* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. GOOD EVENING. THE [00:00:01] TIME IS 6:30 PM TODAY IS TUESDAY, JUNE 13TH. UM, I'D LIKE TO CALL THIS REGULARLY SCHEDULED PLANNING AND ZONING MEETING TO ORDER. UH, MAY I HAVE A ROLL CALL PLEASE TO LORI MARTHA ANKIN. HERE. GARA? HERE. STEGEL? HERE. JAMES. HERE. CHASE HERE. THANK YOU. UH, FIVE MEMBERS PRESENT. WE HAVE A QUORUM. ITEM [3.  Minutes] NUMBER THREE MINUTES. THREE. A PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION MEETING. MINUTES FOR MAY 9TH, 2023. MAY 23RD, 2023, REGULAR MEETING. AND MAY 23RD, 2023. SPECIAL CALLED MEETING MR. CHAIR. YES, SIR. MOTION TO APPROVE ITEMS THREE. A SECOND. THANK YOU. IT'S BEEN MOVED BY, UH, VICE CHAIR CHA. SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER JAMES. IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT MOTION? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. ALL OPPOSED. MOTION PASSES. ITEM NUMBER FOUR, CITIZEN COMMENTS. AT THIS TIME, IF ANY MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK, WE INVITE YOU UP. NOW, WE ASK THAT YOU STATE YOUR NAME FOR THE RECORD, THAT YOU FILL OUT A CITIZEN COMMENTS FORM, UM, AND THAT YOU LIMIT YOUR TIME TO THREE MINUTES. IF ANYONE WOULD LIKE TO COME UP, YOU MAY COME UP NOW. SEEING NONE, I'M GONNA GO AHEAD AND CLOSE. CITIZEN COMMENTS ITEM [A.   Consider and make a recommendation to City Council regarding a request by Darren Webber, P.E. on behalf of Hector Rodriguez to rezone approximately 0.52 acres from Agriculture 'A' to Retail Service District 'RS' for property located at 1121 E FM 150, in Hays County, Texas. (Hector Rodriguez - Zoning - Z-23-0114)   Public Hearing Recommendation to City Council  ] NUMBER FIVE. ZONING. UH, CONSIDER AND MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO CITY COUNCIL REGARDING A REQUEST BY DARREN WEBER, PE ON BEHALF OF HECTOR RODRIGUEZ TO REZONE APPROXIMATELY 0.52 ACRES FROM AGRICULTURE, A TO RETAIL SERVICE DISTRICT, RS FOR PROPERTY, LOCATED AT 1121 EAST FM ONE 50 IN HAYES COUNTY, TEXAS. HECTOR RODRIGUEZ, ZONING Z DASH 23 DASH 114. UH, THERE IS A PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS ITEM. IF ANYONE LIKE TO SPEAK AT THE PUBLIC HEARING, YOU MAY COME UP NOW. SEEING NONE, I'M GONNA CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. UM, MS. SHARP. ALL RIGHT. KAYLA SHARP. CITY PLANNER FOR THE RECORD. LET ME JUST SHARE MY SCREEN REALLY QUICK. ALL RIGHT, THERE WE GO. SO TODAY WE HAVE A ZONING REQUEST FOR, UM, THIS IS JUST STRAIGHT ZONING AND IT'S LOCATED AT 1121 EAST FM ONE 50. UM, SO THIS IS CURRENTLY AN, UM, UNDEVELOPED LOT. THERE IS AN EXISTING HOME ON THE SITE, UM, SO NOT TOTALLY UNDEVELOPED, I GUESS TECHNICALLY , UM, AND IT, BUT IT'S VACANT. UM, ADJACENT PROPERTIES ARE ZONED AGRICULTURE, COMMUNITY, COMMERCIAL AND M THREE MANUFACTURED HOME PARK, AND THEN ACROSS FM ONE 50. THAT IS NOT IN CITY LIMITS. UM, THEY HAVE REQUESTED THE RETAIL SERVICES ZONING DISTRICT. UM, AND FOR THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE SITE IS LOCATED IN THE LOCAL NODE. THE RS ZONING IS RECOMMENDED CONDITIONALLY WITHIN THAT, UM, LAND USE DISTRICT. AND FOR UTILITIES, THEY HAVE, UH, COUNTY LINE WATER. UM, IT'LL BE ON A SEPTIC SYSTEM. AND THEN P C HAS, UM, ELECTRICITY AND THEN THEY WILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE SITE DEVELOPMENT AND BUILDING PERMIT PROCESS, UM, THE EXISTING CONDITIONS AND INTENDED USE LINE WITH THE RS ZONING DISTRICT. IT ALSO ALIGNS WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. THE SITE HAS THE APPROPRIATE UTILITIES AND STAFF RECOMMENDS APPROVAL. ANY QUESTIONS? THANK YOU. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? OKAY. IF THERE ARE NO QUESTIONS, WOULD ANYONE LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION? WOULD THE MOTION YES, SIR. I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE ZONING ITEM FIVE A. THANK YOU. IT'S BEEN MOVED. IS THERE A SECOND? I WILL GO AHEAD AND SECOND THAT MOTION. IT'S BEEN MOVED BY COMMISSIONER JAMES SECOND, SECONDED BY MYSELF. UM, IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT MOTION? YES, SIR. WHY ARE WE GOING FROM RS TO, TO CC ARE, WHY AREN'T WE GOING TO CC JUST LIKE THE NEIGHBOR? WHAT, WHY DOES IT MAKE MORE SENSE TO HAVE? SO THIS IS A STRAIGHT ZONING CASE, SO WE CAN'T TECHNICALLY TALK INTENDED USE, BUT, UM, BASED ON STAFF CONVERSATIONS WITH THE APPLICANT, THE INTENDED USE ALIGNS WITH, UM, RS. OKAY. MY CONCERN IS JUST THE HOMES RIGHT BEHIND IT. I THINK WE'VE HAD THIS CONVERSATION BEFORE ABOUT, YOU KNOW, DRIVE-THROUGHS AND LIGHTS GOING THROUGH AND, UH, PEOPLE'S BACKYARDS AND INTO THEIR HOMES. UM, SO I DO HAVE CONCERNS REGARDING THAT. I UNDERSTAND. UM, JUST TO CLARIFY, SO CC IS JUST [00:05:01] R IT'S JUST RECOMMENDED IN THAT ZONING AND RS IS RECOMMENDED CONDITIONALLY, CORRECT? CORRECT. OKAY. SO, YEAH, UM, I'M PER, I'M PERSONALLY FINE WITH THIS REQUEST, BUT I, I UNDERSTAND IF SOMEONE WANTS TO MAKE AN AMENDMENT TO THE MOTION OR IF, OR IF SOMEONE IS AGAINST THIS MOTION, THAT'S PERFECTLY FINE. BUT PERSONALLY I DO, I DO SUPPORT THIS REQUEST. IS THERE ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? OKAY, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. ALL OPPOSED? NO. OKAY. MOTION PASSES. [A.   Consider a request for an extension to an approved conditional use permit constructing approximately 1,791 square foot, free standing Waffle House Restaurant located at 5767 Kyle Parkway, approximately 250-feet northeast of the intersection of Kyle Parkway and Lowe's access road. (Waffle House - Conditional Use Permit Extension Request - CUP-22-0055) ] NEXT ITEM NUMBER SIX, CONSIDER IMPOSSIBLE ACTION SIX A. CONSIDER A REQUEST FOR AN EXTENSION TO AN APPROVED CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT CONSTRUCTING APPROXIMATELY 1,791 SQUARE FOOT FREE-STANDING WAFFLE HOUSE RESTAURANT LOCATED AT 57 67 KYLE PARKWAY. APPROXIMATELY 250 FEET NORTHEAST OF THE INTERSECTION OF KYLE PARKWAY AND LOWE'S ACCESS ROAD, WAFFLE HOUSE DASH CONDITIONAL USE EXTENSION REQUEST, UH, C U P DASH 22 DASH 0 55. UH, MS. SHARP. ALL RIGHT, KAYLA SHARP, CITY PLANNER FOR THE RECORD. UM, SO TODAY WE HAVE AN EXTENSION REQUEST FOR A PREVIOUSLY APPROVED C U P. UM, THE C U P WAS APPROVED JUNE 14TH, SO JUST SHY OF ONE YEAR AGO. UM, CUS ARE VALID FOR ONE YEAR AND THEY EXPIRE IF NO, UM, PROGRESS HAS BEEN MADE ON THE SITE. SO SPECIFICALLY, YOU KNOW, MOVING DIRT. UM, AND TO DATE, NO PROGRESS HAS BEEN MADE ON THE SITE. SO THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING AN EXTENSION, UM, FOR THE C U P. UM, AND PER OUR CODE SECTION 53 DASH 8 93 EXTENSION REQUESTS HAVE TO BE CONSIDERED BY THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION. UM, BUILDING PERMITS HAVE BEEN SUBMITTED AND SO CONSTRUCTION IS EXPECTED TO BEGIN SOON. AND THEN, UH, NO CHANGES ARE BEING MADE TO THE APPROVED C U P. UM, AND SO WE FEEL THAT THIS IS ACCEPTABLE FOR AN EXTENSION AND WE RECOMMEND APPROVAL. AND JUST AS A REMINDER, WE HAVE THE RENDERINGS OF WHAT WAS APPROVED A YEAR AGO. SO THERE'S ELEVATIONS LANDSCAPE SHEET, SORRY, THAT'S REALLY HARD TO SEE. . AND THEN SITE PLAN, IF I CAN ZOOM, ZOOM IN JUST A LITTLE BIT. SO YEAH, WE RECOMMEND APPROVAL. THANK YOU. I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT EXTENSIONS. YES. UM, SO IF WE APPROVE THIS EXTENSION, IS IT AUTOMATICALLY JUST ANOTHER YEAR OR DO WE SAY HOW LONG IT IS FOR? UM, I BELIEVE IT'S JUST FOR ANOTHER YEAR. OKAY. I HAVE A, A QUESTION. GO AHEAD. SO I WASN'T ON THE COMMISSION LAST YEAR WHEN THIS FIRST CAME UP, SO FORGIVE ME IF THESE ARE THINGS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN COVERED IN THE PAST. UM, I NOTICED THE, THE PLACEMENT OF THE DUMPSTER ENCLOSURE LOOKS LIKE IT BUTTS RIGHT UP AGAINST A ROADWAY. UM, IS THIS A, LIKE A PUBLIC ROADWAY THAT IT'S GONNA BE ON? BECAUSE, UH, I'M CONCERNED ABOUT SIDEWALKS. SO IT'S PRIVATE. IF, LET ME SEE IF I CAN GO BACK TO MY GOODNESS. , I'M GONNA STOP SHARING FOR ONE SECOND SO I DON'T MAKE US ALL DIZZY. UM, LET'S GO BACK TO THE LOCATION. OKAY. OKAY. SO THIS STREET, THE DUMPSTER ENCLOSURE, I DON'T KNOW IF Y'ALL CAN SEE MY CURSOR VERY WELL. SO THE DUMPSTER ENCLOSURE IS SOMEWHERE ALONG HERE THAT'S ACTUALLY A PRIVATE ROAD. AND JUST FOR CONTEXT, THIS LOT BACK HERE IS WHERE, UM, THE HOBBY LOBBY AND ACADEMY ARE GOING IN MM-HMM. . UM, AND SO, UM, THE SITE PLAN HAS ALREADY BEEN APPROVED, UM, AS OF SOMETIME LAST YEAR, PROBABLY AROUND THE SAME TIME THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT WAS APPROVED. AND IT HAS TO GO THROUGH ENGINEERING, PUBLIC WORKS PLANNING, UM, ALL OF THOSE DEPARTMENTS SO THEY'RE AWARE OF WHERE THE DUMPSTER LOCATION IS AND IT, IT PASSED ALL OF THEIR, UM, THEIR CHECKLIST OF ITEMS. SO FOR MY OWN EDIFICATION, WHAT IS A PRIVATE ROAD? IT IS NOT PUBLICLY MAIN, IT'S NOT MAINTAINED BY THE CITY, ESSENTIALLY, IT'S PRIVATELY MAINTAINED AND OWNED. OKAY. UH, AND THEN MY [00:10:01] SECOND QUESTION FOR YOU, UM, MS. SHARP, THE LONG WALL, UH, IF WE'RE LOOKING AT THE ELEVATIONS, THE LONG BLOCK WALL, I SEE THAT THAT'S A, I THINK IT'S 75 FEET LONG. I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THAT'S COMPLIANT WITH OUR CODE BECAUSE I NOTICED THERE'S NOT ANY LIGHTING ON THAT WALL AND I DON'T SEE ANY LANDSCAPE PLAN WHERE THERE'S SOMETHING TO SCREEN THAT, THAT LONG KIND OF UNINTERRUPTED WALL. UM, WITHOUT GOING BACK AND LOOKING AT THE PHOTOMETRIC SHEET, I WOULD SAY IT'S SAFE TO ASSUME THAT THERE ARE PROBABLY SOME WALL PACK LIGHTS ON THAT WALL. UM, AND THEN THE CODE SAYS THAT IF IT'S, UM, FACING RESIDENTIAL THAT THERE, IT, THERE HAS TO BE SCREENING OR IT HAS TO BASICALLY MIRROR THE FRONT FACE OF THE BUILDING ON THE BACK THAT'S, UM, FACING RESIDENTIAL. SO I KNOW AT THE TIME THIS WAS FOUND TO BE COMPLIANT AND THAT'S WHY IT WAS APPROVED. OKAY. AND BECAUSE IT'S NOW ACROSS FROM HOBBY LOBBY AND THE ACADEMY SPACE, Y'ALL ARE STILL COMFORTABLE WITH, WITH EVERYTHING. YES. OKAY. I DON'T HAVE A QUESTION. THANK YOU. ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? YES, SIR. SO YOU SAID CONSTRUCTION BEGINS SOON. TYPICALLY IN CONSTRUCTION THE HOLDUP IS GETTING PERMITS, WHICH IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE THAT'S THE ISSUE HERE, THAT THEY HAVE THEIR PERMITS, CORRECT? YEAH, SO THEY HAVE ALL OF THEIR PERMITS EXCEPT THE BUILDING PERMIT, BUT THAT WAS SUBMITTED. UM, AND WE HAVE ANYWHERE BETWEEN A TWO TO FOUR WEEK TURNAROUND ON REVIEWS FOR THAT. YEAH. SO AS SOON AS THEY HAVE THAT, THEY'RE READY TO, THEY'RE READY TO GO. SO HAVE THEY GIVEN A BREAK GROUND DATE? THEY HAVE NOT, BUT UM, IF THIS IS TO BE EXTENDED, THEY HAVE A YEAR TO ESSENTIALLY BREAK GROUND. YEAH, AND THAT'S MY ISSUE. UM, I'M NOT GONNA PUT WORDS IN THEIR MOUTH, BUT THE, THE CURRENT ECONOMIC STATE IS IT'S TYPICALLY A FINANCING ISSUE. UH, A LOT OF THESE PROJECTS AREN'T MOVING FORWARD, RETAIL APARTMENT COMPLEXES, ET CETERA. UM, SO I'D HATE TO SEE THIS COME BACK IN A YEAR AND THEY'RE ONCE AGAIN ASKING FOR ANOTHER EXTENSION. UM, SO I, I PERSONALLY WOULD LIKE TO, TO HEAR A, UH, CONSTRUCTION START DATE BEFORE WE APPROVE. THAT'S MY OPINION ON THAT. THANK YOU. ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? WOULD ANYONE LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION? YES, SIR. MAKE A MOTION THAT THIS ITEM BE SENT BACK TO WAFFLE HOUSE, ASKING HIM TO, TO GET US CONSTRUCTION DATE BEFORE WE EXTEND. OKAY. THANK YOU. THERE IS A MOTION ON THE FLOOR. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND. IT HAS BEEN MOTIONED AND SECONDED. UH, IT'S A MOTION BY VICE CHAIR CHASE, SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER ANKIN. OKAY. I HAVE A QUESTION THEN. UM, IF WE DON'T APPROVE THIS EXTENSION BEFORE THE CLOCK RUNS OUT, WHICH IS SOON, TOMORROW, , UM, DOES, WE CAN'T EXTEND AN EXTENSION CORRECT. THEY WOULD'VE TO JUST START OVER? IS THAT HOW THIS WOULD WORK? UM, SO THEY WOULDN'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO START OVER, BUT IT WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK FOR APPROVAL SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO RESUBMIT, BUT THEY WOULD HAVE TO, IT, IT'S GONNA BASICALLY BE THE SAME CONVERSATION WE'RE HAVING TONIGHT. IT'S ESSENTIALLY AN EXTENSION, BUT IT'S OKAY. NOT CALLED AN EXTENSION . OKAY. UH, SO PERSONALLY, I, I MEAN, I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, I THINK THAT'S A BIT HEAVY HANDED. UM, I, I, I WOULD LIKE TO APPROVE THIS EXTENSION, BUT, UH, BUT THAT IS MY PERSONAL THOUGHT. IF ANYONE ELSE HAS ANY DISCUSSION BEFORE WE VOTE ON THIS MOTION, PLEASE? YES, SIR. I HAVE A, HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF. UM, IS THIS A EXTENSION YOU RECEIVED LIKE FAIRLY RECENTLY? BECAUSE THIS BEING THE LAST DAY IS A FAIRLY LIKE, YOU KNOW, KIND OF PUTS US IN THIS CORNER TO, TO LIKE APPROVE IT OR GO THROUGH THE PROCESS AGAIN. SO IS THIS SOMETHING THAT THEY RECENTLY SUBMITTED TO YOU ALL? UM, YES. SO WE, WE WERE MADE AWARE WITHIN THE LAST COUPLE WEEKS, UM, THAT THEY HAD SUBMITTED FOR THE BUILDING PERMIT AND WE WERE CHECKING WHEN THE C U P UM, WAS GOING TO EXPIRE BECAUSE WE REMEMBERED HAVING THIS COME BEFORE P AND Z A LONG TIME AGO . AND SO WE WERE CHECKING THE DATE ON THAT AND UM, AT THAT TIME WE NOTIFIED THEM THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO REQUEST AN EXTENSION AND THIS WAS THE EARLIEST POSSIBLE MEETING TO GET IT ON THE AGENDA BEFORE IT EXPIRED. CAN I ASK A FOLLOW UP QUESTION YOU SAW BEFORE? YEAH. OKAY. UM, SO THIS CAME AFTER THEY SUBMITTED THEIR BUILDING PERMIT A COUPLE WEEKS AGO, [00:15:01] THE EXTENSION REQUEST? YES. OKAY. BUT THEIR, WHEN WAS THEIR BUILDING PERMIT SUBMITTED? UM, I COULD CHECK . COOL. IF YOU'LL JUST GIMME A MOMENT. YOU'RE OKAY. YEAH, IT LOOKS LIKE THE APPLICATION DATE WAS APRIL 26TH. OKAY. SINCE, SO MY, UM, THANK YOU. UH, SO MY COMMENT TO THIS IS I'LL BE VOTING AGAINST THIS MOTION. UM, IF THEY HAVE COME BACK AND SAID, PRETTY MUCH COMMITTED TO THIS IN APRIL AND THEY KIND OF RAN UP AGAINST A WALL LIKE THEY'VE HAD ALL THIS TIME TO MAKE A DECISION, THEY DECIDED TO GO CONTINUE THAT. I DON'T, I THINK WE'RE BEING A LITTLE HEAVY HANDED IN ORDER IN LIKE GIVING IT RIGHT BACK TO THEM WHEN THEY ARE JUST STARTING TO GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS. I DON'T THINK THAT WE SHOULD BE DENYING IT ON THAT BASIS. IF THEY HAVE SUBMITTED A BUILDING PERMIT LIKE IN JANUARY OR YOU KNOW, NOVEMBER OF LAST YEAR AND THEY'VE WAITED THIS LONG TO COMMENCE THEN, THEN I ALSO SEE YOUR CONCERNS COMMISSIONER CHASE ABOUT FINANCING