTEMBER. CAUSE I HAVE A CORUM AT THE SITE WHERE FOLKS CAN COME IN AND THEN ANYBODY THAT WANTS TO PARTICIPATE VIRTUALLY AFTER THAT CAN. BUT, UM, WHEN, WHEN DEBBIE SENDS OUT THE MEETING INVITATION, WE'RE GOING TO NEED TO KNOW WHETHER OR NOT YOU'RE PRESENT, UH, FOR A QUORUM. AND IF WE CAN'T HAVE A QUORUM PRESENT, EVEN IF YOU'RE AVAILABLE SOMEWHERE ELSE, WE CAN'T CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER AS OF THAT, YOUR, YOUR NEXT MEETING, THE SEPTEMBER, I THINK IT'S THE 14TH, SEPTEMBER STARTS REALLY LATE, I GUESS IT STARTS ON A WEDNESDAY. SO THAT MEANS ALL OF OUR DATES ARE REALLY LATE. SO I THINK IT'S THE 14TH AND THE 28TH OF THE TWO DATES THAT YOU'LL HAVE MEETINGS IN SEPTEMBER. SO, UH, RIGHT HERE, SIX 30, UM, FOR NOW I THINK THAT'S ALL I GOT. UM, PROBABLY HAVE AN EMAIL UPDATE FOR YOU TOMORROW, SOMETIME IN THE MORNING. OKAY. THAT'S IT. THAT'S ALL I GOT. OKAY. ITEM NUMBER SIX. ADJOURNMENT. MADAM CHAIR. YES, I MOVE. WE ADJOURN. I SECOND I'M MOTION IS SECOND AND DISCUSSION ALL IN FAVOR. SAY AYE. AYE. OPPOSED. NOW WE'RE OUT FOR GOOD 99. OKAY. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.