AND, YOU KNOW, BREAKING GROUND. BUT I DON'T SEE THAT IN THIS CASE BECAUSE THEY'VE BEEN MOVING FORWARD ON IT VERY RECENTLY. THANK YOU. OR THERE ANY OTHER COMMENTS OR DISCUSSION WE'D LIKE TO MAKE BEFORE WE VOTE? I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE JUST A SECOND TO, TO CHECK SOMETHING IN MY COMPUTER. I DON'T HAVE A COMMENT, I JUST WANNA TIME. THAT'S FINE. UH, SO JUST FOR CLARIFICATION PURPOSES, THE MOTION IS TO SEND THIS BACK TO THE APPLICANT TO REQUEST A DATE FOR, I'M SORRY, BREAKING GROUND. A GROUND BREAKING DATE, UM, TO COME BACK TO US. SO THAT'S THE MOTION. SO A YES WOULD BE TO NOT APPROVE THIS TODAY, BUT SEND IT BACK TO THEM. A NO WOULD BE TO DENY THIS MOTION THAT A DIFFERENT MOTION COULD BE MADE. OKAY. DID YOU HAVE ANYTHING ELSE? UM, SO I'M LOOKING NOW AT THE, WHAT DO THEY FORMALLY CALL IT? THE REQUEST LETTER FOR EXTENSION THAT WAS SUBMITTED BY, UH, SYLVIE GERMAN AND IT SAYS, UH, LET'S SEE, THIS WAS DATED MAY 31ST. IT SAYS THAT THEY NEED TO GO THROUGH THE PERMITTING PROCESS FOR THE SIGNED PERMIT AND OTHER KIND OF THINGS WITH PROPOSED CONSTRUCTION TO START IN 2024. TO ME, THAT'S NOT SOON. SO IF THEY'RE ALREADY PLANNING TO DELAY AT ANOTHER SIX MONTHS, POTENTIALLY PLUS 12, IT COULD GO ANYWHERE IN 2024. THEY DIDN'T SAY WHEN IN 2024. I'M JUST CURIOUS, DO WE WANT THIS SITTING THERE FOR POTENTIALLY 18 MORE MONTHS OR DO WE WANT TO OPEN IT UP? OKAY, THANK YOU. YES, AS A RESPONSE. IT CAN'T SEND THEIR 18 MONTHS. THEY GOT 12 MONTHS TO BREAK GROUND OR THEY'LL HAVE TO COME BACK HERE AND IF IT'S TAKEN THIS HARD TO COME BACK HERE, I CAN'T IMAGINE NEXT YEAR WE'RE GONNA BE IN THE MOOD TO APPROVE IT. SO, WELL, I DON'T WANT TO PROCEED THAT. I WOULD ALSO SAY THAT LIKE, THAT DOESN'T PRECLUDE THEM BUILDING IN JANUARY OF 2020 FLOOR, JUST AS IT DOESN'T PRECLUDE THE ABILITY FOR THEM TO DO IT IN DECEMBER MM-HMM. . BUT WE'RE JUST GIVING THEM THE ABILITY TO DO IT SOMEWHERE BETWEEN JANUARY AND JULY AND I JUST DON'T SEE THE FULL PROBLEM WITH THAT RIGHT NOW. THANK YOU. IS THERE ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? YES, WEST YOUR CHASE? SO I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR ON WHAT, WHAT YOU SAID. SO THERE WE CAN'T HAVE IT BOTH WAYS. YOU SAID IT'S AN EXTENSION BUT NOT AN EXTENSION. SO IF IT COMES BACK, ARE THEY STARTING OVER FROM, FROM SQUARE ONE OR ARE THEY ASKING FOR AN EXTENSION? SO FROM OUR PROCESSING SIDE, THEY'RE TECHNICALLY NOT STARTING OVER, BUT ON Y'ALL'S END IT TECHNICALLY WOULD BE A NEW, UM, SUBMITTAL. SO IF WE, IF I AMEND MY MOTION TO ADD 30 DAYS ONTO THAT EXTENSION TO DO A 30 DAY EXTENSION SO THAT THEY CAN BRING IT BACK, IS THAT SOMETHING WE'RE ABLE TO DO 30 DAYS FROM TODAY, CORRECT? I BELIEVE SO, YES SIR. SORRY. UH, YES. THE CODE DOES NOT SPECIFY HOW LONG THOSE EXTENSIONS ARE. SO I THINK BELIEVE P AND Z DOES HAVE THE FLEXIBILITY TO MAKE THAT, WHETHER IT'S 30 DAYS OR, OR SIX MONTHS OR A YEAR. UM, WE WOULDN'T GO OBVIOUSLY FURTHER THAN A YEAR CUZ THE CODE LIMITS IT AT THAT. UM, IF THEY DO LOSE THEIR CODE, [00:20:01] UH, OR LOSE THE C P, THEY WOULD BE COMING BACK, THEY WOULD RESUBMIT, IT WOULD BE THE SAME DOCUMENTS, BUT THEY WOULD HAVE TO PAY ANOTHER FEE FOR THE C P. UH, UNLESS STAFF WAIVED THAT, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE HAVE THAT ABILITY TO DO THAT. UM, SOME OF YOUR OTHER OPTIONS ARE TO GIVE THEM AN EXTENSION BUT GIVE THEM ONLY A SIX MONTH EXTENSION, THREE MONTH EXTENSION IF YOU WANTED TO KIND OF FAST PACE THEIR, THEIR PERMIT. UM, ALSO KEEP IN MIND FROM A BUILDING PERMIT STANDPOINT, THEY ARE, UM, THEY HAVE BEEN REJECTED. UM, THEY ARE REQUIRING RESUBMITS, UH, FOR VARIOUS REASONS. UH, SO ONCE THAT PERMIT IS ISSUED, THE BUILDING PERMIT ITSELF IS ONLY VALID FOR SIX MONTHS IF THEY DON'T START CONSTRUCTION. SO AT SOME POINT, IF THEY, IF THEY DELAY AND THEIR C P GOES, I MEAN REALLY WE'RE TALKING A SIX MONTH, THEY'LL HAVE TO COME BACK AND GO THROUGH THE PLAN REVIEW PROCESS AGAIN. MM-HMM. , UM, THAT'S NOT ALWAYS A CHEAP ENDEAVOR FOR, FOR SUBMITTING THOSE BUILDING PERMITS. SO BASED ON THAT SIZE, I WOULD SAY THEIR PLAN REVIEW FEES ARE GONNA HOVER AROUND $3,500, UH, FOR THE INITIAL REVIEW MM-HMM. AND THEN WHATEVER RE REVIEWS THEY DO. SO, UM, THEY ARE, THEY ARE SUBMITTING A, A, A, A FINANCIAL, UH, STAKE IN IT. UH, I WOULDN'T SAY IT'S A SIGNIFICANT STAKE FOR FOR SOMEONE LIKE THIS FOR WHAT THEY'RE DOING, BUT, UH, JUST SO YOU KIND OF KNOW THE, THE WHOLE PROCESS, THERE'S A C U P TIMELINE AND THE BUILDING PERMIT TIMELINES, SO THANK YOU. HAVE THERE BEEN ANOTHER MOTION ON THE FLOOR TO APPROVE THE EXTENSION? WE WOULD'VE HAD TO ADD A TIMELINE TO THAT THEN, CORRECT? IT WASN'T AN AUTOMATIC 12 MONTH. UM, I, I, I THINK IF THERE WAS NO SPECIFICATION OF THE TIMELINE, IT WOULD'VE BEEN AN AUTOMATIC 12 MONTHS. THAT'S THE WAY A STAFF WOULD, OR THAT'S THE WAY I WOULD'VE LOOKED AT IT. UM, OKAY. SO I'M WILLING TO RETRACT MY INITIAL OKAY. IT'S BEING RETRACTED. UH, DOES THE SECOND AGREE YOU WERE THE SECOND CORRECT? I WAS, YES. OKAY. SO, UH, YES, WE ARE RETRACTING THE ORIGINAL MOTION AND I'LL MAKE A NEW MOTION TO APPROVE A SIX MONTH EXTENSION IN LINE WITH THE BUILDING PERMIT PROCESS THAT GIVES THEM THE TIME THAT THEY NEED TO GET CONSTRUCTION STARTED. OKAY. THERE'S A MOTION ON THE FLOOR TO APPROVE A SIX MONTH EXTENSION. IS THERE, I WOULD LIKE TO JUST BEFORE WE FINALIZE THAT, JUST CLARIFY, THEIR PERMIT HASN'T BEEN ISSUED YET MM-HMM. , SO THERE MAY BE A LITTLE BIT OFFSET ON THAT. YEAH, I GET THAT. OKAY. THERE'S A MOTION ON THE FLOOR, IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND. THANK YOU. IT'S BEEN MOTIONED BY, UH, VICE CHAIR CHASE COM SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER JAMES. IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THIS NEW MOTION? OKAY, NOW DISCUSSION , PLEASE. YES, YES. NOW YOU CAN DISCUSS IT. THIS, THIS, THIS WILL GIVE THEM THE TIME IN MY MIND THEN TO AT LEAST START THE PROCESS AND THEN THEY DON'T NEED TO COME BACK TO US. IF THEY COME BACK IN SIX MONTHS, THEY'RE BURDEN DAYLIGHT ON THAT BUILDING PERMIT AND THAT THAT COMMISSION CAN MAKE THAT CALL AT THAT TIME. YES. I WILL ALSO SAY THAT I THINK SIX MONTHS IS A GOOD COMPROMISE ON THIS. LIKE I'M, I'M, AS MUCH AS I AM ALL FOR THE, THE FULL YEAR PERMIT. I THINK IT, IF IT'S IN LINE WITH THE BUILDING, UM, PERMIT, THEN IT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE FOR US TO JUST GO AHEAD AND DO THAT AND KEEP THOSE THINGS IN LINE. YES, I AGREE WITH COMMISSIONER JAMES. ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? OKAY, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. ALL OPPOSED. MOTION PASSES. ITEM NUMBER, UH, [B.   Consider a request to construct an approximately 1,448 square feet restaurant building located at 2242 Kohler's Crossing, approximately 700 feet west of IH-35 S Frontage and along Kohler's Crossing. (Abbott's Frozen Custard's - Conditional Use Permit (CUP-23-0077)   ] SIX B, CONSIDER REQUEST TO CONSTRUCT AN APPROXIMATELY 1,448 SQUARE FEET RESTAURANT BUILDING LOCATED AT 2242 KOHLER'S CROSSING APPROXIMATELY 700 FEET WEST OF IH 35 SOUTH FRONTAGE A ALONG KOHLER'S CROSSING ABBOTT'S FROZEN CUSTARD CONDITIONAL USED PERMIT C U P DASH 23 DASH 0 77. MS. SHARP. ALRIGHT, RIGHT. KAYLA SHARP. CITY PLANNER FOR THE RECORD. UM, SO THIS ONE IS A NEW C U P, UM, FOR ABBOTT'S FROZEN CUSTARD. UM, IT WILL BE, UM, ON KOHLER'S CROSSING. UM, JUST SET BACK, UM, A LITTLE BIT FROM THE I 35 FRONTAGE ROAD. UM, THE MATERIALS ARE PRETTY MUCH ALL BRICK. UM, THERE IS SOME BRICK THAT KIND OF LOOKS LIKE STONE, LOOKS LIKE IT MIGHT BE KIND OF LIKE A STONE VENEER. UM, AND ALL OF THEIR SCREENING DOES MATCH THE REST OF THE BUILDING FACADE. SO THIS ONE IS, UM, FULLY IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE I 35 OVERLAY. UM, AND THEY HAVE SOME APPROPRIATE ARCHITECTURAL DETAILS AS WELL TO KIND OF ACCENT THE BUILDING. UM, AND THEN THEIR DUMPSTER ENCLOSURE ALSO IS IN COMPLIANCE. UM, AND THEN THIS ONE IS THE, UM, PROPOSED SITE PLAN. THIS IS, I BELIEVE, IN REVIEW. SO TECHNICALLY THEY CAN SUBMIT FOR A C P BEFORE THE SITE PLAN HAS BEEN APPROVED AND THEY HAVE, UM, CHOSEN TO TAKE THAT ROUTE KNOWING THAT THE C P MAY OR MAY NOT BE APPROVED, BUT THEY WANTED THAT SURETY BEFORE SUBMITTING FOR THE SITE [00:25:01] PLAN. SO THIS WILL HAVE A FULLY, UM, COMPLIANT SITE PLAN TO GO ALONG WITH THIS. UM, SHOULD THE C P BE APPROVED AND STEPH FINDS IT COMPLIANT AND WE RECOMMEND APPROVAL. THANK YOU. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STEPH? YES, UH, COMMISSIONER JAMES. SO IF WHAT HAPPENS IF WE APPROVE THIS AND IT DOESN'T PASS SITE PLAN, I MEAN THEY WILL GO THROUGH AS MANY ROUNDS OF COMMENTS ON THE SITE PLAN AS NEEDED TO GET IT TO APPROVAL. UM, IF Y'ALL APPROVE THIS BUT THE SITE PLAN DOESN'T GET APPROVED, THEN THE PROJECT DOESN'T MOVE FORWARD. THEY CAN'T BUILD WITHOUT AN APPROVED SITE PLAN. SO THEY WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK AGAIN IF THEY WANTED TO CONT LIKE COME BACK THROUGH THE PROCESS. UM, WELL IF IT GOES BEYOND THE YEAR THAT THE C P IS VALID, UM, WHICH WE DON'T ANTICIPATE, BUT IF IT DOES, THEN THEY MIGHT HAVE TO COME BACK AND START THE PROCESS, AT LEAST WITH THE C P OVER AGAIN. UM, THE SITE PLAN PROCESS, THIS IS A PRETTY SMALL SITE SO IT SHOULDN'T TAKE TOO LONG. UM, AND THERE'S OTHER DEVELOPMENT GOING ON IN THE AREA, SO ALL THE UTILITIES AND THINGS LIKE THAT ARE ALREADY THERE, BASICALLY. UM, SO IT'S A PRETTY SIMPLE SITE FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE. UM, BUT YEAH, FOR SOME REASON THE SITE PLAN WASN'T APPROVED BY STAFF CUZ THAT'S ALL DONE BY STAFF. UM, AND THE PROJECT CAN'T MOVE ON. AND I WOULD LIKE TO ADD THAT IF, IF THEY HAVE ISSUES THROUGH THAT SITE PLAN PROCESS AND CAN'T MAKE THIS WORK IN THIS CONFIGURATION AND THEY DECIDED TO REDESIGN THE SITE, THEN ANY SUBSTANTIAL CHANGES LIKE THAT WE WOULD BRING BACK TO Y'ALL TO REAPPROVE IT. BUT IF, IF, IF IT'S MINOR TWEAKS, UH, A SHIFTING OF FEW SPACES HERE OR THERE, THEN WE'LL SAY THAT THAT SUBSTANTIALLY COMPLIES WITH THE C U P. THANK YOU FOR THAT CLARIFICATION, COMMISSIONER ARGAN. THANK YOU. UM, SO LOOKING AT THE ELEVATIONS RIGHT NOW, I HAVE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE SOUTH AND THE EAST SIDES. SO THE SOUTH ELEVATION, IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S A LITTLE BACK DOOR MM-HMM. , UM, ALL AROUND THE ENTIRE BUILDING. THERE'S SOME ARCHITECTURAL DETAIL. LOOKS LIKE A, A WAYNE'S COATING, WAYNE'S COTTING, I DUNNO HOW YOU SAY IT. UM, THEY DON'T HAVE THAT BY THE BACK DOOR, BUT THIS IS A DRIVE-THROUGH FACILITY, SO IT'S GONNA GO LIKE CARS WILL BE AROUND ALL OF THE SIDES. IS IS THERE ANY INSIGHT INTO WHY THEY CHOSE TO EXCLUDE IT THERE? UM, THE ONLY THING I CAN THINK OF, UM, IS THAT THE, THE COOLERS ARE BACK THERE. THAT'S KIND OF THE EXTENSION THAT YOU'RE SEEING. YOU CAN SEE IT ON, UM, FROM THE WEST AND THE EAST ELEVATION. THAT EXTENSION ON THE BACK IS WHERE THEIR COOLERS ARE GONNA BE. UM, AND SO THAT'S, THAT'S REALLY THE ONLY THING I CAN THINK OF THAT WOULD BE AFFECTING IT. UM, OKAY. UM, MY NEXT QUESTION IS ABOUT THE EAST ELEVATION. UH, I'M ASSUMING THAT THESE BIG GRAY THINGS ARE WHERE THEY'RE GOING TO PUT ADVERTISEMENTS OR POSTERS, THINGS LIKE THAT. CORRECT. SO ON THE WEST ELEVATION, IN THE NORTH ELEVATION, THERE ARE LIGHTS OVER THOSE, BUT THEY'VE CHOSEN TO NOT PUT ANY LIGHTS OVER THOSE ON THE EAST ELEVATION. DO WE KNOW WHY THEY'VE DONE THAT? UM, I DO NOT. OKAY. UM, MY NEXT QUESTION, , SORRY, I GOT A LOT OF TIME ON MY IS ALSO ONLINE AND MIGHT BE ABLE TO ASK, UH, ANSWER SOME OF THESE QUESTIONS FOR YOU IF YOU'D LIKE TO ASK THEM. ANSWERS ARE ALWAYS GOOD. UM, SHOULD WE, SHOULD WE GET, SHOULD WE PULL HIM IN ON THOSE AND THEN I KEEP GOING WITH MY QUESTIONS OR SHOULD I GET ALL MY QUESTIONS OUT THERE AND THEN WE PULL 'EM IN? THAT IS YOUR CHOICE. WHICH ARE YOU? PERFECT. OKAY. LET'S JUST DO ONE AT A TIME. SO THE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE ELEVATIONS FIRST, UM, MR. FLETCHER, ARE YOU THERE? I AM HERE. GOOD EVENING. HELLO. DID YOU HEAR THOSE QUESTIONS FROM COMMISSIONER ANKIN? I DID. I DID. UM, I SHOULD LET YOU GUYS KNOW THAT I'M A CIVIL ENGINEER THOUGH. THE, UH, ARCHITECTURAL RENDERINGS WERE PREPARED, UM, BY THE ARCHITECT AND, UM, I'M NOT SURE WHY, BUT THE, OUR, OUR CLIENT, UM, THEY MADE A SWITCH IN THE DESIGN TEAM, UM, FOLLOWING THE, UH, CP APPLICATION. THERE'S ANOTHER ARCHITECT ON BOARD NOW. SO, UM, I DID LOOK AND WHILE YOU GUYS WERE TALKING, I PULLED UP THE, UM, BLACK AND WHITE RENDERING. SOME OF THESE ITEMS ARE LABELED AND SO I'M TAKING A LOOK AT THAT NOW. AND THE QUESTION IS ON THE EAST ELEVATION. AND IF YOU LOOK AT THE ELEVATIONS THAT WERE THE BLACK AND WHITE ONES THAT WERE PROVIDED, THEY'RE ACTUALLY SHOWING THE LIGHT. I'M NOT SURE WHY THEY'RE NOT ON THE COLOR RENDERING, BUT ON THE UH, THE, UH, BLACK AND WHITE ELEVATIONS, THEY ARE SHOWN [00:30:01] TO LIGHT IT. OKAY. I BELIEVE WE HAVE THOSE BLACK AND WHITE ELEVATIONS. SO LET ME PULL THOSE UP FOR Y'ALL SO YOU CAN SEE. YES MA'AM. AND THEN, UM, COMMISSIONER ANKIN, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU WANNA CONTINUE WITH YOUR OTHER QUESTION WHILE I PULL THAT UP. YES. SO THIS IS A QUESTION FOR THE, FOR THE CITY STAFF, UM, READING THE STAFF MEMO, THE SPECIFICALLY THE TEXT OR THE ZONING ORDINANCE. UM, SO SECTION 5 53 DASH 8 96 A SEVEN, IT TALKS ABOUT LANDSCAPE DESIGN AND PLANTINGS BEING SOMETHING, UM, FOR US TO REVIEW. WE DON'T HAVE A LANDSCAPE PLAN FOR THIS AND THAT MIGHT BE BECAUSE THE SITE PLAN ITSELF IS NOT YET FINALIZED, BUT WOULD THAT BE SOMETHING THAT LATER COMES TO US OR IF WE APPROVE THIS, IT'S APPROVED IN LANDSCAPE, JUST GETS USHERED IN WITH IT. SO WE ALSO HAVE A LANDSCAPE CODE, UM, THAT APPLIES TO ZONING DISTRICTS AND ALSO THE I 35 OVERLAY. SO IT SPECIFIES FOR BOTH ITEMS AND THAT GENERALLY GETS APPROVED THROUGH THE SITE PLAN . SO, UM, JASON, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD. UM, YEAH, IT SOUNDS LIKE REALLY THIS IS PROBABLY SOMETHING WE'LL HAVE TO HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH WILL ABOUT HOW WE MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS. CUZ IT DOES LOOK LIKE THE CODE IS KIND OF BROKEN UP INTO TWO PARTS. UM, GENERALLY THE LANDSCAPING PLAN WE HAVE BEEN REVIEWING AS JUST PURELY PART OF THE SITE PLAN. UM, AND THAT'S AN ADMINISTRATIVE REVIEW. I THINK IF YOU HAVE CONCERNS OR QUESTIONS ON THE LANDSCAPING, YOU DEFINITELY HAVE HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO, TO ASK FOR SOME ADDITIONAL LANDSCAPING AND THAT IT CAN INCLUDE THAT ON THE SITE PLAN. UM, SO IF, SAY IF IT'S, UH, THE DUMPSTER, YOU KNOW, AREA AND YOU HAVE SOME CONCERNS ABOUT THAT, YOU CAN ASK FOR THEM TO, TO PUT IN SOME EITHER HEDGEROWS OR SOME TYPE OF VEGETATIVE BUFFER. UM, THEY DID ORIGINALLY ASK FOR A VEGETATIVE SCREEN BACK THERE, UH, TO SCREEN THEIR MECHANICAL EQUIPMENT. UM, BUT GIVEN THE FACT THAT THOSE TAKE SO LONG TO ESTABLISH, UH, OUR DROUGHTS, OUR RANDOM FREEZES, WE FELT THAT, THAT THAT FACILITY NEEDED TO BE PROPERLY SCREENED WITH THIS FENCE. UM, SO IF, IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE ADDITIONAL LANDSCAPING, I THINK YOU, YOU'D BE WELL WITHIN YOUR RIGHTS TO ADD THAT TO YOUR MOTION. UM, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'LL BE AS SPECIFIC AS SPECIES TYPE, BUT IF YOU WANT TO JUST, UH, UH, UH, AT LEAST A, A GENERAL DESCRIPTION OF WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT, IF IT'S BUSHES OR HEDGES, IF YOU'RE LOOKING FOR A MINIMUM HEIGHT, SOMETHING LIKE THAT, SOMETHING THAT THE, THE ARCHITECT AND LANDSCAPER CAN WORK WITH, I WOULD RECOMMEND DOING THAT. UM, IN THE MEANTIME WE'LL DISCUSS WITH WILL, UM, MOVING FORWARD WHETHER WE NEED TO REQUIRE THOSE LANDSCAPING PLANS AS PART OF THESE C U P OVERLAYS JUST SO EVERYBODY CAN SEE THEM. OKAY. THANK YOU. OKAY. AND THEN HERE ARE THOSE BLACK AND WHITE RENDERINGS IF THEY'LL COME UP? YEAH. SO YOU CAN SEE THAT THEY, THERE ARE SOME LITTLE LIGHTS THERE. UM, THEY'RE KIND OF HARD TO SEE IN THE BLACK AND WHITE, BUT YEAH, IT LOOKS LIKE THOSE WILL BE THERE ON THAT ELEVATION. OKAY. THANK YOU. ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? WOULD ANYONE LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION? MR. CHAIR? YES, SIR. MOTION TO APPROVE ITEM SIX B. THANK YOU. IT'S BEEN MOVED, UM, TO APPROVE ITEM NUMBER SIX B. IS THERE A SECOND FOR THAT? MOTION? SECOND. THANK YOU. IT'S BEEN MOVED BY VICE CHAIR CHASE, SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER STEGEL. IS THERE ANY, UM, DISCUSSION ON THAT MOTION? UM, I WOULD PERSONALLY LIKE TO SEE LANDSCAPE PLANS FOR THIS. WE HAVE A HUGE PARKING LOT HERE. UM, WHEN I LOOKED AT THE SITE PLAN, IT WAS TALKING ABOUT HOW THERE ARE SIX REQUIRED SPACES AND 27 PROVIDED SPACES. SO THAT CHEWS UP A PRETTY SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF THIS ALREADY SMALL LOT. AND SO I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME LANDSCAPE PLANS TO MAKE SURE THAT, UM, WE'RE USING THE SPACE NICELY AND, UH, YEAH, LANDSCAPE PLANS. YES, SIR. YEAH, I WANT SECOND THAT, UH, THOUGHT, UH, I DON'T FEEL COMFORTABLE AND CONFIDENT MAKING A FULL APPROVAL DECISION WITHOUT THAT KIND OF FULL INFORMATION. I THINK THAT A LOT COULD CHANGE, UM, JUST WITH NOT HAVING A SITE PLAN APPROVAL. AND I THINK THAT MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO LOOK AT IN THE FUTURE AS WELL, JUST KIND OF THINKING ABOUT THIS. SO I'M IN THE SAME CAMP. OKAY. THANK YOU. SO, UM, YES, IF THE MOTION DOES FAIL, WE CAN, WE CAN HAVE A NEW MOTION IF WE'D LIKE OR WE ALWAYS CAN'T HAVE A, SOMEONE CAN'T MOVE TO AMEND THE MOTION. BUT, UH, OTHERWISE WE CAN CONTINUE ON TO SEE IF THIS MOTION PASSES OR FAILS. IT'S REALLY YOUR CHOICE HOW TO MOVE FORWARD. [00:35:03] UM, OKAY. UM, THERE'S NO OTHER DISCUSSION. I'D LIKE TO HAVE A ROLL CALL. VOTE PLEASE. WAIT, ARE YOU GOOD WITH THAT? DO YOU HAVE SOMETHING ELSE TO SAY? NO, I WAS JUST LOOKING AT THE PLANS TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY DIDN'T HAVE ANYTHING ON HERE. OKAY. UM, SO I'M AMENABLE TO AMENDING THE MOTION. OKAY. UH, HOLD ON, ON THAT VOTE THEN. UM, SO RIGHT NOW THE MOTION IS TO APPROVE THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT. THERE ARE THOSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SEE A LANDSCAPE PLAN BEFORE THEY APPROVE. SO THIS, IF WE WERE TO, I, UM, I DON'T, I THINK WHAT WOULD YOU LIKE TO DO? THOSE WHO ARE LOOKING FOR THAT LANDSCAPE PLAN CAN MAKE A MOTION TO AMEND. THEY CAN MAKE A MOTION TO AMEND. YEAH. OKAY. YES. UM, I MOVE THAT WE AMEND THE MOTION TO STATE THAT WE APPROVE THE CONDITIONAL USE PLAN CONDITIONAL CONDITIONALLY UPON A LANDSCAPE PLAN COMING TO PLANNING AND ZONING. AND I'M GONNA END IT THERE AND SAY I AM, I THINK THERE MIGHT BE SOME MORE AMENDMENT TO THAT NEEDED, BUT THAT'S THE BEST I'VE GOT AT THIS POINT IN TIME. LIKE THINKING ABOUT MY BRAIN. UM, IF, IF I COULD, I MAY MAKE A SUGGESTION JUST TO MAKE THIS A LITTLE EASIER. UM, PLEASE. I THINK IF, IF, IF EVERYBODY'S OKAY WITH, UH, WANTING TO SEE THE LANDSCAPING PLAN, UM, THERE'S A COUPLE WAYS WE CAN DO IT. WE CAN AMEND THE MOTION, BRING THAT BACK, BUT THE MOTION WOULD HAVE TO BE SPECIFIC ON ARE WE GONNA LET THEM MOVE FORWARD WITH THEIR EXTERIOR DESIGN? UM, OR DO WE WANT TO JUST TABLE THIS AND HAVE THEM COME BACK AND, AND INCLUDE THE LANDSCAPING PLAN. SO I, I DON'T KNOW WHICH, WHAT Y'ALL ARE THINKING OR HOW YOU WANT TO MOVE FORWARD, BUT THERE'S, THERE'S A COUPLE OF OPTIONS. UM, UM, SO I WOULDN'T DENY IT. UM, YOU COULD TABLE IT AND ASK FOR MORE INFORMATION, UM, OR YOU COULD AMEND YOUR MOTION AND ASK FOR THE ADDITIONAL LANDSCAPING IF YOU WANTED TO ALLOW THEM TO MOVE FORWARD. ON, ON THE REST OF THE, THERE'S A MOTION ON THE FLOOR. DO YOU WANT TO WITHDRAW YOUR MOTION? OKAY. THANK YOU. SO HERE, UM, I WOULD SAY WHAT I WOULD RECOMMEND, WELL, WHAT I WOULD PERSONALLY RECOMMEND IS EITHER WE VOTE ON WHAT'S ALREADY BEEN SAID, YES, YES, WE APPROVE. NO, WE DON'T. OR WE VOTE TO POSTPONE AND ASK FOR A, UH, LANDSCAPE PLAN, UH, STAFF. WAS THAT MAKE, WOULD, WOULD YOU ALL AGREE WITH THAT? TO, TO, TO DO ONE OF THOSE TWO OPTIONS TO EITHER VOTE TO APPROVE OR NOT? OR IF WE WANT THE LANDSCAPE PLAN, WE WOULD TYPICALLY JUST POSTPONE THIS ITEM UNTIL THAT LANDSCAPE PLAN WAS AVAILABLE. UM, STAFF CAN'T TELL YOU WHAT, WHAT THE MOTION TO BE, THAT'S FINE, BUT WE CAN'T TELL YOU THOSE ARE TWO VIABLE OPTION FINES. ? YES. UH, I JUST HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF JUST TO MAKE SURE IF WE DECIDE TO TABLE IT, WE'RE NOT RUNNING UP ON ANY SPECIFIC DEADLINES OTHER THAN THE TWO THAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT. NO DEADLINES. THEY, THEY, I MEAN, THEY STILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE SITE PLAN PROCESS. AND JUST TO ADD ON TO THE SITE PLAN, UM, THE ONE THAT IS SHOWN IN THE BACKUP MATERIAL OBVIOUSLY HAS NOT BEEN APPROVED. I KNOW THERE WERE SOME CONCERNS ABOUT THE LARGE PARKING AREA THAT WOULD BE ADDRESSED, UM, AS, UM, WITH SUCH A SMALL BUILDING FOOTPRINT, HAVING THAT AMOUNT OF PARKING WOULDN'T BE TO CODE. UM, SO THAT ALSO SHOULD ADDRESS SOME OF THOSE CONCERNS. ALL RIGHT. THERE IS A MOTION AND A SECOND ON THE FLOOR. THE MOTION CURRENTLY IS TO APPROVE THIS CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT. WE CAN GO FORWARD WITH THIS VOTE AND THEN IF THAT VOTE FAILS, WE CAN THEN DO A DIFFERENT VOTE IF YOU'D LIKE, OR SOMEONE CAN MOVE TO AMEND THE EMOTION TO NOW IT'S REALLY THE COMMISSION'S DECISION. I THINK WE COULD VOTE AND THEN IF NECESSARY, FOLLOWED UP WITH A, A DIFFERENT MOTION. ALL RIGHT, SO THE CURRENT VOTE WE'RE DOING NOW IS TO VOTE, IS TO APPROVE THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT. OKAY. MAY WE HAVE A ROLL CALL VOTE PLEASE. ANKIN NAY GARRA AYE. STEGEL. AYE. JAMES NAY. CHASE. AYE. OKAY. MOTION PASSES. THANK YOU. LET'S GO [C.   Consider and make a recommendation to City Council regarding an amendment to Chapter 54 (Landscaping and Screening Requirements).   Public Hearing Recommendation to City Council  ] ON TO ITEM NUMBER SIX C. CONSIDER AND MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO CITY COUNCIL REGARDING AN AMENDMENT TO CHAPTER 54 LANDSCAPING AND SCREENING REQUIREMENTS. THERE IS A PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS ITEM. IF THERE'S ANY MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM, YOU [00:40:01] MAY COME UP. NOW I'M SEEING NINE. GO AND CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. UH, MR. LUTZ? THANK YOU CHAIRMAN. COMMISSIONER, GIMME ONE SECOND WHILE I SHARE MY SCREEN. OKAY. SO TODAY WE HAVE, UH, SOME PROPOSED, UH, AMENDMENTS TO OUR CHAPTER 54 THAT IS OUR LANDSCAPING AND SCREENING ORDINANCE. UM, AS WE GO THROUGH SOME OF THE, UH, UH, REASONS WHY WE'RE HERE TODAY, UH, I WANNA LET YOU KNOW THAT THIS WAS REQUESTED BY CITY COUNCIL. UM, AND THE GOAL ON THIS, THESE AMENDMENTS THAT YOU'RE GONNA SEE BEFORE YOU WERE FOR, UM, TO REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF WATER THAT WE WERE CURRENTLY UTILIZING FOR, UH, VEGETATION. UM, THIS WAS NOT A, A REQUEST TO IMPROVE OR, OR ADD LANDSCAPING REQUIREMENTS TO THE CODE. IT TRULY WAS, IS THERE A WAY TO FIND, UH, AREAS WITHIN OUR CODE THAT WE CAN REDUCE WATER CONSUMPTION? UM, GIVEN THE SEVERAL YEAR DROUGHT THAT WE'VE BEEN GOING UNDER A RELIANCE ON, ON ADDITIONAL WATER COMING IN THE AREA, THIS WAS ONE OF THEIR CONCERNS. SO THOSE ARE WHAT THE MAJOR CHANGES WERE FOCUSED ON. UM, I'LL GO OVER THOSE, UH, VERY HIGH LEVELS. SO WHAT WE DID WAS WE ADDED SOME ALLOWANCES TO UTILIZE, UH, ARTIFICIAL PLANTS AND GRASS. YOU WILL NOTICE THIS WAS LIMITED TO THE MULTI-FAMILY, UH, COMMERCIAL OR MIXED USE, UH, AREAS. WE DID NOT GET INTO DISCUSSION ON SINGLE FAMILY HOMES. UM, AT THIS POINT, UM, KIND OF BABY STEPPING, UH, ARTIFICIAL LAWNS AND SEE WHERE WE GO FROM THERE AND SEE WHAT P AND Z AND COUNCIL'S THOUGHTS ARE. UM, WE DID, UH, INCREASE THE ALLOWANCES FOR COMMERCIAL PROJECTS TO UTILIZE ZERO LANDSCAPING. UM, WE DID PROPOSE A 75% OF THE REQUIRED LANDSCAPING COULD UTILIZE ZERO SCAPING. SO AGAIN, KEEP IN MIND THAT WE ARE LOOKING AT TRADE-OFFS. SO, UH, WE ARE SAVING WATER, BUT IN ONE INSTANCE WE MAY SEE LESS LANDSCAPING. SO THAT'S SOMETHING TO TO CONSIDER AS YOU GO THROUGH THIS. UM, THIS NEXT ONE IS PROBABLY A BIG ONE. WE'VE HAD SEVERAL, UM, DISCUSSION POINTS ABOUT IT. UM, THIS WAS THE ALLOWANCE TO UTILIZE VEGETATION AS REQUIRED SCREENING. SO IN THE CODE, THERE'S THREE OPTIONS THAT YOU CAN DO. YOU CAN DO LANDSCAPE BEMS AS YOUR REQUIRED SCREENING. UH, YOU CAN DO VEGETATIVE SCREENING OR YOU CAN DO EXISTING, EXISTING SCREENING, UM, IF IT'S THICK ENOUGH TO, TO GO THAT WAY. UH, MY EXPERIENCE, UH, WITH WITH VEGETATIVE SCREENING IS THEY'RE VERY WATER INTENSIVE TO GET ESTABLISHED. UM, MOST OF THE TIME IT TAKES SEVERAL MONTHS OR YEARS TO, TO GET THAT GOING. UM, AND THEN THEY'RE SUSCEPTIBLE TO, UM, DROUGHTS FREEZES. AND SO AGAIN, WE'RE LOOKING AT OUR GOAL IS SCREENING. ARE WE ADEQUATE AT LEAST SCREENING THE SITE? WE'RE NOT SURE THAT THESE GET THERE. UM, AND THEY ALSO REQUIRE A LOT OF WATER NOW TO SAY THAT WOULD NOT PROHIBIT SOMEONE IF THEY BUILT A SIX FOOT QUICK CREEK FENCE COUNCIL P AND Z OR, OR THE DEVELOPER COULD ADD SOME SOME LANDSCAPE ELEMENTS AROUND IT TO DRESS IT UP, BUT THEY WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO DO 100% LANDSCAPING MOVING FORWARD. SO THAT'S KIND OF THE BIG ONE THERE. UM, WE ALSO PROVIDED SOME INCENTIVES TO INSTALL RAINWATER COLLECTION SYSTEMS, UM, TO SUPPLEMENT THEIR WATER USAGE FOR LANDSCAPING DRIP IRRIGATION. UM, THESE CAN BE AS COMPLICATED AS AN ENTIRE ROOF SYSTEM OR IT CAN BE AS SIMPLE AS A DRAIN FROM THE AC CONDENSATION LINE DOWN TO THEIR, THEIR FLOWER BEDS. SO, UM, THEY ARE INCENTIVIZED. WE ARE LOOKING AT, UH, INCREASING THEIR PARKING RATIOS. UM, SO INSTEAD OF ONE AND A HALF PERCENT MULTIPLIER, THEY COULD GO TO 1.75. UM, SO IF THEY WANTED ADDITIONAL PARKING, THEY COULD PUT IN SOME, SOME, UH, UH, RAINWATER HARVESTING. SO, UM, THOSE ARE KIND OF THE BIG TICKET ITEMS. UM, WHEN WE WENT THROUGH THIS, I DID PROVIDE Y'ALL WITH THE MATRIX THAT SHOWED KIND OF EVERY SECTION OF CODE THAT WE CHANGED AND, UH, TRY TO EXPLAIN WHAT OUR THOUGHT PROCESS WAS BEHIND THAT. SO, UM, I'LL TURN IT OVER TO YOU. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, WE'D LIKE TO ANSWER THOSE AT THIS TIME. THANK YOU. ANYONE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? YES. YES, I HAVE. UH, PERHAPS SEVERAL. YES, SIR. UM, RAINWATER HARVESTING. I'M A VERY BIG, UH, FAN OF THAT. I'VE LIVED ON RAIN HARVESTED RAINWATER. UM, AND THEY'RE REQUIRED IN THIS FOR COMMERCIAL MIXED USE AND MULTI-FAMILY PROJECTS. THE PROBLEM WITH RAINWATER SYSTEMS IS, UH, NOT THE COLLECTION BUT THE STORAGE. AND SO IT HAS A VERY BIG IMPACT ON FOOTPRINTS NECESSARILY IF YOU'RE TALKING ANY SIZE BUILDING AT ALL. SO WHAT, WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT HOW TO WORK WITH A, A DEVELOPER TO, UH, TO ACCOUNT FOR THE KIND OF, UH, STORAGE THAT MIGHT BE REQUIRED FOR SOME OF THESE BUILDINGS? UM, WE'RE GONNA KIND OF LEAVE IT UP TO THEM. UM, WE DON'T NEARLY, WE CAN'T ENFORCE A TOTAL COLLECTION. WE CAN'T FORCE, THEY HAVE TO COLLECT A HUNDRED PERCENT OF THE RAINFALL, 80%. UM, UM, IT REALLY IS ON WHAT THEY WANT TO COLLECT. SO [00:45:01] AT THAT POINT, IF THEY WANT TO COLLECT AND, AND COLLECT LARGE AREAS, THEN WE'LL JUST HAVE TO WORK WITH THE LANDOWNER TO MAKE SURE THAT THEIR DESIGNS, THEIR STORAGE TANKS AREN'T JUST BLACK PLASTIC BUCKETS HANGING AROUND THE, THE, THE GUTTERS. YOU KNOW, UM, THERE'S A LOT OF DEVELOPMENTS IN, IN AUSTIN. THEY UTILIZE THESE, THESE HARVESTING BARRELS. UM, THEY DRESS THEM UP. THEY EITHER MAKE THEM LIKE WATER TOWERS. I MEAN, AT THAT POINT WE'D KINDA LEAN ON THE ARCHITECTS TO, TO DO THEIR JOB, TO, TO IMPROVE ON THOSE DEVELOPMENT LOOKS. IF THERE'S ISSUES, WHETHER IT'S SETBACKS, UM, STORAGE OR AREA, THEN AT THAT POINT WE'D HAVE TO HAVE SOME CONVERSATIONS TO MAKE IT WORK. SO WE'RE NOT GONNA LOOK AT, UH, THE CONSTRUCTION OF THOSE STRUCTURES AS ANY DIFFERENT THAN ANY OTHER STRUCTURE THAT THEY MAY BUILD. AND WE'RE NOT OFFERING ANY KIND OF INCENTIVE FOR RAINWATER COLLECTION. JUST THE INCREASE IN PARKING. JUST THE INCREASE IN PARKING. NOW, THIS IS KIND OF AN IRONY TO ME THAT WE WOULD BE COLLECTING RAINWATER, UM, TAKING IT OFF THE LAND, BUT PUTTING IN PARKING SPACES THAT WOULD CAUSE MORE RUNOFF, , UH, IT DOES, UM, YOU KNOW, RUNOFF IS, IS A, IS A BIG ISSUE. I MEAN, DEPENDING ON THE SITE, UM, YOU, YOU ARE ADDING MORE PARKING. UM, SO AT THIS POINT WOULD BE A 0.25% INCREASE. UM, BUT, YOU KNOW, IF THEY HAVE COLLECTING RAINWATER, THEY MAY END UP COLLECTING MORE THAN WHAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE ADDING PARKING. SO THAT'LL BE SOMETHING WE WOULD LOOK AT AS PART OF THEIR PROPOSALS. UM, AGAIN, THE, THE, THIS IS AN INCENTIVE. UM, WE CAN'T FORCE THAT ON SOMEONE. UM, WE'VE TRIED OTHER INCENTIVES, BUT, UH, IT'S VERY DIFFICULT BECAUSE THE, THE, WE HAVE A STORM WATER, UH, FEE THAT WE CHARGE MONTHLY AS PART OF OUR UTILITY BILL. AND SO IT, IT'S BEEN HARD FOR US TO GET THE DEVELOPERS, UH, OR THE INITIAL BUILDER TO, TO INSTALL THESE SYSTEMS CUZ IT'S EX EXPENSIVE ON THE FRONT END. AND THEN THEY DON'T UTILIZE THE FINANCIAL SAVINGS, UH, OVER THE LIFE OF THE BUILDING. SO, UH, IT'S, IT'S NOT BEEN WORKING. UM, SO WE'VE KIND OF WANTED TO TRY THIS, SEE IF THAT WOULD WORK. AGAIN, THIS IS KIND OF OUR FIRST STAB AT THIS. UH, WE'LL MONITOR IT PROBABLY THE NEXT SIX MONTHS TO A YEAR AND THEN KIND OF SEE, OKAY, ARE THERE CHANGES IN STATE LAW? ARE THERE CHANGES IN OUR COMP PLAN? UH, HAS IT BEEN WORKING? IS IT NOT WORKING? YOU KNOW, DO WE NEED TO BRING THIS BACK AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURES? YEAH, MY ULTIMATE CONCERN IS THAT, YOU KNOW, A TOKEN PROJECT IS PUT UP THAT, YOU KNOW, WE PUT A THOUSAND GALLON BARREL OUT THERE WITH ONE RAINOUT AND WE'VE MET THE, UH, REQUIREMENT. UM, I HAVE SOME OTHER, UH, QUESTIONS AS WELL. YOU STILL HAVE THE FLOOR, UM, SYNTHETIC PLANTS THREE. NUMBER THREE, ALL SYNTHETIC PLANTS AND ARTIFICIAL LAWNS MUST BE MAINTAINED IN GOOD WORKING CONDITIONS SHALL BE REPLACED AS NEEDED. UM, ONE THING IN PARTICULAR I'M CONCERNED ABOUT WITH PLANTS, IF NOT THE LAWNS, UM, WOULD BE COLOR FADING AND UV RESISTANCE IN TERMS OF BREAKDOWN. UM, HOW WOULD THAT BE, YOU KNOW, IN GOOD WORKING CONDITION IS A VERY BROAD KIND OF STATEMENT. HOW WOULD WE REQUIRE THEM TO HAVE MATERIALS THAT ARE COLOR, FAST AND, AND RESISTANT TO, UH, EV UM, RIGHT NOW, BECAUSE OF SUCH A DIFFERENCE IN, THERE ARE HUNDREDS OF PRODUCTS OUT THERE, UM, SOME ARE ARE VERY HIGH END. UM, THEY CAN BE IN THE SUN ALL DAY LONG, EVERY DAY FOR TWO YEARS AND NOT FADE. UM, SOME YOU GIVE THEM EIGHT HOURS AND, AND THEY'RE DONE. WE DON'T GET CONTROL OF THAT. UM, AT THIS POINT, IT'LL, IT'LL BE UP TO US IN CODE ENFORCEMENT IF WE SEE FADING. IF WE SEE THOSE THINGS, WE CAN, WE CAN ISSUE THOSE OUT. UM, THE REASON IT'S FLEXIBLE LIKE THAT IN VAGUE IS BECAUSE EACH, UH, SYSTEM IS GONNA BE KIND OF DEPENDENT ON THEIR OWN STANDARD SPECIFICATIONS. SO SOME, SOME MAY SAY, HEY, THEY HAVE TO BE IN SHADE FOR X AMOUNT OF HOURS. SOME MAY SAY THEY NEED TO BE WATERED FOR SO MANY TIMES A DAY. SO, UM, THIS WON'T ELIMINATE THE USE OF WATER. SOME OF THESE HAVE TO BE WATERED BECAUSE THEY GET BRITTLE, THEY GET HARD. UM, SO IT'LL BE JUST ONE OF THOSE, YOU KNOW, AS WE DRIVE AROUND AND IF WE SEE AN ISSUE, WE'LL HAVE TO GO TO CODE ENFORCEMENT AND SAY, HEY, UH, YOUR PLANTS ARE FADING OR, OR THEY'RE BROKEN OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. THAT'S WHY WE STARTED KIND OF WITH THE SMALL PERCENTAGE. UM, BUT YOU CAN LOOK AROUND TOWN. THERE'S, THERE'S A COUPLE OF PLACES THAT UTILIZE IT NOW. UM, I DON'T THINK THEY WERE ALLOWED BY CODE AT THE TIME. I THINK THEY JUST INSTALLED THEM. UM, AND ULTIMATELY THIS IS A PERSONAL OPINION, SOME PEOPLE GO THERE AND THEY LIKE IT AND SOME PEOPLE GO THERE AND THEY DON'T LIKE IT. SO, UM, AGAIN, OUR, OUR GOAL WAS TO TRY AND FIND WAYS TO CONSERVE WATER. AND THIS WAS ONE OF THOSE WAYS. UM, ANOTHER ITEM IS THAT, UH, UM, F TWO, NO MORE THAN 75% OF THE REQUIRED LANDSCAPING SHALL BE ZERO ESCAPING. SO OBVIOUSLY THAT MEANS A HUNDRED PER, YOU CAN'T DO A HUNDRED PERCENT CORRECT. AND WHAT'S, WHAT'S THE REASONING FOR THAT? TRYING TO BALANCE THE, THE, THE LOOK OF THE PROPERTIES WITH, WITH WATER? UM, UH, WE WROTE, WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS CODE, UM, PROBABLY SINCE I STARTED. UM, AND WE'RE JUST KIND OF PICKING [00:50:01] THROUGH COMMENTS. WE HEAR EITHER THROUGH THESE MEETINGS, THROUGH COUNCIL MEETINGS, THROUGH UM, TERRORS MEETINGS, CITIZENS COMMENTS, UM, THERE'S ALWAYS THAT BALANCE. UM, SOME PEOPLE LIKE REALLY LUSH LANDSCAPING IN FRONT OF THEIR, THEIR COMMERCIAL AREAS. SOME PEOPLE WANT TO CONSERVE WATER AND DON'T LIKE THAT. SO WE'RE TRYING TO STRIKE A BALANCE HERE. UM, OBVIOUSLY WE KNEW JUST GIVEN, UH, CERTAIN MEMBERS OF THE COMMUNITY JUST THERE'S, THERE'S A WANT FOR LANDSCAPING AND VEGETATION, SO WE DIDN'T WANT TO GO TO A HUNDRED PERCENT. OKAY. BECAUSE IF, UH, TOO OFTEN PEOPLE CONCEIVE OF ZERO ESCAPING AS CACTUS AND A BUNCH OF HARDSCAPE AND, UM, IT'S, IT'S REALLY MUCH MORE NUANCED THAN THAT. AND, AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHY WE ADDED THE DEFINITION FOR ZERO ESCAPING CUZ YOU'RE, YOU'RE CORRECT. IT'S, IT'S NOT JUST RIVER STONES AND, AND CACTUS. I MEAN, IT'S, IT'S DROUGHT TALLER IN PLANTS. IT'S, IT'S, IT CAN BE SITE SPECIFIC. UM, SO IT IS VERY MUCH A, A PLAN TO, TO BE UTILIZED. SO. OKAY. THANK YOU. I HAVE A, I HAVE A FEW QUESTIONS. OKAY. UH, 54 DASH THREE. UM, ITEM NUMBER B, IT SAYS ALL PROPERTY AND THEN CROSSED OUT WITHIN THE CITY LIMITS AND WE CHANGE IT TO WITHIN THE CITY'S WATER SERVICE AREA. SO I UNDERSTAND THAT CHANGE, BUT I, I, I MAY NOT UNDERSTAND THIS PROCESS VERY WELL. CAN WE ENFORCE THIS THAT, UH, THAT THEY MUST ADHERE TO THE CITY'S DROUGHT MANAGEMENT PROGRAM WHEN WATERING OUTSIDE OF OUR CITY LIMITS? CAN WE ENFORCE THE CITY'S DROUGHT MANAGEMENT PROGRAM? UM, WE'RE NOT ENTIRELY SURE. UM, BUT WE WANT TO TRY BECAUSE IT IS OUR WATER. UM, AND SO THAT WAS A REASON WHY WE ADDED THAT IN THERE. AS YOU KNOW, THERE'S, THERE'S MANY AREAS THAT UTILIZE CITY WATER. OKAY. UM, WE MAKE THOSE FOLKS, UM, UTILIZE OUR BUILDING PERMIT PROCESS, DO OUR INSPECTION PROCESS, ANYTHING THAT'S TIED TO OUR WATER MM-HMM. . UM, SO STAFF MADE THE, MADE THE, THE RULE THAT LET'S TRY AND ENFORCE THAT. UM, IF THAT IS, IS A NO-GO THEN, THEN WE'LL COVER THAT WITH THE ATTORNEY AND WE CAN STRIKE THAT BEFORE IT GOES TO SECOND READ IF, IF COUNSEL ULTIMATELY APPROVES THIS. OKAY. THANK YOU. UM, ON 54 DASH NINE, THE ADDITIONAL REQUIRED PLANTING, UM, IT IT IT DOES NOT APPLY TO THE FOLLOWING ZONING CATEGORIES, WHICH ARE RESIDENTIAL ZONING CATEGORIES AND THEN CM AND, AND COMMERCIAL MANUFACTURING AND WAREHOUSE HAS BEEN CROSSED OUT. UH, IS, IS THERE A REASON THAT, SO COMMERCIAL MANUFACTURING AND WAREHOUSE FROM HERE ON OUT ACCORDING TO THIS, WILL NEED TO ADHERE TO THE SAME STANDARDS AS RETAIL SERVICES OR THE OTHER ZONINGS THAT ARE NOT RESIDENTIAL? YES. OKAY. UM, YEAH, SO THOUGHT PROCESS WE'RE, I MEAN, AS YOU CAN SEE DRIVING AROUND OUR, OUR COMMERCIAL WAREHOUSING, UM, THOSE FACILITIES ARE, ARE NOT SMALL. UM, A LOT OF PARKING. UM, SOMETIMES WE GET SOME TREES, SOMETIMES WE DON'T. BUT, BUT THIS WAS AN OPPORTUNITY WE THOUGHT, OKAY, WE COULD MAYBE REQUIRE AN ADDITIONAL ADDITIONAL PLANTINGS IN THESE AREAS BECAUSE THEY ARE, THEY ARE VAST, UH, CONCRETE JUNGLES. UM, AGAIN, WATER CONSERVATION HAPPENS IN MANY WAYS. ONE OF THOSE IS GETTING IT TO RAIN. UH, ONE OF THE INTERESTING FACTS ABOUT HEAT ISLAND EFFECTS IS, IS THAT IF YOU HAVE A STORM COMING OVER YOUR CITY AND YOU HAVE THAT LARGE TEMPERATURE HEAT CHANGE BECAUSE YOU'RE 90% IMPERVIOUS COVER AND CONCRETE, THAT CAN ACTUALLY FORCE THOSE CELLS TO SPLIT OR MOVE AROUND AND ACTUALLY CAUSE YOU NOT TO HAVE RAIN. SO THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS YOU SEE THE CANOPY TREES THAT WERE INSTALLED, UH, VERSUS ORNAMENTAL TREES. UM, THE GOAL IS, YOU KNOW, HOW DO YOU REDUCE THAT HEAT ISLAND EFFECT? HOW DO YOU SAVE WATER? UH, HOW DO YOU GET MORE WATER? YEAH, THAT ACTUALLY IS ANOTHER QUESTION I HAD. SO CANOPY TREES, ARE WE DEFINING THAT, UM, CANOPIES HAVE, CANOPY TREES HAVE THEIR OWN DEFINITION IN OKAY. IN, IN THE STATE LAW AND, AND AND WHAT THOSE ARE? UM, SO CREPE MARTS ARE NOT CANOPY TREES, RIGHT. UM, THEY'RE WHAT WE CONSIDER UNDERSTORY TREES EVEN THOUGH THEY CAN'T GET UP TO 25 FEET. UM, BUT THEY DO NOT PROVIDE, UH, I MEAN IF THEY GET 25 FEET TALLER, YEAH, THEY PROVIDE SOME SHADE. BUT, UM, GENERALLY WHAT YOU'LL PROBABLY SEE IN MOST PARKING LOTS, UM, WHAT'S WHAT'S UTILIZED A LOT IN TEXAS IS, UH, TEXAS PERSIMMON. UM, IT'S A SMALLER TREE. UM, THE CANOPY USUALLY HITS 10 TO 12 FEET, UM, AND THEN SPRAWLS OUT. THEY'RE DROUGHT TOLERANT. UM, THEY, THEY CAN HANDLE SHALLOW PARKING AREAS AND STUFF LIKE THAT. SO, UM, OKAY. ULTIMATELY, AGAIN, WE LEAVE IT UP TO THE LANDSCAPE, UH, DESIGNERS AND ARCHITECTS TO, TO PICK WHAT WORKS BEST FOR THEIR SITE. BUT WE, WE WANT TO GET RID OF THE ORNAMENTAL TREES. AND I I HAVE ONE LAST QUESTION. SO ON THAT SAME SECTION, IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT WAS CHANGED, IT'S SOMETHING THAT WAS IN THE CODE ALREADY AND 54 DASH NINE, ITEM NUMBER B FOUR SAYS PLANTING OPTION FOUR FOUR INCH TREES, OR THREE FOUR INCH TO FIVE INCH TREES COUNT AS CREDIT FOR FIVE THREE INCH TREES. UM, [00:55:01] NOW NUMBERS ASIDE, UH, I I I THOUGHT THE, WHEN WE MADE THE CHANGE TO THE TREES THAT WERE REQUIRED, WE PURPOSEFULLY WANTED THE SMALLER TREES BECAUSE THEY WERE LESS, THEY WERE LESS LIKELY TO JUST DIE OFF IN THE SUMMER HEAT AND SUCH AND TAKE. AND SO, UM, WELL I KNOW THIS WASN'T A CHANGE, IT WAS ALREADY IN THERE. IT ALMOST SEEMS LIKE WE, WE DON'T WANT THEM TO USE LESS BIGGER TREES THAN MORE SMALLER TREES. UH, BUT HERE THEY HAVE THE OPTION THEY, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN CHOOSE. DO YOU WANT LESS TREES? WE'LL HAVE THEM BE THICKER. YOU WANT MORE TREES? WE'LL HAVE THEM BE THINNER. I, I THINK IT'S BEEN A WHILE SINCE WE HAD THIS DISCUSSION. IT WAS BACK WHEN, YOU KNOW HOWARD WAS HERE. BUT, UM, I'M PRETTY SURE WE SPECIFICALLY MADE THE DECISION TO GO WITH SMALLER TREES FOR THAT REASON. AND I, I CAN'T ANSWER OR SPEAK TO THOSE CONVERSATIONS. RIGHT. BUT I WILL, I WILL SPEAK ON MY EXPERIENCE WITH, UH, WORKING A COMMUNITY THAT WAS VERY HEAVY ON TREE MITIGATION. UM, PROBABLY ONE OF THE MOST HEAVIEST IN THE STATE. UM, YOU DO WANT TO PROVIDE OPTIONS BECAUSE THERE ARE CASES AND TIMES WHERE YOU WILL GET A SITE, UM, YOUR, SAY YOUR MITIGATION IS, UH, 36 CALIBERS OR DBHS AS WE DO HERE. UM, AND, AND THE STATE HAS, HAS PREEMPTED CITIES. SO NOW TWO INCHES IS THE MINIMUM THAT, THAT YOU CAN REQUIRE TO TAKE. WELL THAT'S TO GET 36 CALIBERS AT TWO INCHES, THAT'S 12 TREES. A SITE MAY NOT PHYSICALLY BE ABLE TO SUPPORT 12 FULL GROWN TREES. UM, YOU CAN PLANT THEM, THEY'LL GROW TOGETHER, UM, DEPENDING ON THE TYPE, THEY MAY, THEY MAY MAKE IT FOR A WHILE, BUT AS THEY DO REACH MATURITY, THEY WILL EITHER KILL EACH OTHER OFF OR THEY'RE JUST, THEY'RE SO DENSE THAT CAN'T WORK. UM, AGAIN, EVERY SITE IS SPECIFIC, RIGHT? UH, BUT WE WANTED A CODE THAT'S FLEXIBLE. UM, WE DON'T LIKE PAINTING OURSELVES INTO CORNERS. UM, DEVELOPMENT PATTERNS, WEATHER PATTERNS, UH, UH, BOARDS, COMMISSIONS CHANGE ALL THE TIME. SO THE MORE FLEXIBILITY WE HAVE, UM, WHILE STILL GETTING THE INTENT OF THE CODE IS ALWAYS A GOOD THING FROM, FROM OUR STANDPOINT. OKAY. THOSE ARE MY COMMENTS. ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANYTHING YOU'D LIKE TO? YES, SIR. SO ALL THESE PROPOSED CHANGES ARE SUBSTANTIALLY MORE EXPENSIVE TO INSTALL THAN TURF. UM, AND YOU ALREADY MADE THE COMMENT AT THE BEGINNING, WE GAVE THEM MORE PARKING SPACES TO ADD IN THESE EXPENSIVE RAINWATER COLLECTION SYSTEMS HOPING TO ENTICE THEM. UM, I'LL BE HONEST, I DON'T SEE THIS ENTICING, ESPECIALLY IF IT'S NOT, IF IT'S A DEVELOPER WHO'S THEN SELLING IT OFF TO, TO A USER, IF IT'S A USER BUILDER, THEN COMPLETELY DIFFERENT. THEY'LL PROBABLY DO THE INVESTMENTS. UM, SO THAT'S MY ONLY COMMENT THERE. UH, SECOND, I DON'T LIKE ARTIFICIAL TURF. UM, 90% OF THE TIMES IT'S INSTALLED INCORRECTLY AND IT LOOKS HORRIBLE. UH, EVERYBODY GOES WITH THE LOWEST BIDDERS, AGAIN, DEVELOPER, RIGHT? GO WITH THE LOWEST BIDDERS. I'M NOT ALWAYS THE BEST. UM, I REMEMBER A GENTLEMAN THAT OWNED PROPERTY NEXT TO ONE OF OUR DEVELOPMENTS. HE HAD SIX ACRES. HE DECIDED TO PUT HIS ENTIRE BACKYARD IN, IN, UH, ARTIFICIAL TURF, LOOKED GREAT FOR 30 DAYS, AND THEN IT TURNED INTO A HILLY MASS BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T TAKE IT INTO ACCOUNT ALL THE DRAINAGE AND EVERYTHING THAT CAME THROUGH HIS BACKYARD, WHICH MOST OF THESE GUYS DON'T. THEY JUST LAID THIS STUFF DOWN, THEY PACK IT WITH SAND AND SAY, YOU'RE GOOD TO GO. I'M OUT. UM, SO I'D PREFER NOT TO ENCOURAGE ARTIFICIAL TURFING IN ANY OF OUR DEVELOPMENTS. OKAY. AND, AND I WILL SAY THAT'S WHY WE LIMITED IT'S KIND OF 10%. UM, AND WHY WE LIFTED, LIFTED IN COMMERCIAL, UM, WE FELT THERE MAY BE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR MAYBE, UH, INNER COURTYARDS THAT HAVE HIGH TRAFFIC AREAS THAT THAT GRASS MAY NOT JUST GROW. THAT, THAT, THAT MAKE, MAKE SENSEEN MAKE SENSE. UM, AGAIN, THE, THE GOAL WAS NEVER TO SAY, HEY, WE'RE GONNA LET YOU GREEN UP YOUR SITE WITH TURF. IT REALLY WAS JUST, ARE THERE CERTAIN STRATEGIC AREAS THAT YOU COULD UTILIZE THIS? UM, IF Y'ALL THINK THAT 10% IS TOO HIGH AND YOU WANT TO KIND OF GO LOWER, THEN, THEN YOU KNOW, PLEASE INCLUDE THAT IN YOUR MOTION OR, OR AT LEAST SOME OF YOUR RECOMMENDATIONS TO COUNSEL ARE, ARE YOU OKAY? YES. SO IN USUAL ORDER OF BUSINESS, IF YOU FALL ON A TURF AND INJURE YOURSELF, YOU SUE THE PERSON WHO PUT IN, IF YOU CAUSE TURF CAUSES SIGNIFICANTLY MORE INJURY THAN REGULAR GRASS. UM, COMING FROM A SPORTS BACKGROUND, THIS IS SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE PLAY SOCCER, WE DEAL WITH THIS ALL THE TIME WHERE ANY, ANY PHYSICAL ACTIVITY ON TURF IS SO MUCH DIFFERENT. AND THAT'S TRUE EVEN FOR REGULAR THINGS. SO WHEN WE MAKE A LAW THAT, OR WHEN WE SUGGEST AN ORDINANCE THAT SAYS YOU HAVE TO DO X, Y, Z [01:00:01] OR GIVES YOU THE OPTION OF DOING X, Y, Z, AND WE'RE GONNA HAVE STANDARDS ON IT, DOES THAT OPEN US UP FOR ANY SORT OF LIABILITY FOR THAT SORT OF GRASP BECAUSE IT IS SOMETHING THAT WE'RE MAKING THEM DO? UM, NO. THAT WOULD SAY, UM, LIKE, WELL, TWO PART QUESTION. I'LL, I'LL BE CAREFUL AND ANSWER IT. UM, ANYTHING WE DO CAN HAVE LIABILITY, BUT DEPENDING ON WHAT THAT LIABILITY IS, WERE WE NEGLIGENT. UM, SO I WILL USE OUR SIDEWALK ORDINANCE AS AN EXAMPLE. WE REQUIRE SIDEWALKS, UH, WITHIN THE CITY. SIDEWALKS ARE, ARE NOT SOFT. IF YOU FALL ON A SIDEWALK, YOU'RE GONNA SCRAPE YOURSELF. YOU MAY BREAK SOMETHING. UM, WE ARE NOT LIABLE FOR THOSE ACCIDENTS NOW IF WE ARE LIABLE, ONLY IF WE ARE DUE TO NEGLIGENCE. SO IF WE KNEW A ROUTE WAS, WAS PUSHING UP A SIDEWALK FOUR INCHES ABOVE, ITS ITS PLANE AND WE HAD SOMEONE IN A CANE OR ADA OR, OR NOT JUST THE GENERAL PERSON THAT TRIPPED AND FELL AND THERE THIS SIDEWALK HAD BEEN THERE FOR YEARS AND THERE HAD BEEN COMPLAINTS AND YES, WE COULD POSSIBLY BE HELD LIABLE BECAUSE THEY WOULD'VE TO PROVE NEGLIGENCE. SO, UM, JUST REQUIRING SOMETHING OR ALLOWING IT BY CODE DOES NOT CREATE ANY ADDITIONAL LIABILITY. UM, BUT I, I ALSO NOT AN ATTORNEY, SO YOU MAY, MAY WANNA FOLLOW THAT UP WITH PAIGE AND WE CAN GET YOU AN ANSWER ON THAT ONE. BUT, UM, THAT'S GENERALLY THE WAY, THE WAY OUR ORDINANCES WORK. OKAY. IT'S STILL YOUR FLOOR. AND THEN I HAVE ONE LAST FOLLOW UP QUESTION, WHICH IS ABOUT THE, UM, DECRE OR ABOUT BRINGING THE, THOSE IN MORE, UM, HEAVY COMMERCIAL, UM, GROUP GROUPS INTO OUR LANDSCAPING, WHICH IS, I'M, I TAKE IT THE, I THE, WHAT I GOT OUT OF IT IS THE GOAL IS TO DECREASE IMPERVIOUS COVER IN THOSE AREAS, DECREASE IMPERVIOUS COVER IN THOSE AREAS, UM, AND, AND THEN DRESS IT UP A LITTLE BIT SO YOU, YOU CAN GET A LITTLE BIT OF BOTH ON THOSE, ON THOSE ORDINANCES. OKAY. OKAY. YEAH. UH, BUT I DID WANT TO GO BACK TO MR. CHASE'S. UH, WE UNDERSTAND THAT THAT, UH, RAINWATER COLLECTION CAN BE EXPENSIVE. UM, BUT THAT'S WHY WE DID NOT CHOOSE OR SPECIFY WHICH TYPE. SO IF THEY WANTED TO, TO UTILIZE, UH, YOU KNOW, A LESS COST EFFECTIVE, THEN, THEN THEY'D HAVE THAT OPTION. SO YEAH, WE USED IT IN ONE OF OUR AMENITY BUILDINGS CUZ IT MADE SENSE, BUT ANYWHERE ELSE DOESN'T MAKE SENSE, YOU KNOW? UH, COMMISSIONER KIN. THANK YOU. UM, SO I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT, LET'S SEE, SECTION 54, 11 B TWO D. SO THIS IS, UH, FOR ONE AND TWO FAMILY RESIDENTIAL PARCELS. MASONRY WALLS OR FENCES ARE REQUIRED ADJACENT TO COLLECTORS, ARTERIALS HIGHWAYS OR PUBLIC-PRIVATE PARKS. UM, WHO PAYS FOR THE MASONRY WALLS OR FENCES? THAT WOULD BE, UH, WHOEVER IS PUTTING THOSE IN. UM, SO THERE'S BEEN SOME DISCUSSION, UM, REGARDING SCREENING AND FENCING OF SENSITIVE FACILITIES. UM, SO OUR WATER TOWERS, PUMP STATIONS, LIFT STATIONS, UM, ALSO ALONG MAJOR THOROUGHFARES BECAUSE OF A SOUND ISSUE. UM, SO SOME OF OUR MORE RECENT, UH, UH, DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENTS, WE'VE ACTUALLY REQUIRED THOSE MASONRY FENCES ALONG LET'S SAY ONE 50 MAJOR ROADS. UM, AND, AND SOME OF THIS CAME OUT AS, AS IN OUR DISCUSSION, HEY, THIS CODE IS OPEN. HERE'S AN ISSUE THAT WE SEE, UH, MAINTENANCE OF PRIVACY FENCES ALONG ROADS, AND THEN ULTIMATELY THOSE PEOPLE THAT OWN THOSE PRIVACY FENCES COMING INTO THE CITY ASKING US TO CONSTRUCT A MASONRY FENCE BECAUSE OF THE SOUND OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. SO, UM, FOR CERTAIN AREAS WE FELT THAT, THAT MAYBE IT MAKES MORE SENSE TO ADD THAT IN THERE. UM, BUT THERE IS KIND OF A, A WAIVER IN THERE THAT THE DIRECTOR OF DEVELOPMENT SERVICES CAN WAIVE THAT REQUIREMENT. SO MAYBE, UM, ALONG BURLESON WHERE YOU HAVE, UH, EXISTING ESTABLISHED HOMES THAT ARE USING PICKET FENCES AND, AND, AND CHAIN LINK FENCES THAT IF THEY CAME FOR A FENCE PERMIT, WE COULD KIND OF LOOK AT THE AREA AND SAY, OKAY, WELL, WE'RE NOT GONNA REQUIRE A, A, YOU KNOW, A CONCRETE FENCE IN THIS AREA, WE'LL LET YOU STICK. BUT IF IT'S A NEW SUBDIVISION, INSTEAD OF US GETTING INTO THE, THE DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT AND TRYING TO NEGOTIATE THAT OUT, WE'RE JUST GONNA SAY, HEY, THIS IS OUR STANDARD ON MAJOR THOROUGH AFFAIRS. THIS IS, THIS IS WHAT YOU NEED TO PROVIDE TO YOUR RESIDENTS, UH, FOR THEIR LONG-TERM HEALTH AND AND MAINTENANCE OF, OF THE PROPERTY. AND FOR EXISTING HOMES, IT WOULD BE CASE BY CASE. YES, MA'AM. DECISION? YES. OBVIOUSLY, IF SOMEONE HAD THREE SIDE PICKET FENCE AND WANTED TO REPLACE ONE PORTION, YOU KNOW, WE'D KIND OF LOOK AT THE ENTIRE AREA AND SAY, OKAY, YEAH, THIS, THIS MAKES SENSE. UM, HONESTLY, IN SOME OF THESE CASES, SOME OF THESE QUICK CREEK, UM, STYLE FENCES ARE, ARE CHEAPER THAN, THAN WOOD PICKET FENCES. UM, MAYBE NOT THE LABOR, YOU KNOW, SOMEONE DOING IT THEMSELVES. IT MIGHT BE CHEAPER TO DO, UH, CEDAR, BUT FOR SOMEONE THAT'S BUYING ONE, THEY, THEY MAY FIND THAT THE COST IS NOT THAT MUCH DIFFERENCE, UM, VERSUS THE LENGTH OF THE, OR THE LIFE OF THE FENCE. [01:05:01] OKAY. UM, JUST A COUPLE MORE QUESTIONS. UM, 54, 11 B, WHERE AM I BEFORE I'M HOPPING AROUND BETWEEN FILES AND EVERY TIME I OPEN THE FILE, IT TAKES ME BACK TO THE VERY TOP OF IT. , SO B FOUR, B FOUR, B FOUR, SCROLLING. UM, I THINK I'M ON THE WRONG LINE. HANG ON, , BEAR WITH ME. UH, 54, 11 4 WAS THE, UH, PROHIBITATION OF VEGETATIVE SCREENING WALLS. UM, I TOUCHED ON THAT EARLIER. WAS THAT THE ONE YOU WERE LOOKING AT? NO, THIS WAS SOMETHING AROUND, UM, WELL ACTUALLY IT MIGHT BE, LET ME, NO, I THINK IT WAS HIGHER UP. I DIDN'T MAKE THIS UP. I SAW THIS SOMEWHERE. UH, OH. I CAN DO THE WORD SEARCH. THAT'LL HELP ME. UH, SIX. OKAY. OKAY. I FIGURED IT OUT. THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE. SO THIS IS SECTION B, SECTION ONE. UNDERNEATH THAT, WE DON'T ACTUALLY HAVE ANY CHANGES THERE, BUT IT, IT, IT'S JUST TALKING ABOUT WHAT IS REQUIRED TO BE SCREENED AND THEN BE BELOW IT IS THE APPROVED TECHNIQUE. SO, UM, WE'RE SAYING ALL OFF-STREET PARKING LOTS, SERVING FIVE OR MORE SPACES. AND THEN UNDERNEATH IS WHERE WE ARE SAYING, UM, WE, WE DON'T WANT TO HAVE VEGETATIVE SCREENS, LANDSCAPE BURNS, NATIVE VEGETATION, ET CETERA. SO THOSE WOULD NOT BE, I GUESS, APPROVED TECHNIQUES ANYMORE OFF STREETE PARKING LOT, SERVING FIVE OR MORE SPACES. WHAT IS THAT? IS THAT LIKE HEB IS GONNA HAVE TO GET A FENCE AROUND IT AND CHIPOTLE'S GONNA HAVE TO GET A FENCE AROUND IT? HOW, HOW DO WE DISTINGUISH WHERE THIS IS RELEVANT VERSUS WHERE IT'S NOT? SO TECHNICALLY IN THE CODE, THE, THE FEW SHRUBS YOU SEE AROUND H E B AND AND TARGET ARE ARE OFFSITE SCREENING. UM, UH, WE MAY HAVE TO HAVE SOME CONVERSATIONS ON THAT, BUT YES, THIS WOULD REQUIRE SOME TYPE OF, OF SCREENING FENCE. I DON'T THINK IT'S A SIX FOOT FENCE. UM, THAT WAS SOMETHING WE STRUGGLED WITH IN THE, IN THE CODE BECAUSE IT, IT REQUIRES THESE AREAS TO BE SCREENED UNDER THE NEW LANDSCAPING CODE. BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT, I DON'T KNOW THAT THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN IS THE WAY IT'S BEEN IMPLIED OR INTERPRETED OR, OR APPROVED. UM, IF YOU LOOK AT ANY OF OUR NEW DEVELOPMENTS, ANY OF THE, THE NEW BUILDINGS THAT ARE GOING UP, NEW RESTAURANTS, THOSE PARKING AREAS ARE, THEY'RE REALLY NOT SCREENED. UM, THEY'VE GOT A FEW SHRUBS. SO, UM, YOU KNOW, WE, WE MAY HAVE TO TWEAK THIS A LITTLE BIT TO COUNSEL IF Y'ALL HAVE SOME CONCERNS ON THAT, BUT, UH, IT'S BASICALLY, IT IS SAYING WHEN YOU'RE DOING REQUIRED SCREENING, UM, SO SAY AN APARTMENT COMPLEX NEXT TO RESIDENTIAL, THAT THERE'S A SECTION IN THE CODE THAT SAYS WHEN YOU HAVE THAT USE NEXT TO EACH OTHER, YOU HAVE TO PROVIDE A PRIVACY FENCE. UH, THIS CODE WOULD ALLOW YOU TO DO THE BERM IN THAT AREA. UH, WE'RE NOT GONNA ALLOW THAT. WE'LL SAY, NO, YOU JUST HAVE TO DO YOUR, YOUR NORMAL PRIVACY FENCE. SO THAT'S REALLY IN MY MIND WHERE THOSE, THOSE AREAS ARE. IF WE NEED TO CLARIFY THAT, THEN WE'LL MAKE A NOTE OF THAT. OKAY. UM, OKAY. SO GENERALLY THE REQUIRED SCREENING MOST OF THE TIME IS GOING TO BE FROM USE TO USE MORE INTENSE TO LESS INTENSE. OKAY. OKAY. I'LL PAUSE THERE. OKAY. YES, ? YES. ONE COMMENT I WOULD AGREE, UH, WITH OTHER COMMISSIONERS THAT I'VE GOT A VERY CLEAR CONCERN ABOUT ARTIFICIAL TURF FOR REASONS DESCRIBED. APART FROM THAT THOUGH, I'D LIKE TO GO TO, UH, 54 12. THAT'S TREES SEVEN B C, UM, THAT'S THE COLLECTION OF, UH, CONTRIBUTIONS FOR TREE REPLACEMENT. AND I'M NOT QUITE CLEAR EXACTLY WHAT THAT PROCESS IS AND WHAT THE ACTUAL FEES [01:10:01] ARE AND HOW THEY'RE LEVIED. AND WE CAME UPON, YOU KNOW, INSTANCE RECENTLY WHERE, UH, A DEVELOPER DID IN FACT HAVE TO MAKE A CONTRIBUTION, BUT THEN PROCESS WASN'T CLEAR AT ALL TO ME. SO, UM, CAN YOU HELP ME WITH THAT? YEAH. WE ARE NOT, UH, PROPOSING ANY CHANGES IN HERE. THIS CODE DOES NOT SPEAK TO A, A SPECIFIC STANDARD FEE. UM, UM, KAYLA, WE DON'T HAVE A FEE SET UP IN OUR FEE SCHEDULE DO WE FOR TREE REPLACEMENT TREES? UM, WE'LL NEED TO LOOK AT THAT. SOME CITIES ADOPT, UH, AS PART OF THEIR, THEIR TREE MITIGATION PROGRAM, THEY WILL SAY, YOU KNOW, MINIMUM TWO INCH CALIPER AND OR X AMOUNT OF DOLLARS PER INCH CAPPED AT SOME CAP THEM AT $2,000 FOR SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL. SOME, UM, CAP THEM SMALLER, SOME DON'T PUT ANY CAPS. IF IT'S A COMMERCIAL SITE AND THEY'RE CLEAR CUTTING IT, UM, WE'LL NEED TO LOOK. BUT, UH, MY UNDERSTANDING IS, IS THE LAST TIME WE'VE DONE REPLACEMENT TREES IS IT'S EITHER THE DEVELOPER IS ACTUALLY PHYSICALLY DONATING THE TREES TO PARKS, OR WE'RE FINDING A PLACE, OR THEY'RE GIVING CASH WITH A ESTIMATE SAYING, HEY, THIS TREE IS VALUED AT X AMOUNT OF DOLLARS, YOU CAN BUY TWO HERE. THIS IS, THIS IS THE FUNDS THAT WE'RE DOING THAT. IF WE WANNA LOOK AT SOMETHING MORE ROBUST THAT'S ACTUALLY PULLS OUT AND SAYS, HEY, FOR, UH, HERITAGE TREES, IF YOU REMOVE ONE, IT'S ACTUALLY THIS FEE TO, TO REPLACE IT VERSUS A COUPLE OF TWO INCH TREES AT THE PARK. OR IF YOU DO THIS, UM, WE'LL LOOK AT THAT. BUT THAT WASN'T THE KIND OF SCOPE OF WORK THAT WE WERE ASKED TO, TO LOOK AT ON THIS, THIS PROGRAM. IT REALLY WAS HOW DO WE KIND OF TRY AND REDUCE WATER USAGE? AND THEN A COUPLE THINGS POPPED UP, LIKE FENCING AROUND SECURE FACILITIES THAT, THAT BECAME AN ISSUE. SO WE, WE THOUGHT WE'D ADD 'EM THERE. I'D LIKE TO SEE THIS VISITED SOMETIME THOUGH. IT'S NOT WITHIN THE SCOPE OF WHAT WE'RE DISCUSSING TONIGHT THOUGH. OKAY. SO TREE, TREE MITIGATION SPECIFICALLY? MM-HMM. . YEAH. YEAH. OKAY. MM-HMM. . YEAH. THERE WAS SOME STATE LAWS ON TREE MITIGATION, I THINK IN, UM, 20 13, 20 14 TIMEFRAME THAT THAT KIND OF CAUSED CITIES TO, TO REVAMP THOSE SECTIONS OF CODE. HOW ABOUT ONE MORE QUESTION? UH, YES MA'AM. 54 FOR E. SO WE'RE REPLACING SHALL NOT WITH MAY, AND WE'RE REPLACING USED WITH AUTHORIZED. WHO'S AUTHORIZING DO WE NEED TO, DO WE NEED TO HAVE THAT SPECIFIED OR IN THE CODE? OR IS THAT ALREADY SITTING UNDER THE UMBRELLA OF SOMETHING IN THE CODE THAT I HAVEN'T READ THAT WOULD DICTATE THAT? UM, I'M SORRY, WHAT WAS THAT? 54. 54. FOUR E 54. FOUR E. UH, LET ME, LET ME OPEN UP THE RED LINE AND A LITTLE BIT OF CONTEXT THERE. SORRY. SURE. NO PROBLEM. 54 40. OH, YES. UH, SO WE'RE REPLACING SHALL NOT, UM, WITH MAY BECAUSE, UH, SHALLAL NOT IS, IS A PROHIBITIVE TERM. MM-HMM. UH, MAY IS DISCRETIONARY MM-HMM. . SO IT DOESN'T REQUIRE, UH, THEM TO USE IT. IT JUST ALLOWS IT AND THEN BE USED. WE UTILIZED AUTHORIZED, IT'S JUST BEING ALLOWED. IT'S NOT A SPECIFIC AUTHORIZATION BY, SAY THE DIRECTOR OF DEVELOPMENT SERVICES OR THE CITY MANAGER. IT'D BE THE CODE AUTHORIZES THEIR USE. UM, REALLY JUST KIND OF CLEANING UP SOME LANGUAGE ON, ON THE TERM USED. HMM. IT'S NOT AS SPECIFIC. IT WOULDN'T BE KAYLA OR I AUTHORIZING THIS CODE ITSELF AUTHORIZES THE USE OF THOSE. SO WHY WOULD WE NOT JUST SAY, IS AUTHORIZED MAY TO ME SAYS IT'S CONDITIONAL AND OBVIOUSLY IT'S CONDITIONAL. I'M MEETING THE, LIKE THE, THE REQUIREMENTS LAID OUT IN THE CODE, BUT MAY MAY BE AUTHORIZED TO ME, SAYS YOU HAVE TO GO GET SOMEONE TO AUTHORIZE IT. NO. MAY IS JUST, UH, THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT THE ATTORNEYS WANT US TO USE WHEN SOMETHING IS OPTIONAL BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT IT TO BE PERCEIVED AS EITHER PROHIBITED OR ALLOWED. UM, SO, UM, MAYS HAVE THEIR OWN DEFINITIONS IN THE LEGAL WORLD. UM, NORMALLY THEY'RE DEFINED IN OUR ZONING CODE. WE DO NOT DEFINE MAY SHALL AND OR, UM, AGAIN, ONE IS SEPARATE, ONE IS IN CONJUNCTION. SO WE WILL BE ADDING THOSE TO, TO ANY KIND OF FUTURE REWRITES WE DO. BUT, UM, IF YOU WANT TO CHANGE THE, THE LANGUAGE, WE CAN, I, I, I THINK AT THIS POINT, IT, IT, IT'S NOT GONNA CHANGE THE DEFINITION OR, OR ANY OF THE REGULATION, JUST INTERPRETATION OF IT. SO, UM, WE WOULD BE ABLE TO YOU TO CHANGE AUTHORIZED. YES. IF THAT'S, IF [01:15:01] THAT'S WHAT YOU WANT, YOU CAN PUT THAT IN YOUR MOTION. I DIDN'T KNOW IF THAT WAS LAWYER SPEAK FOR STUFF. YOU CAN LEAVE IT USED. YOU CAN. UH, I MEAN, IT'S JUST HOWEVER YOU WANT. THANK YOU. ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU. YES, SIR. SORRY, I HAVE ONE, ONE LAST QUESTION. UM, THAT JUST CAME FROM THE MAY, UH, THING, . UM, SO YOU SAID ON MAY, THERE IS A BIT OF DISCERNMENT OF, OF WHETHER YOU CAN USE IT OR WHETHER YOU WANT TO USE IT OR NOT USE IT. YES. WHO'S MAKING THAT DISCERNMENT AND HOW DO WE MAKE SURE THAT THAT DISCERNMENT FITS WITH WHAT THE CITY OF KYLE IS? THE, THE, THE APPLICANT MAKES THAT DISCERNMENT. OKAY. SO THE APPLICANT, THIS IS NOT, SO THIS IS NOT, UH, LET ME SEE A GOOD EXAMPLE. THIS IS NOT, UH, ME ASKING MY TEACHER, MAY I BE EXCUSED? MM-HMM. , I, I'M NOT ASKING FOR THAT PERMISSION. THIS IS MORE LIKE THE TEACHER SAYING YOU MAY USE THE RESTROOM AT YOUR LEISURE. SO THERE'S NO HAVING TO COME UP AND ASK, IT'S JUST, HEY, YOU CAN DO IT OR YOU CAN'T. IF YOU DO, YOU DO IT THIS WAY. AND SO THAT'S KIND OF A LITTLE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THOSE DEFINITIONS. HOPEFULLY I DIDN'T CONFUSE Y'ALL WITH THAT ANALOGY. AS A FOLLOW UP, SOMETIMES YOU'RE IN THE MIDDLE OF MATH LESSONS. OKAY. . SO SOMETIMES MAY NEEDS AN INTERVENTION. SO THERE'S NO WAY FOR THE CITY TO SAY YOU'VE DISCERNED IN ANY WAY THAT WE THINK IS INAPPROPRIATE FOR THIS SPECIFIC SITUATION. I DO NOT BELIEVE SO. UM, THIS IS VERY SPECIFIC TO SYNTHETIC PLANTS. SO AGAIN, UH, FROM, AGAIN, THIS IS A LEGAL DOCUMENT, SO WHEN YOU READ IT, YOU NEED TO REMEMBER THAT E IS IS A STANDALONE SECTION. SO SYNTHETIC PLANTS, UH, ARTIFICIAL LAWNS MAY BE AUTHORIZED IN LIEU OF PLANT REQUIREMENTS IN THIS SECTION. AND THEN THE SUBSECTIONS ARE THE ONLY WAY THEY CAN BE UTILIZED. SO YOU CAN DO THEM IF YOU MEET ALL THESE, IF YOU DON'T MEET ALL THESE, THEN YOU CAN'T DO IT. SO THAT'S KIND OF WHERE THE AUTHORIZATION COMES FROM, BUT IT'S NOT A SPECIFIC ONE PERSON THAT WOULD BE AUTHORIZING THAT. THANK YOU. OKAY. SO WE'VE, I THINK REACHED A POINT TO WHERE WE ARE NOW TASKED TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO CITY COUNCIL. UM, I'M SORRY, MULTIPLE, PROBABLY MULTIPLE WORDS. WELL, YEAH, WE, YEAH, ABSOLUTELY CAN. UM, SO, BUT I'M JUST SAYING IT'S UP TO US HOW WE, HOW WE DECIDE TO MOTION IT. IF WE DECIDE TO MOTION WITH A, WITH SOME EDITS, IT IS REALLY, UH, YOU GUYS ARE ABLE TO MAKE MOTIONS THAT YOU YES, SIR. MY RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE TO, TO MOTION EACH EDIT. CUZ IT SOUNDS LIKE THERE'S A FEW OUT HERE. I MEAN, I KNOW ONE EDIT I WOULD WANNA MAKE A MOTION FOR, INSTEAD OF PACKAGING INTO ONE LARGE MOTION OH, EACH, EACH OF OUR EDITS OR EACH OF THEIR EDITS NO. EACH, EACH OF OUR EDITS, WE MOTION THOSE. AND THEN THAT'S WHAT'S, SO AS AN EXAMPLE, NOT, NOT A, A MOTION. RIGHT. UH, MY MOTION WOULD BE RECOMMEND COUNSEL, REMOVE ARTIFICIAL TURF FROM THE LANDSCAPING. UM, UM, AND SCREENING REQUIREMENTS DOCUMENT. WE VOTE ON THAT NEXT EDIT. NEXT EDIT NEXT DAY. BECAUSE IF WE TRY TO DO ONE BIG MOTION, WE'RE GONNA HAVE A MASSIVE MOTION THAT HAS A WHOLE BUNCH OF, WELL, DIFFERENT EDITS OF IT. WELL, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF. WOULD YOU RATHER THAT WE DO SEPARATE MOTIONS FOR EACH RECOMMENDATION? OR WOULD YOU RATHER WE AS USING THIS LIKE A WORKSHOP? I, I I THINK WE HAVE TO TALK ABOUT THIS MORE LIKE A WORKSHOP. MM-HMM. GIVE YOU GENERAL CONSENSUS AND THEN MAKE A MOTION. I MEAN, IF WE REALLY WANNA BE SPECIFIC TO WHERE WE ARE DEAD SET ON BLANK. ABSOLUTELY. MAKE A MOTION. YEAH. I THINK IF WE WOULD'VE WOULD PREFER THIS LANGUAGE GET CLEANED UP. YEAH. I THINK WE CAN DEFINITELY DO THAT AS, AS LIKE A WORKSHOP. SO I WOULD PREFER, UM, ON THIS SPREADSHEET, THERE ARE 26 LINES OF EDITS. I PREFER WE NOT MAKE 26 MOTIONS . YEAH. YOU KNOW, IT'S, I AGREE. I'VE I'VE DONE THESE BEFORE. NOT WHAT I'M RECOMMENDING. I'M RECOMMENDING EDITS THAT WE HAVE SPECIFICALLY RIGHT. BROUGHT UP THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE. I HAVE SEEN, I HAVE SEEN A COUPLE WAYS TO DO IT. WE'RE BROKEN DOWN INTO 1, 2, 3, 4 SECTIONS. UH, WELL FIVE, IF YOU COUNT THE PURPOSE, I DON'T THINK ANYBODY HAD ANY ISSUES WITH THE PURPOSE. UM, YOU COULD GO THROUGH AND, AND, AND MAKE A MOTION ON EACH SECTION. UM, AND, AND EXAMPLE MOTION, UH, ON MAINTENANCE MOTION TO APPROVE THE PROPOSED CHANGES, UH, WITH THE FOLLOWING, UH, AMENDMENTS, UH, CLARIFY WHAT IS, UH, CONSIDERED NON-WORKING OR THE, THE FADING OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. OKAY. SO THE 54 DASH BLANK FOR THE ONES THAT WE HAVE CHANGES FOR, THERE'S FIVE [01:20:01] OF THEM IS WHAT WE'RE SEEING. SO, SO YOU'RE ASKING FOR CONSENSUS OR IN THEORY WE WOULD HAVE FIVE MOTIONS TO APPROVE 54 DASH 1 54 DASH 3 54 DASH FOUR. YOU COULD, OR YOU COULD KIND OF GO AROUND AND, AND SAY, UM, YOU COULD KIND OF DO ROLL CALL. LIKE CHASE IS SAYING, LOOK, RIGHT, I'VE LOOKED THROUGH THIS, I HAVE THESE FIVE THINGS I'D LIKE TO CHANGE AND, AND GO THROUGH AND THEN KIND OF SEE WHERE Y'ALL AGREE CUZ Y'ALL, Y'ALL MAY AGREE OR NOT AGREE ON SOME OF THOSE. RIGHT. SO I WOULD PERSONALLY RATHER TREAT THIS LIKE A WORKSHOP AND GIVE THEM GENERAL CONSENSUS. IF WE ARE DEAD SPLIT ON SOMETHING THOUGH LIKE HALF OF US LOVE ARTIFICIAL TURF AND HALF OF US DON'T, THEN YES, WE ABSOLUTELY CAN MAKE A MOTION, CAN VOTE AND DECIDE BY VOTE. BUT OTHERWISE I WOULD LIKE FOR US TO, IF OKAY. YOU KNOW, JUST WE CAN GO PERSON BY PERSON WOULD LIKE TO, THESE ARE THE CHANGES. I I, I'D LIKE TO APPROVE THIS WITH BLANK CHANGES. YEAH. AND THEN TO SEE IF WE CAN AGREE OR NOT IS WHERE I WOULD LIKE TO GO IF THAT'S, YEAH. I MEAN 5 54 0.1 IS PRETTY EASY. I DON'T KNOW THAT ANYBODY HAD ANY CONCERNS WITH THAT. RIGHT. UM, UM, 54 3. IF, IF Y'ALL WANT TO GO THROUGH AND LET US KNOW YOUR CONCERNS, HOLD ON. UM, I THINK WE JUST GO WITH, YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE SPECIFIC ITEMS YOU WANT TO SEE CHANGED, LET'S TALK, LET'S DISCUSS IT BETWEEN US. IF WE ALL AGREE ON A CONSENSUS. I THINK WE JUST DO THAT LIKE WE WERE TO WORKSHOP. YEAH. DO WE, UH, OKAY. EVERYONE CAN, IF Y'ALL DON'T MIND, I'M GONNA SIT DOWN SO I CAN START TAKING SOME PLEASE NOTES AND THEN YES SIR. IF Y'ALL HAVE QUESTIONS, JUST LEMME KNOW. UH, BUT YOU SAW THE FLOOR IF YOU'D LIKE TO. YEAH, SO MY ONE THING IS, IS THE ARTIFICIAL TURF. I, I PREFER NOT TO SEE THAT AS A, AS A MAY RECOMMEND POSSIBILITY. AND I'D LIKE TO SEE IT REMOVED. SO NO ARTIFICIAL TURF ALLOWED AT ALL? CORRECT. OKAY. DO WE, DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY THOUGHTS ON THAT? UH, DO WE WANT TO HAVE THAT AS A GENERAL CONSENSUS OR, I MEAN, YOU, YOU, YOU DON'T HAVE TO JUST DISAGREE. IF YOU AGREE, YOU CAN SPEAK UP TOO. IT'S REALLY YOUR I AGREE. I AGREE. THE MATERIAL AND INSTALLATIONS ARE TOO, UH, SKETCHY OVER TIME, I THINK TO, UH, SUPPORT THAT. OKAY. UM, IT SEEMS LIKE THAT IS THE GENERAL CONSENSUS, SO I WILL, I'LL WANT YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. SO, UM, OKAY, SO I'LL MAKE NOTES OF THIS TOO IN CASE WE NEED TO PUT IN THE MOTION RE REMOVING ARTIFICIAL TRIP. THANK YOU. DOES ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANY CHANGES THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE TO THIS AS WE RECOMMENDED OR NOT TO CITY COUNCIL? YES SIR. YES. UNDER, UH, PLANNING CRITERIA SECTION 54 4 E THREE, ALL SYNTHETIC PLANTS OR ARTIFICIAL LAWNS MUST BE MAINTAINED IN GOOD WORKING CONDITIONS SHALL BE REPLACED AS NEEDED. I WOULD LIKE TO GO TO THE SPECIFICITY OF COLOR, DURABILITY AND UV RESISTANCE QUITE SPECIFICALLY IN THE LANGUAGE SO THAT, UH, NOBODY IS, UH, MISTAKEN ABOUT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IN TERMS OF GOOD WORKING CONDITION. I'M SORRY, YOU SAID 54 DASH FOUR E 3 54 DASH E THREE? MM-HMM. . OKAY. THANK YOU. YOU SAID COLOR, COLOR, DURABILITY AND UV RESISTANCE. I DON'T THINK THAT THEY CAN, HMM. I DON'T THINK THAT THEY CAN REQUIRE THAT. YOU MENTIONED THAT THAT'S SOMETHING YOU CANNOT REQUIRE, CORRECT? WELL IT'S, THAT'S LIKE PICKING A BRAND. IF YOU SAY IT'S GOTTA BE UV RESISTANT X, YOU'RE NOW AND ONLY ONE COMPANY DOES UV RESISTANCE X THAT YOU'RE NOW SAYING YOU HAVE TO BUY A SPECIFIC PLAN NOW. I THINK WE COULD, I THINK WE COULD COME UP WITH SOME LANGUAGE TO GET A LITTLE MORE SPECIFIC THAT SAYS, YOU KNOW, MORE GENERAL IN NATURE THAT SAYS, UM, FADED, DISCOLORED. MM-HMM. , UNKEPT BROKEN, YOU KNOW, UH, YEAH. THE, THE CODE REALLY HELPS US ON THIS SIDE TO BE MORE VAGUE BECAUSE WE CAN'T LIST ALL THE WAY SOMETHING CAN BE MESSED UP. UM, AND SO IF, IF IT, IF WE GO OUT AND, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO KEEP YOUR FENCES, PROPERTY MAINTENANCE CODE SAYS GOOD WORKING CONDITION. IF YOU HAVE ONE PICKET THAT'S HANGING OUT, IT'S NOT DEFINED IN THE CODE, BUT WE CAN STILL GO UP TO THE CODE OFFICER AND, AND MAKE THAT CLAIM. SO WE CAN PUT SOME LANGUAGE IN THERE, BUT I, I DON'T THINK WE CAN GET REAL SUPER SPECIFIC ON THAT. YES. . OKAY. AND THAT'S, IF THAT STAYS IN BECAUSE WE'VE JUST, I I'M HEARING A THREE TO TWO THAT WE DON'T WANT THE TURF. YEAH. TURF AND PLANTS IN THERE. SO THAT SECTION MAY NOT BE REQUIRED EITHER, BUT IF IT, IF COUNCIL DOES [01:25:01] KEEP THE TURF, THEN WE'LL HAVE SOME LANGUAGE THAT THAT BACKS THAT UP. WAIT, WAS THE, WHEN YOU SAID THAT IT INCLUDED THE PLANTS, I DON'T THINK ANY OF US WERE HAD, WE HAD JUST SAID THE SYNTHETIC GRASS. OH, OKAY. IS THAT CORRECT? OKAY. YES FOR THAT? YEAH. THAT, THAT'S WHAT THE ORIGINAL THING WAS ABOUT. OKAY. THE SYNTHETIC GRASS, UH, UM, SYNTHETIC PLANTS, I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THAT IS. ARE, ARE DIF WELL, YOU KNOW, PLANTS, THIS IS LIKE HOBBY LOBBY STUFF OR, UM, NO STANDARDS. UM, I, I GUARANTEE YOU SOME OF Y'ALL HAVE BEEN TO A VERY NICE HOTEL AND DIDN'T REALIZE SOME OF THOSE PLANTINGS IN THERE WERE FAKE , BUT WAS IT INDOORS? I'M TRYING TO PICTURE LIKE OUTDOOR IN AND OUT FAKE PLANTS MOST OF THE TIME WHEN THEY'RE OUTDOOR. UM, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU, ANY OF Y'ALL ARE GOING TO DISNEY THIS SUMMER. IT'S VERY LUSH AND GREEN CUZ IT'S FLORIDA. BUT YOU, YOU LOOK, THERE'S SOME THAT ARE THERE FOR CERTAIN REASONS WHETHER TO HIDE AN AC VENT AND EXHAUST. UH, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, THEY ARE THERE, BUT, UH, AGAIN, WE'RE NOT TELLING PEOPLE WHERE THEY HAVE TO PUT IT. WE'RE JUST GIVING 'EM SOME OPTIONS, SO. GOTCHA. OKAY. SO I THINK WE'RE ON AGREEMENT ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THE, THE REMOVING OF THE TURF. WE'RE ALL IN AGREEMENT ON, UM, THE LANG CLEARING UP OR HAVING A BIT STRONGER LANGUAGE ON THE FADING AND REPLACING OF SYNTHETIC PLANTS. GOOD. ARE THERE ANY OTHER EDITS WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE BEFORE WE APPROVE OR BEFORE WE MAKE A RECOMMENDATION FOR COUNCIL TO APPROVE? YES MA'AM. HELLO. UH, SO RAINWATER HARVESTING SYSTEMS, UM, I REALLY JUST, I HATE SEAS OF PARKING LOTS. SO THIS PARKING MULTIPLIER RATIO, PARKING RATIO MULTIPLIER OF 1.75. I WOULD LIKE TO SEE, I DON'T KNOW, STAFF MAYBE TRY TO COME UP WITH SOME ALTERNATIVE INCENTIVE THAT DOESN'T GROW PARKING. UM, BUT COULD STILL FUNCTION AS AN INCENTIVE. MAYBE THERE'S NOTHING AVAILABLE, BUT I'D AT LEAST LIKE TO HAVE A CONCENTRATED EFFORT TO TO LOOK INTO THAT. YES, PLEASE GO AHEAD. I WANNA, YEAH, I WANNA SECOND THAT. I THINK THAT IT'S KIND OF INTERESTING THAT WE ARE IN A SITUATION IN WHICH WE ARE SAYING LIKE, YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO LIMIT PARKING IN SOME SPACES, BUT LIKE OVER HERE YOU CAN GET AN INCENTIVE THAT LIKE YOU CAN THEN BOOST YOUR PARKING. UM, I THINK THAT KIND OF SENDS A MIXED SIGNAL AND IT'S NOT SUPER EFFECTIVE. UH, AND I THINK IF WE'VE ARE BEEN ON THE GRIND OF LIKE, WE WANT TO MAKE IT TO WHERE IT'S JUST LIKE LESS PARKING LOTS DOING THIS INCENTIVE KIND OF CAUSES THE ABILITY FOR YOU TO REVERSE THAT. AND I THINK THAT'S NOT GOOD. I'M NOT GONNA DIE ON MY SWORD HERE, BUT I, I AGREE WHAT YOU SAID EARLIER IS THAT YOU CAN ACTUALLY OFFSET THE ADDITIONAL PARKING, UM, ENVIRONMENTALLY BY COLLECTING MORE RAINWATER, ET CETERA, ET CETERA. BUT, UH, I'M FINE BY THE WAY. YEAH, WELL, I MEAN, I KIND OF DISAGREE WITH THIS. YOU KNOW, I, I LIKE THE IDEA OF, YOU KNOW, IF, IF, IF THEY DO WANT SOMETHING SPECIFIC, THERE IS A TRADE OFF FOR IT, THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE AN INVESTMENT IN THIS INSTEAD. I'D LIKE TO BE ABLE TO GIVE THEM THAT OPTION. SO I ACTUALLY LIKE THIS IN THE CODE. SO THIS IS ONE THING THAT I THINK WE MIGHT BE DISAGREEING ON. I WONDER IF WE TIGHTEN IT UP A LITTLE BIT MORE AS TO WHAT THE ACTUAL INCENTIVE IS, OR I'M SORRY, WHAT THE REQUIREMENTS ARE BECAUSE RIGHT NOW YOU SAID THE REQUIREMENTS ARE PRETTY LOOSE. THEY COULD PUT A AC CONDENSER PIPE DOWN AND IT, YOU KNOW, WATERS THREE PLANTS. YEAH. YEAH. SO I WONDER IF, I MEAN, IF WE'RE GONNA GO THAT ROUTE THEN I WOULD SAY THE MOTION WOULD NEED TO INCLUDE, UM, AT LEAST A, A PERCENTAGE OF, OF THE TOTAL IMPERVIOUS COVER OF THE SITE. UM, IT GET, IT GETS A LITTLE TRICKY IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE WHOLE SITE VERSUS THE ROOFTOP. UM, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN HAVE SMALL BUSINESSES HAVE A VERY FOOT BUILDING FOOTPRINT, BUT LARGE PARKING AREA AND, AND VICE VERSA. SO I, I WOULD SAY IF WE CAN TIE IT TO MAYBE THE PERCENTAGE OF THE IMPERVIOUS COVER, THAT MIGHT BE THE BEST WAY TO DO THAT. BUT THAT, THAT'S JUST, I'M KIND OF SPITBALLING AT THIS POINT RIGHT NOW. I THINK THAT ALSO HITS YOUR RAINWATER ASPECT OF IT TOO. CAUSE I THINK THAT LIKE, I DON'T DISAGREE THAT GIVING THEM ANY OPTION ISN'T REALLY GOOD OR A TRADE OFF. I JUST DISAGREE WITH THE PARKING BEING THE TRADE OFF. YEAH. LIKE THAT'S THE THING THAT I DON'T WANT TO SEE INCREASED. SO WE KEEP THE INCENTIVE BUT ADD LANGUAGE THAT THEY MUST COLLECT A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE OF THAT IMPERVIOUS COVER. I MAYBE, I THINK YOU'RE A THREE TO TWO RIGHT NOW CUZ I'M WITH ALEX. I I'M NOT GONNA, I'M NOT GONNA GONNA DIE OUTTA THE WAY I THINK, [01:30:01] I THINK WE'RE IN THE MINORITY WE'RE LOSING THIS. WHICH, BUT BECAUSE IT, IT SOUNDS LIKE, YOU KNOW, THIS ISN'T A MIDDLE GROUND TYPE OPTION. YEAH. LIKE, YOU KNOW, I, I MEAN, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT IT, WOULD YOU BE OKAY WITH LESS INCREASE OF PARKING? WAS IT THE NUMBER OF PARKING OR JUST THAT PARKING IS INCREASING AT ALL PARKING PERIOD? YEAH, THAT, THAT'S A PRETTY HARD LINE STANCE. AND SO I DON'T KNOW IF WE'RE GONNA HAVE A MIDDLE GROUND YEAH. BETWEEN THESE, UM, AND WE HAVE FIVE MEMBERS HERE TODAY. SO THREE PEOPLE MAKES THE DECISION. UM, SO I DON'T, I WOULD NOT REMOVE THIS PERSONALLY, BUT IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO REMOVE IT, THAT IS SOMETHING IN OUR RECOMMENDATION WE CAN BECAUSE, UH, YEAH. I, I I DON'T, I DUNNO IF THERE WOULD BE A, PEOPLE ARE TALKING ABOUT A DIFFERENT INCENTIVE. I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THAT WOULD BE. IT SEEMS LIKE WE'RE EITHER GONNA REMOVE THIS OR WE'RE NOT. I WILL SAY WE DID LOOK AT MULTIPLE OTHER OPTIONS, UM, KIND OF WALKED THEM THROUGH. UM, RIGHT. ULTIMATELY, UH, OUR, OUR CARRIER IS PARKING. I MEAN THAT'S, YEAH. THERE, THERE'S NOT MUCH. I MEAN, THE OTHER THING THAT WE COULD GO FOR IS AN INCREASE IMPERVIOUS COVER, WHICH, YOU KNOW MM-HMM. , IT INCREASES THE BUILDING SIZE. YOU COULD LESSEN YOUR SETBACKS. BUT THAT ALL, I MEAN THEY'RE, THEY'RE ALL VERY MUCH TIED TOGETHER AND THAT I THINK THAT'S, THAT'S THE ISSUE. UNLESS THERE WAS SOME TYPE OF WAIVER OR FEE UP FRONT, UM, YOU KNOW, HEY, YOU'RE, YOU'RE BUILDING PERMANENT INSPECTION FEES, 50%, YOU KNOW, IF YOU INSTALL THIS RIGHT. BUT THAT MAY FINANCIALLY DESTROY THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT. LIKE IF EVERYBODY WANTS THAT AND IT'S A, YOU KNOW, A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS REVIEW FEE AND WE'RE GIVING OUT 50%, UH, I THINK IF YOU GUYS HAVE HAVE SPECIFIC IDEAS, LET US KNOW AND WE'LL LOOK AT THAT. OR IF YOUR MOTION IS JUST TRY AND FIND OTHER OPTIONS FOR P AND Z MAYBE, OR FOR COUNCIL TO CONSIDER. MAYBE THAT'S THE REAL OBJECTIVE IN MOST OF THIS THOUGH, IS WATER. YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO NOT HAVE, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T USE ARTIFICIAL SO WE CAN SAVE WATER. SO IF WE WERE TO REQUIRE A CERTAIN PERCENTAGE, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU ACTUALLY CAN DO THAT CERTAIN PERCENTAGE OF, OF, OF THE WATER TO BE, TO BE, TO CATCH. I MEAN THAT WILL MEET THIS GOAL WE HAVE OF THIS ENTIRE DOCUMENT AS TO HELP WITH WATER CONSERVATION. AND THAT'S REALLY WHAT WE'RE TRYING TO DO HERE. I KNOW SEEING A LITTLE BIT LARGER OF A PARKING LOT WILL ANNOY RESIDENTS AND, YOU KNOW, AND ABSOLUTELY THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO WILL NOT LIKE THAT. BUT THE REAL GOAL WE HAVE HERE IS TO CONSERVE WATER. MM-HMM. , I, I THINK THIS IS A GOOD OPTION, BUT, UM, REALLY THIS IS A, YEAH, THIS IS SOMETHING WE HAVE TO DECIDE ONE OR THE OTHER. CAUSE I DON'T THINK WE'RE GOING TO COME TO A MIDDLE GROUND UNLESS THE MIDDLE GROUND IS OKAY. WE CAN KEEP IT. BUT THEY HAVE TO HAVE, THEY ACTUALLY HAVE TO HAVE SOME ACTUAL METRICS OF WHAT KIND OF, WHAT THEY CATCH OR WHAT THEY USE. I MEAN, GO AHEAD, COMMISSIONER STEWART. YES. UM, ONE OF THE CONCERNS I HAVE IS THAT I, I CERTAINLY AM NOT IN FAVOR OF HAVING MORE PARKING JUST BECAUSE THEY PUT UP A THOUSAND GALLON TANK AND YOU COULD DO THAT THE WAY THIS IS. I JUST DON'T SEE THAT AT ALL. IT'S, IT'S A CHEAP PERFORMATIVE VIRTUAL SIGNALING, WHATEVER YOU WOULD WANT TO CALL IT KIND OF EFFORT. IT'S MEANINGLESS. UM, WHAT I'M GET CONCERNED ABOUT IS THAT GIVEN THE, THE ROOF SPACE OF ANY PARTICULAR BUILDING, YOU CAN CALCULATE GIVING AVERAGE RAINFALL WHAT THAT ROOF WILL PRODUCE IN TERMS OF WATER COLLECTION. SO IT SEEMS TO ME THE TECHNICALITY HERE IS ACTUALLY REQUIRING A STORE OR COMMERCIAL OPERATION OR MULTI-USE, UM, ACTUALLY PROVIDES SOME CALCULATED AMOUNT OF WATER, YOU KNOW, THAT THEY, UH, NOT WATER, BUT CALCULATED SURFACE, UM, COLLECTION TO, TO BE ABLE TO, UH, TO PARTICIPATE IN ANYTHING LIKE THIS. BECAUSE OTHERWISE YOU'RE GONNA HAVE, UH, ONE GUTTER, 1000 GALLON TANK THAT'S FILLED IN A HALF AN HOUR. IT'S NOT EVEN USEFUL FOR IRRIGATION ON THE LANDSCAPE. IT JUST DOES NOT. UM, SO I, I THINK WE'RE KIND OF, I WANNA SEE THIS VERY MUCH, BUT I JUST DON'T THINK WE'RE IN THE GAME OF DESCRIBING TO DEVELOPERS WHAT THEY NEED TO DO AND WHAT WE'RE OFFERING AND WHAT WE WANT. UM, OKAY. THANK YOU. UH, YEAH, I MEAN, IF ANYONE ELSE HAS A MIDDLE GROUND OPTION, YOU, YOU THINK YOU'D LIKE TO GIVE, GREAT. OTHERWISE, I THINK WE SHOULD DECIDE IF WE [01:35:01] ARE THREE TO TWO. YES. I, I WOULD SAY IF, WHAT IF YOUR, IF YOUR CONCERN IS, IS ADDITIONAL PARKING AND NOT ENOUGH RAINWATER, UM, YOU KNOW, ONE OF YOUR RECOMMENDATIONS CAN BE IS JUST, HEY, WE WANT TO ENCOURAGE RAINWATER. UM, WE'RE NOT WILLING TO GIVE UP EXTRA PARKING. UM, SO STAFF, WE WANT YOU TO GET RID OF THE INCENTIVE AND, AND WE CAN GO BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD AND, AND FIND ONE AND JUST PUT LEAVE IN THE CODE THAT RAINWATER IS ENCOURAGED. RIGHT. UM, I, AGAIN, I YEAH, WE HAVEN'T SEEN ANYBODY CAN PUT ONE IN AT ANY POINT AND, AND NO ONE HAS, UM MM-HMM. AND THIS IS JUST RECOMMENDATION COUNCIL CAN VERY WELL OVERRULE US. EITHER WAY WE GO ON THIS, THAT'S ALL IT IS, IS A RECOMMENDATION. YEAH. THAT SHARE. CHASE, DID YOU STILL HAVE SOMETHING? YEAH, I, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, UM, IF YOU CAN DETERMINE A PERCENTAGE BASED ON, OR THE AMOUNT OF WATER YOU CAN COLLECT BASED ON THE SURFACE AREA OF THE ROOF, UM, THEN, YOU KNOW, I THINK YOU CAN TIE A PERCENTAGE TO THAT BASED ON THE SQUARE FOOTAGE OF THE, OF THE BUILDING. SO, YOU KNOW, LIKE AN ACADEMY SPORTS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IT'S A PRETTY BIG BUILDING THAT'S A LOT OF STORAGE THEY WOULD HAVE TO PUT IN TO, TO DO THAT. SO SOMETHING IN THAT SIZE, I WOULD SAY 25%, SOMETHING SMALLER LIKE WHAT WE JUST APPROVED, THE WAFFLE HOUSE, YOU KNOW, A HUNDRED PERCENT COLLECTION. UH, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE METRICS ARE THAT WOULD, WHAT I WOULD ASK STAFF TO LOOK AT SAY, OKAY, WHAT, WHAT ARE THOSE METRICS TO THIS, BUT WHAT, WHAT YOU MENTIONED WELL MAKES, MAKES SOME SENSE. WELL, I WILL, I WILL SAY I WOULD RECOMMEND AGAINST THE ROOF CATCHMENT, UM, ROOF SIZE AND SQUARE FOOTAGE. I MEAN, ARE, ARE WE TALKING A, A FLAT ROOF OR WE TALKING, UH, YOU KNOW, A A 12 ON TWO? ARE WE TALKING, YOU KNOW, THOSE PITCHES, THOSE VELOCITIES MM-HMM. , ALL OF THOSE FACTOR INTO THOSE CHANGES. IF YOU'RE SAYING WE NEED TO CAPTURE A HUNDRED PERCENT OF THE ROOF WATER AND USE IT FOR IRRIGATION TO GET THAT PERCENTAGE, THAT MAY HAVE UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES ON OUR STORM WATER DRAINAGE. UM, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO BE THE SAME AS DAMNING YOUR STORM WATER. YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO DO THAT. YOU HAVE TO LET SOME OF IT GO. SO I, I MM-HMM. , I'D BE MORE HESITANT TO, TO TIE IT TO THE ROOF. OKAY. I WOULD, I WOULD HAVE BE MORE COMFORTABLE JUST TYING IT TO, IF YOU WANT FIVE EXTRA SPACES AND THAT'S X AMOUNT OF SQUARE FEET, YOU HAVE TO CATCH X AMOUNT OF SQUARE FEET. MM-HMM. . SO IT'S MORE OF AN OFFSET PLUS A PERCENTAGE, OR YOU HAVE TO CATCH A LITTLE BIT MORE. I WOULD, I WOULD HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT A HUNDRED PERCENT CATCHMENT. I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT WOULD BE LEGAL ACTUALLY. LIKE I SAID, I'M NOT AN EXPERT. I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW. UM, I, I DON'T KNOW. YEAH. NO. MR. CHAIR, I THINK YES, WE, WE, YEAH. I THINK, I THINK WE'RE ALL IN FAVOR OF, OF ENCOURAGING PEOPLE TO CATCH RAINWATER. SO, YOU KNOW, AS YOU SAID, LEAVING THAT LANGUAGE IN IS PROBABLY THE WAY TO GO. THE QUESTION IS, DO WE WANNA REMOVE THE INCENTIVE OR DO WE WANNA RECOMMEND THE INCENTIVE TO COUNCIL, ARE WE STILL THREE, TWO THAT WE DO NOT WANT TO RECOMMEND THIS INCENTIVE TO COUNSEL? I, I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE WERE. ARE WE STILL ALL THERE? ANYONE CHANGE THEIR MIND IN THE PAST FEW MINUTES? ALRIGHT, SO I THINK YES, UH, I, AS YOU'RE WRITING DOWN NOTES OF WHAT WE'RE RECOMMENDING, IT SOUNDS LIKE WHAT WE RECOMMEND IS TO LEAVE THE LANGUAGE IN THAT SAYS, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD LIKE FOR YOU TO KEEP COLLECTING RAINWATER, BUT RE BUT WE RECOMMEND TO REMOVE THE INCENTIVE FOR PARKING SPACES. OKAY. WAS THERE ANY OTHER ITEMS WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE CHANGED ON THIS DOCUMENT BEFORE? YES, MA'AM. , I'M SORRY. UH, SO GOING BACK TO ONE OF THE LINES WE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER, THE MAY BE AUTHORIZED, I PROPOSE THAT WE REVERT AUTHORIZED BACK TO THE ORIGINAL LANGUAGE OF USED JUST TO ELIMINATE ANY CONFUSION ABOUT, OH, WE HAVE TO GET THIS BROUGHT BEFORE A BODY TO GET APPROVED. CHANGE. CHANGE, YES. OR KEEP THE WORD USED INSTEAD OF CHANGING ITS AUTHORIZED. YES. DOES ANYONE DISAGREE WITH THAT? I, I I THINK THAT'S PERFECTLY FINE. OKAY. UM, DID THAT INCLUDE THE WORD, DID THAT, SO THAT WOULD, WOULD THAT CHANGE THE WORD MAY IN IT THEN? NO. OR WOULD KEEP MAY. OKAY. MAYBE USED THIS AS MAYBE AUTHORIZED. RIGHT. UM, UH, 54, 11 B TWO D, THIS WAS ABOUT THE, THE FENCES, UM, FOR THE SINGLE OR DOUBLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES. SO, UM, I WOULD LIKE THE LANGUAGE HERE TO BE KIND OF REFINED A LITTLE BIT TO SPECIFY THAT MAYBE IT'S NEW BUILDS WHERE THEY HAVE TO DO THE MASONRY WALLS OR FENCES. I DON'T WANT ANYBODY WHO'S IN THEIR HOME AND THEY'RE HAPPY THERE TO BE LIKE, [01:40:01] OH, GREAT, NOW I HAVE TO CHANGE MY, MY YARD, OR I HAVE TO BUILD A FENCE OR DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT. IF THEY'RE HAPPY IN THEIR HOME AND THE NOISE DOESN'T BOTHER THEM, I DON'T SEE WHY IT'S THE CITY'S BUSINESS TO, TO ASK THEM TO CHANGE THAT. SO I, I WILL LIKE TO, TO PUSH BACK A LITTLE BIT ON THAT. UM, JUST BECAUSE THE CODE, THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN, GIVES US THAT AUTHORIZATION. UM, IF WE USE THE TERM NEW BUILDS, UM, WE HAVE A LOT OF VACANT LOTS HERE IN THESE AREAS. UM, IF WE USE THE TERM NEW BUILDS AND THEY GO GROUND UP, THEN WE WOULD HAVE TO REQUIRE THEM TO, TO UTILIZE THE, THE MASONRY. WELL, RIGHT NOW WE'RE SAYING IT'S REQUIRED ADJACENT TO COLLECTORS, ARTERIALS, HIGHWAYS AND PUBLIC PRIVATE PARKS. YES. SO RIGHT NOW, THAT'S A VERY YES. I MEAN, THAT COVERS EVERYTHING REQUIRED. WE PULL UP, UM, WHAT IS THAT? WELL, IF THEY'RE GOING TO CHANGE SOMETHING, THEY'RE HAVE TO TEAR DOWN THEIR CURRENT FENCE AND PUT THAT UP. IT DOESN'T SAY THAT THOUGH. THAT'S WHAT I'M WANTING US TO DO. LIKE, IF YOU'RE ALREADY HAPPILY SETTLED IN YOUR HOME, WHY WOULD YOU HAVE TO MAKE IT CHANGE? BUT ALL CODE CHANGES WE, WE MAKE ARE GOING TO APPLY TO SOMEONE ASKING FOR A FUTURE. OH. SO THIS, THIS ISN'T SOMETHING WHERE THEY COULD GO AROUND AND SAY, OH, THE CODE SAYS THAT YOUR FENCE ISN'T IN GOOD CONDITION, SO NOW YOU HAVE TO GO FIX YOUR FENCE. SO WE CAN STILL DO THAT. WHETHER THIS LANDSCAPING ORDINANCE IS ADOPTED OR NOT, THAT'S A PROPERTY MAINTENANCE CODE. UM, SO IN THE BUILDING CODES, THE INTERNATIONAL BUILDING CODE SERIES, WE HAVE THE I P M C, UM, BASICALLY SAYS YOU HAVE TO KEEP YOUR PROPERTY IN GOOD WORKING ORDER. PART OF THAT IS FENCING BECAUSE THAT'S A SECURITY ISSUE. UM, NOT JUST FOR YOUR SAFETY, BUT FOR YOUR NEIGHBOR SAFETY. UM, SO WE COULD GO RIGHT NOW AND, AND START TAGGING PEOPLE FOR, FOR THIS. WHAT THIS IS, IS YOU ARE RIGHT, THIS IS MOSTLY FOR NEW RESIDENTIAL SUBDIVISIONS THAT COME ONLINE. UM, SAGE HOLLOW IS, IS A GOOD EXAMPLE. UM, BUT I DON'T WANT TO USE THE TERM NEW BUILD BECAUSE THEN THAT QUALIFIES IT ON, RIGHT. ON OTHER HOUSES. UM, I WANT TO, UM, I'M SORRY, WHAT SECTION WAS THAT AGAIN? JUST I WANT TO FIND, UM, 54, 11 B TWO D 54 11 FOR ONE OR TWO FAMILY RESIDENTIAL PARCELS, MASONRY WALZER FENCES ARE REQUIRED ADJACENT TO COLLECTORS, ARTERIALS HIGHWAYS OR PUBLIC PRIVATE PARKS. YES. SO THAT'S WHY THE LAST SENTENCE IS, IS KEY FOR US, UH, FOR UNIQUE CIRCUMSTANCES, DIRECTOR PLANNING OR DESIGNEE MAY WAIVE THIS REQUIREMENT. THAT THAT'S WHAT GIVES US THE ABILITY TO, TO SAY, OKAY, UH, THE PERSON DOWN HERE THAT'S SURROUNDED BY WOOD FENCES, THEY COME IN FOR A FENCE PERMIT, OR WE SEND CODE OUT THERE AND THEY SAY, HEY, HEY, YOU NEED TO REPLACE YOUR WHOLE FENCE. ALL FOUR SIDES ARE HANGING IN THE RIGHT OF WAY. AND THEY COME BACK AND ARE LIKE, WELL, I DON'T WANT TO DO MASONRY. THAT'S WHERE WE CAN SAY, OKAY, LET'S LOOK AT YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD. LET'S, LET'S, WHAT IS THE MATCH? UM, SAY WILL WAS JUST HAD IT OUT FOR THAT PERSON WAS LIKE, NO, WE'RE GONNA MAKE YOU DO A CONCRETE FENCE. WELL, THEY CAN APPEAL THAT DECISION TO THE ZBA OR, OR COUNCIL. BUT, UM, THAT'S THE KEY FOR THAT IS, IS GIVING THAT EXCEPTION WITHOUT IT IS JUST VERY DIFFICULT TO REQUIRE SOMETHING AND, AND ACROSS THE BOARD FOR LIKE NEW BUILDS. AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE AN EXCEPTION LIKE THIS, THEN IT APPLIES FOR EVERYONE. BUT THERE'S SO MANY UNIQUE SITUATIONS THAT WE LOOKED AT AROUND TOWN THAT, THAT WE ARE JUST LIKE, OKAY, IF WE WORD IT THIS WAY, THEN ALL THESE PEOPLE ARE GOING TO HAVE TO DO IT. SO THAT'S WHY WE ADDED THAT. I, I THINK THAT REALLY DOES COVER YOUR CONCERN ON, ON WHAT WE COULD MAKE SOMEONE DO. UM, IF YOU WANT US TO KIND OF LOOK AT CLEANING THAT UP, THEN WE'D BE GLAD TO DO THAT. BUT I, I I THINK WE'RE COVERING YOUR, YOUR CONCERN IF IT'S ABOUT FORCING KIND OF THE ONE-OFF PERSON TO HAVE TO REPLACE THEIR FENCE WITH CONCRETE. WELL, SO IF WE THINK ABOUT, UM, THE ZONING CHANGE THAT WE DID EARLIER, EARLIER THIS EVENING, UH, ALONG ONE 50, I'M ASSUMING THAT WOULD BE A ROAD THAT'S RELEVANT HERE. COLLECTOR ARTERIAL KIND OF THING. THERE ARE RESIDENTIAL ROAD, LIKE RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES FACING ONTO ONE 50. IF THEY HAVE A FENCE RIGHT NOW IN FRONT OF THEIR HOME, THE WAY THIS IS WRITTEN, ARE THEY GONNA HAVE TO DO ANYTHING? ARE THEY GOING TO HAVE TO ASK FOR AN EXCEPTION OR ARE THEY GOING TO JUST CARRY ON AS THEY CURRENTLY ARE? NOTHING IS GONNA HAPPEN. I DON'T WANT PEOPLE TO HAVE TO, LIKE, THEY WON'T NEED TO KNOW THAT THEY HAVE TO ASK FOR AN EXCEPTION. SO, UM, WE'LL U I'LL USE TWO DIFFERENT SCENARIOS. NEIGHBORS ON THAT AREA. IF ONE PERSON COMES IN AND SAYS, HEY, MY FENCE IS FALLING DOWN, I WANNA REPLACE IT, THEN THAT WOULD BE A A A LIKE FOR LIKE, UM, SO WE WOULD JUST SAY, OKAY, THIS, THIS HOUSE WAS PERMITTED, THESE WERE THE RULES YOU'RE REPLACING AND YOU CAN DO THIS. SAY THE NEXT PERSON CAME IN AND A TORNADO [01:45:01] TOTALLY TORE DOWN HIS, HIS FENCES, IT WASN'T HIS CHOICE. UM, AT THAT POINT, LIKE I SAID, IF, IF, IF WILL LOOKS AT IT, HE'LL GO, LOOK, YOUR NEIGHBORS ARE WOOD, YOU'RE GONNA DO WOOD. UM, YOU DON'T NEED TO DO CONCRETE. UM, IF WILL TOOK THE STRICT STANCE WAS LIKE, HEY, IT CAME DOWN, IT'S ALL GONE. IT'S KIND OF LIKE A NON-CONFORMING USE. YOU CAN'T COME BACK WITH A PICKET, WE'RE GONNA MAKE YOU DO CONCRETE. THERE'S STILL THE OUT FOR THAT PERSON TO HOPEFULLY WILL WOULDN'T MAKE THAT CALL, BUT THERE'S THE OUT FOR THEM TO DO IT. UM, WITHOUT THIS IN THERE, IF, IF SAGE HOLLOW CAME IN AND JUST SOME, SOMEBODY WANTED TO BUILD ALL ALONG THAT AREA, WE WOULD HAVE TO NEGOTIATE TO GET A, A CONCRETE SOUNDPROOF FENCE. SO WE WOULD PREFER TO ADD IT IN THERE. I, LIKE I SAID, I THINK, I THINK YOUR CONCERNS ARE COVERED IN THE CODE. UM, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT I CAN SAY FOR A CERTAIN, LIKE, HEY, EVERYBODY'S JUST GONNA BE LEFT ALONE. I MEAN, THERE MAY BE SOME AREAS WHERE WE SAY, HEY, EVERYBODY ALONG THIS STREET HAS A CONCRETE FENCE, YOURS CAME DOWN. UM, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO COME BACK WITH WITH THE MATCHING KIND OF DEAL. AND AT THAT POINT, THEY'RE, THAT'S WHY WE HAVE APPEAL PROCESSES FOR, FOR ZBA AND PEAS AND P AND Z. AND THE SAME THING IS TRUE OF THE VEGETATIVE SCREENING, CORRECT? THAT WELL, WELL, PEOPLE MIGHT HAVE VEGETATED SCREENING NOW. I MEAN, AS FAR AS BUSINESSES OR SUCH, WE'RE NOT GONNA SAY, OKAY, IT'S NOT ALLOWED ANYMORE. TAKE THAT ALL THE VEGETATIVE SCREENING AND PUT UP ACTUAL FENCES. YOU KNOW, UH, UM, IT'S, I MEAN, IF THERE IS AN ISSUE, IF THERE IS NO SCREENING, YOU KNOW, IF, IF THESE KIND OF CODE PROBLEMS HAPPEN, YES. BUT WE DON'T NECESSARILY, IF THINGS ARE WHERE THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE, JUST BECAUSE WE CHANGED OUR RULES DOESN'T MEAN EVERYONE HAS TO TAKE OUT WHAT THEY HAVE AND THEN REPLACE IT AUTOMATICALLY. CORRECT. I MEAN, WE, IF WE CHANGE A LAND USE, WE DON'T, WE ALLOW THOSE EXISTING STRUCTURES TO STAY, WHETHER THEY'RE NON-CONFORMING USES OR ACTUALLY NON-CONFORMING STRUCTURES. UH, SO CAN WE JUST ADD LANGUAGE THAT SAYS IF IT, IF IT'S A LIKE, FOR LIKE REPLACEMENT THAT WE CAN, WE CAN ADD THAT, I MEAN, I'M THINKING LIKE AN HOA, RIGHT? IF YOU WANT TO PAINT YOUR HOUSE THE SAME COLOR, TYPICALLY THEY DON'T SAY, OKAY, YOU STILL GOTTA COME IN AND RIGHT. SUBMIT FOR IT. JUST PAINT IT THE SAME COLOR IT IS AND HAVE A GOOD DAY. UM, I'M WONDERING IF WE CAN ADD SOME LANGUAGE IN THERE AND THAT SHOULD HOPEFULLY ASSUAGE CONCERNS THAT NOW YOU'RE GONNA BE FORCED TO, TO CHANGE YOUR FENCE. EVEN IF A TORNADO HIT IT, THEN IT'S, IT'S NOT PUTTING IT ON THE DIRECTOR OF PLANNING TO MAKE THIS CALL. IT'S, IT'S IN THE ORDINANCE THAT IF IT'S A LIKE, FOR LIKE REPLACEMENT, IT'S A LIKE FOR LIKE, AND OKAY, MOVE FORWARD. OKAY. YEAH. THIS IS, UM, SOMETHING THAT I DID NOT REALIZE. I THOUGHT WE WERE GOING TO BE ASKING PEOPLE TO GO BACK AND LIKE CHANGE THEIR EXISTING PROPERTY. SO I'M, NO, I WAS LOOKING AT A LOT OF THESE THINGS LIKE, OH MY GOSH, EVERYONE'S GONNA HAVE TO BUILD LIKE A FENCE AND RIP OUT THEIR LANDSCAPING. . WE LIKE OUR JOBS. WE DON'T, WE OKAY. WE WOULDN'T DO THAT. OKAY. SORRY. WE'D LOVE TO, I I AGREE WITH COMMISSIONER. UM, CHASE ON, ON HIS IDEA THERE. THANK YOU. I, I I I THINK WE WE HAD THAT CONSENSUS. YEAH, I THINK, YES. OKAY. UM, SO THE ITEMS YOU'VE TALKED ABOUT SO FAR, THE REMOVING TURF FROM THE RECOMMENDATION TURF, BAD PLANTS. GOOD. I'M YES. TURF. YES. UM, ADD LANGUAGE ON COLOR, DURABILITY. YES. UM, UH, FADING. UM, AND THEN MAYBE JUST BROKEN OR MATERIAL TYPE. YES. UM, WE'RE GONNA LEAVE RAINWATER HARVEST SCENE SYSTEMS IN. BUT YOU'RE RECOMMENDING THAT WE REMOVE THE INCENTIVE? UM, YES. YES. WE'RE GONNA KEEP THE WORD, UH, USED AND NOT UTILIZED. AUTHORIZED. AND THEN WE'RE GONNA ADD LANGUAGE, UH, FOR REPLACEMENT OF LIKE MATERIALS, UM, VERSUS NEW BUILDS ON THE ONE TO TWO FAMILY. GOOD. THANK YOU'ALL. UM, YES MA'AM. COMMISSIONER KIN, YOU'RE READY TO GO HOME. I KNOW. UM, NATIVE VEGETATION, THIS WILL BE MY LAST THING. I, I COULD GO ON. Y'ALL SHOULD BE GRATEFUL. I'M GONNA STOP HERE. , UM, NATIVE VEGETATION, SO EXISTING VEGETATION SHALL BE PROHIBITED FOR USE AS REQUIRED SCREENING. DEMONSTRATING SIGNIFICANT VISUAL SCREENING CAPABILITIES MAY FULFILL THE REQUIREMENTS OF THIS ARTICLE. SO IN THE COMMENTS THAT YOU PROVIDED, YOU SAID, WELL, WE DON'T WANT TO DO NATIVE VEGETATION BECAUSE IN THE CASE OF AN EXTREME DROUGHT, GIVE A NUMBER. OH, YES. UM, 50 54 OBVIOUSLY 54 11 6 B SIX OH, IS IT B THREE B? B YES. 54. 11 B SIX. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. UM, SO WE'RE SAYING WE DON'T WANNA LEAVE EXISTING VEGETATION BECAUSE AT SOME POINT IN TIME THERE MAY BE A DROUGHT AND [01:50:01] THEN YOU DON'T HAVE THE SCREENING ANYMORE. UM, TO ME THIS IS A, THIS IS A HABITAT, IT'S AN ECOSYSTEM. AND IF IT FUNCTIONS, WELL, NINE YEARS OUT OF 10, EIGHT YEARS OUT OF 10, SEVEN YEARS OUT OF 10, SIX YEARS OUT OF 10, FIVE YEARS OUT OF 10, I PERSONALLY DON'T THINK THAT IT SHOULD BE PULLED OUT TO HAVE A FENCE INSTALLED. I, I WOULD RATHER KEEP EXISTING VEGETATION FOR HABITAT FOR, UM, HEAT ISLAND EFFECT, ALL THAT STUFF, ALLOWING ANIMALS TO PASS THROUGH BUTTERFLIES, BEES, ANYTHING THAT CAN FEED ON THE EXISTING VEGETATION IF THERE IS ALREADY SOMETHING THERE. AND IT CAN FUNCTION AS A SCREEN JUST BECAUSE ONE DAY IT MIGHT NOT FUNCTION AS A SCREEN. I THINK IT'S, I THINK THIS LINE IS OVERKILL PERSONALLY. SO I'LL SAY THAT. I AGREE. BUT IN THE INTEREST OF THIS IS ABOUT REDUCING WATER USAGE, IT MAKES SENSE TO REMOVE VEGETATION THAT REQUIRES EXCEPTIONS OF WATERING TO, TO BE ABLE TO MAINTAIN IT. SO I MEAN, I MEAN THE WHOLE POINT OF THIS IS TO REMOVE TO, WELL, EXISTING VEGETATION. IF YOU'RE TAKING AN EMPTY LOT WHERE THERE'S PROBABLY NOTHING GOING ON AND YOU HAVE SOME NATURAL TREES OR SOMETHING THERE, THERE'S SCREENING. IT PROBABLY DOESN'T HAVE AN IRRIGATION SYSTEM ALREADY INSTALLED THERE. IT'S ESTABLISHED, IT'S ALREADY THERE. WOULD THEY HAVE TO DO ADDITIONAL WATERING IF IT'S NATURALLY, I'M THINKING ABOUT OPAL LANE. I KNOW THAT'S NOT IN THE CITY LIMITS, BUT I DRIVE ON THAT ROAD ALL THE TIME AND THERE'S BEAUTIFUL NATIVE TREES RIGHT UP ALONG THE ROAD THAT HUGS YOU AS YOU DRIVE DOWN IT AND IT'S BEAUTIFUL. AND RIGHT NOW THEY'RE BUILDING, UH, A SUBDIVISION BACK IN THERE AND THEY'VE KEPT THIS WALL OF TREES. AND I MEAN, YOU CAN STILL KIND OF SEE THROUGH IT, BUT IT'S STILL A BEAUTIFUL SPECIAL PLACE IN OUR CITY AND I DON'T WANNA SEE THINGS LIKE THAT GET KNOCKED OVER BECAUSE IT'S NOT ALWAYS GOING TO BE GREEN ENOUGH OR THICK ENOUGH TO, TO SCREEN THE USE BEHIND IT. I, I DON'T THINK THAT'S WHAT THE CODE IS SAYING. IT'S SAYING THAT YOU CAN'T PLANT NEW NATIVE LANDSCAPE. EXISTING VEGETATION SHALL BE PROHIBITED FOR USE IS REQUIRED SCREENING. THAT'S WHAT THE WORD SAYS. I'M NOT SAYING THAT IT HAS TO BE BETWEEN NOW. YEAH. UM, THIS, AND AGAIN, THIS IS NOT FOR ANY SCREENING. THIS IS FOR YOUR STATUTORILY REQUIRED SCREENING BETWEEN USES. SO, UM, THAT THE SITUATION YOU'RE DESCRIBING WORKS REALLY WELL, RESIDES WERE GOING IN, THERE'S BAR TREES, MAYBE THEY'RE THICK ENOUGH TO, TO BE SEEN, UH, BUT REPLACE THAT RESIDENTIAL USE NOW WITH, UH, AN INDUSTRIAL USE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE DOING CHEMICALS. THERE'S A SMOKE STACK. UH, THERE ARE SOME TREES THERE. AND THAT LANDOWNER SAYS, WELL, WE'VE GOT 10 OAK TREES. I'M GONNA PLANT FOUR MORE AND THERE'S MY SCREEN. YOU KNOW, THAT THAT'S IT. IT'S THE KIND OF THAT ISSUE. IF THEY WERE TO COME IN AND SAY, HEY, YOU HAVE TO DO SCREENING, UM, RESIDENTIAL TO RESIDENTIAL DOESN'T REQUIRE SCREENING. SO THEY COULD PUT IN A FENCE BETWEEN THE TREES HOWEVER THEY WANTED. UM, IT, IT IS REALLY, WE ARE REALLY TALKING THOSE SITUATIONS WHERE YOU HAVE SOMETHING BEING BUILT NEXT TO SOMETHING ELSE THAT TRIGGERS, THAT REQUIRES SCREENING FENCE. UM, IF YOU WANT TO PUT SOME LANGUAGE THAT SAYS, YOU KNOW, EXISTING TREES MUST BE KEPT BUT UH, DOES NOT QUALIFY AS A SCREENING, WE COULD STRENGTHEN THAT UP. BUT THAT GETS INTO MORE OF THE TREE REMOVAL ORDINANCE SECTION. UM, AND AGAIN, SOMETIMES WHAT YOU SEE IS PEOPLE WILL GO, THEY'LL LOOK AT A SITE AND GO, HEY, THERE'S THIS NICE STOCK OF TREES, WE COULD DO THIS HERE. NO ONE WILL EVER SEE ITEM. THEN THEY BUILD IT, THEN THEY SUBDIVIDE AND THEN THEY SELL AND THEN THEY CLEAR CUT AND NOW YOU'RE REQUIRED SCREENING FOR THAT ONE IS GONE. SO WE'RE TRYING TO DEFINITELY, WE'RE NOT TRYING TO GET IN SITUATIONS WHERE WE'RE FORCING PEOPLE TO CUT DOWN TREATIES. WE'RE JUST KIND OF GETTING INTO SITUATIONS WHERE IF YOU DRIVE DOWN AND, AND YOU SEE AN AREA AND YOU SEE, YOU SEE A BUNCH OF TREES, YOU'RE LIKE, OH YEAH, THAT'S PERFECT. THAT THAT SCREENS IT FOR ME. THAT MIGHT NOT BE THE CASE. SO IT'S LIKE THE ITEM WE, WE WERE AT, WE WERE AT EARLIER, UH, YOU KNOW, VICE CHAIR CHASE WAS CONCERNED ABOUT RETAIL SERVICES GOING IN NEXT TO HOMES. THAT RETAIL SERVICES THEN PERSON COULDN'T THEN JUST SAY, OH, WELL THERE'S SOME NATURAL VEGETATION ALREADY TO SCREEN BETWEEN ME AND THOSE HOMES. BETWEEN THAT USE AND THE OTHER USE, THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE AN ACTUAL SCREENING. I I WILL SAY THIS, THIS SECTION VERSUS THE, THE OTHER TWO. IF, IF Y'ALL HAVE SOME CONCERN THAT MAYBE THERE'S SOME, SOME AREAS THAT COULD BE UTILIZED, UM, YOU COULD RE MAKE A RECOMMENDATION THERE BE PASSING LANGUAGE THAT DEVELOPMENT DIRECTOR, YOU KNOW, OF, OF NOW TO DO THAT, IF THAT HELPS YOU PROTECT IT. BUT I THINK, AGAIN, LONG TERM, UM, I JUST DON'T KNOW HOW VIABLE THOSE AREAS [01:55:01] ARE. I'VE DONE THIS 15 YEARS AND I CAN ONLY THINK OF ONE SPOT WHERE NATURAL SCREENING WORKED. UM, BUT IT WAS BAMBOO AND, AND, AND IT WAS, THE NEIGHBOR'S YARDS WERE RUINED. SO, I MEAN IT JUST, IT IT, YOU KNOW, PLANTS ARE UNIQUE. AND WHAT DID THIS SECTION SAY BEFORE THE AMENDMENTS? BECAUSE THE WAY, THE WAY I SEE IT, IT RIGHT NOW IT JUST SAYS SIX NATIVE VEGETATION, EXISTING VEGETATION AND THEN THERE'S A SECTION AND THE BLUE UNDERLINE, WHICH I THINK IS NEW TEXT. AND THEN THERE'S A RED UNDERLINE. SO NATIVE VEGETATION, THE, I THINK THE RED, THE UNDERLINE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE RED CROSSED OUT. YEAH. A STRIKE THROUGH. YES. SO THE RED WAS DELETED TO SAY, DEMONSTRATING THAT IT HAD THESE, THESE CAPABILITIES, IT COULD COUNT. AND NOW WE'RE JUST SAYING, WELL, EVEN IF IT HAS THE CAPABILITIES, WE'RE NOT GONNA DO IT. WELL, AND IT, IT DIDN'T SAY IT WOULD COUNT. IT SAID IT MAY COUNT, IT MAY MAY COUNT. SO WE MAY NOT, THAT'S THE LEGAL WORK. WE MAY NOT EVEN HAVE ALLOWED IT AT THAT POINT. SO I, FOR THIS ONE, I WOULD PREFER THAT WE JUST MAKE NO CHANGE AND WE LEAVE IT AS IT WAS ORIGINALLY STATED, EXISTING VEGETATION. VEGETATION, UH, IF IT DEMONSTRATES CERTAIN CAPABILITIES, MAY A UPON APPROVAL OF THE, OF THE CITY KIND OF CASE BY CASE, ALLOW IT TO STAY. I'LL AGREE WITH THAT. LEAVE. THAT'S TWO GUYS. IS ANYBODY ELSE ? SORRY. I MEAN YOU'RE KIND OF DOING THE SAME THING. YOU'RE JUST REVERSING IT THE OTHER WAY. UM, I WAS SAYING WE COULD ADD SOME LANGUAGE THAT SAY, HEY, THIS MAY BE ALLOWED IN CERTAIN, OKAY. WAIT. AND SHE'S MORE LIKE, I MEAN HOLD ON. IF WE KEEP SIX NATIVE VEGETATION, IS IT REALLY FAIR TO STRIKE FOUR AND FIVE? YES. OKAY. , I GUESS, UM, I DON'T KNOW. I, I WOULD STRIKE 'EM ALL, BUT THAT'S, THAT'S ME. UM, AND WAIT, SO WE'RE ONLY STRIKING? NO. OKAY. FOUR AND FIVE ARE STILL GETTING, ARE STILL STRUCK. SO, OKAY. SO WE'RE, WE'RE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SIX, KEEPING IT AS NATIVE VEGETATION, EXISTING VEGETATION DEMONSTRATING SIGNIFICANT VISUAL SCREENING CAPABILITIES MAY FULFILL THE REQUIREMENTS OF THIS ARTICLE. BUT FOUR AND FIVE WE'RE KEEPING NO, NO. FOUR AND FIVE WE'RE KEEPING THEIR CHANGES. OKAY. FOUR AND FIVE GOING AWAY. THAT'S WHAT THEY ASKED FOR US TO DO. YEAH. YEAH. TO GO AWAY. SO, UM, I THOUGHT IF WE'D KEEP ONE, WE KEEP 'EM ALL, BUT WE'RE ONLY GONNA KEEP SIX. WE'RE WE'RE AGREEING WITH STAFF TO STRIKE FOUR AND FIVE. I THINK IT GIVES STAFF MORE DISCRETION. YEAH. ON SIX. CUZ YOU HAD MENTIONED YOU USING HIS NAME IN VA CUZ HE IS NOT HERE. BUT YOU HAD MENTIONED WILL CAN TELL THEM IN THAT INSTANCE. WELL NO, YOU CAN KEEP THE TREES BUT IT ACTUALLY DOESN'T SAY THAT. IT SAYS IT SHALL GO AWAY. SO CUZ THAT LAST LINE WAS ACTUALLY SUPPOSED TO BE REDLINED, NOT WAS DELETED, NOT, NOT STAYING RIGHT. RIGHT. SO GETTING RID OF THE SHALL KNOT. NO, I WAS SAYING WE COULD ADD SOME LANGUAGE THAT LIKE WE DID TO THE WELL THEN WHY NOT JUST KEEP THE LANGUAGE CUZ IT'S STILL DOING THE SAME THING. RIGHT. AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS, I WAS THINKING IT'S, YEAH, WE'VE GOT THE SAME PLACE. WE JUST TOOK TWO DIFFERENT ROUTES. YEAH, WE OPENED THE SHOT. . ALL RIGHT. . SO, ALL RIGHT STEPH. UM, DO YOU HAVE A MOTION? HAVE NO, DO YOU HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT OUR DIRECTION IS? I THINK WE'VE GONE, I I WILL REPEAT THOSE AND THEN ANY MOTIONS THAT WANT TO APPROVE COULD, COULD INCLUDE, UM, AS WITH THE EXCEPTIONS AS STAFF. SO PLEASE. SO, UM, UH, YOU'RE RECOMMENDING TO STRIKE ALLOWANCES FOR ARTIFICIAL TURF, BUT ALLOW ARTIFICIAL PLANTS YOU'D LIKE US TO ADD, UH, COLOR, UH, FADING, UH, DURABILITY AND MAINTENANCE REQUIREMENTS TO, TO TIGHTEN UP THAT LANGUAGE. UM, YOU WOULD LIKE TO KEEP THE RAINWATER HARVESTING SYSTEMS LANGUAGE IN THERE, BUT YOU WOULD LIKE TO REMOVE THE INCENTIVE. WE WILL KEEP THE WORD USED AND NOT UTILIZE AUTHORIZED, UH, SINGLE FAMILY AREAS FOR NEW BUILDS. WE WILL ADD LANGUAGE ON FENCING FOR, UH, REPLACEMENT OF LIKE MATERIALS AND THEN RECOMMEND NUMBER SIX ON NATURAL VEGETATIVE SCREENINGS SHOULD STAY AS IS WITHIN THE CODE. THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE? DOES ANYONE DISAGREE WITH ANY OF THAT? I THINK, I THINK THAT VERY WELL ENCOMPASSED WHAT WE WERE TRYING TO SAY. YES. UM, ALRIGHT, NOW THAT WE'VE REACHED THIS POINT, MR. CHAIR. YES SIR. MAY I MAKE A MOTION PLEASE? ? UH, I MAKE A MOTION TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO CITY COUNCIL TO, UH, APPROVE THE AMENDMENTS TO CHAPTER 54 LANDSCAPING SCREENING REQUIREMENTS, INCLUDING THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT THE [02:00:01] PLANNING IS OKINE COMMISSION JUST MADE. SECOND. THANK YOU. IT'S BEEN MOTION BY VICE CHAIR SHAY, SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER JAMES. IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT MOTION? THANK YOU FOR YOUR PATIENCE. THAT'S ALL. YES, YES. THANK YOU FOR GETTING THROUGH THAT. OKAY. UH, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. ALL OPPOSED. MOTION PASSES. [A.   Discussion only regarding Planning and Zoning Commission request for future agenda items. ] ITEM NUMBER SEVEN, GENERAL DISCUSSION SEVEN. A DISCUSSION ONLY REGARDING PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION REQUEST FOR FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS. COMMISSIONER JAMES? YEAH, ACTUALLY, UH, I WOULD LIKE TO, UM, BECAUSE OF THE DISCUSSION WE HAD ABOUT, UH, THE GETTING THE UM, C P WITHOUT LANDSCAPE, I WAS WONDERING MAYBE IN A FUTURE TIME CAN WE TIGHTEN THAT UP TO WHERE WE DON'T RECEIVE C TO THAT LANDSCAPES. THANK YOU. ARE THERE ANY OTHER ITEMS WE'D LIKE TO DISCUSS ON FUTURE AGENDAS? ALL RIGHT, WE'RE GONNA MOVE ON TO ITEM NUMBER [A.   Staff Report by Jason Lutz, Senior Planner.   Discussion regarding requested planning definitions.  ] EIGHT, A STAFF REPORT EIGHT, A STAFF REPORT BY, UH, JASON LUTZ, UH, SENIOR PLANNER. UH, YES. UH, THANK YOU AND THANK YOU FOR TURNING THAT ON WHEN I TALKED TO . UM, GREAT, GREAT. CAUGHT US. UM, SO THE, UH, UH, PACKET HAD, UH, SOME PLANNING DEFINITIONS FOR Y'ALL. Y'ALL REQUESTED THOSE A COUPLE MEETINGS BACK. UM, WE DID TWO ROUTES WE KIND OF WENT THROUGH ON A SPREADSHEET AND KIND OF THREW SOME, SOME TERMS WE THOUGHT YOU GUYS SHOULD KNOW, MAYBE SOMETHING YOU SEE A LITTLE BIT MORE, UM, IN OUR NECK OF THE WOODS. UM, BUT THEN, UM, WHEN YOU'RE TRYING TO DECIDE WHICH DEFINITIONS ARE MOST IMPORTANT TO PLANNING FOLKS, IT'S REALLY HARD TO NOT INCLUDE EVERYTHING. SO WE FOUND THAT OTHER DOCUMENT AND WE'RE LIKE, WELL, LET'S, LET'S THROW THAT THEIR WAY ALSO. BUT IF WE MISS SOMETHING, IF THERE'S SOME TERMS, UM, THAT YOU WANT TO SEE SOME HOUSE BILLS THAT MAYBE YOU WANT US TO ADD TO IT, UM, UH, JUST SHOOT US AN EMAIL. WE'LL, WE CAN KEEP THIS AS A, AS A RUNNING DOCUMENT UPDATED AS WE NEEDED TO. UM, AND THEN JUST GIVE YOU AN UPDATE. UM, UH, ONE OF THE OTHER ITEMS YOU WANTED TO BRING BACK WAS THE MXD MINIMUM LOT SIZE. I BELIEVE THAT'S TWO ACRES. UM, WE ARE PLANNING ON BRINGING THAT TO YOU. UM, IT WILL NOT PROBABLY BE AT THE NEXT MEETING, NOR THE SECOND MEETING AFTER THAT. UM, IT'LL TAKE US SOME TIME TO WORK THROUGH. UM, WE WANT TO COME TO YOU ALL WITH PLENTY OF EXAMPLES TO SHOW YOU, OKAY, IF IT GOES TO THIS, THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS. IF IT GOES TO THIS, THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS. JUST SO EVERYBODY CAN KIND OF UNDERSTAND THAT. SO, UH, DIDN'T WANT Y'ALL TO THINK WE FORGOT ABOUT Y'ALL. WE ARE, WE ARE WORKING ON THAT. SO THANK YOU. IS THAT ALL? THAT'S IT FOR ME, SIR. OKAY. UM, I HAVE ONE THING I'D LIKE TO SAY. UM, BACK AT THE END OF LAST YEAR, I COMPLETED MY MASTER'S DEGREE AT THE, UH, START OF THIS YEAR. I BEGAN A NEW JOB AND, UM, I WILL BE MOVING CLOSER TO THAT JOB. THE NEXT MEETING WILL BE MY LAST MEETING, SO I WILL BE HERE FOR ONE ADDITIONAL MEETING, BUT I WILL BE LEAVING PLANNING AND ZONING AFTER THAT BECAUSE I WILL BE OUTSIDE OF THE CITY LIMITS AND I'LL BE UNABLE TO CONTINUE ON IN THIS ROLE. I HAVE LOVED THIS ROLE SO MUCH. I'M THANKFUL TO EVERY, THE COUNCIL FOR PUTTING ME HERE. I'M THANKFUL TO YOU ALL FOR ALLOWING ME TO LEAD, BUT I AM SAD TO SAY I WILL BE, UH, THE NEXT MEETING WILL BE MY FINAL MEETING. ALL RIGHT. ON THAT NOTE, UM, ITEM NUMBER NINE, ADJOURNMENT. I'D LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN. SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? WE ARE ADJOURNED. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.